B. Hayes

[prhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 10:55:41 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

His hook may be more automatic, though. Hibbert had more moves but I'm not sure he was that locked in on the hook.

Best hook under JT3! Roy didn't use as much as Hayes. It's a weapon and an NBA ticket. If Hayes can score three or four hooks a game, make his FTs at 75% and make his bunnies, he'll average double digits easily.

[prhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 16:54:30 GMT -5 aleutianhoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 16:45:46 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Perfect use by JT3 instead of exposing his players to foul trouble or using a White or Derrickson, when he has Trey! We'll see how much he plays in conference, but Tournament history has shown that our bigs get into foul trouble. Another experienced option would be fantastic.

But this is the crux of it. No one argues about those scenarios. The issue is what to do in the following: We are playing Villanova. Big game. Brad plays the first ten minutes and is playing great. No foul issues. No turnovers. Etc. Coach puts in Jesse. And, lo and behold, he plays great too! We now have five minutes left in the first half of a tie game with Villanova. Stick with Jesse? Go back to Brad? Of throw Trey out there?

Me? Either door one or two works. But playing Trey there makes no sense. It could well cost us the game. Might not. But there's a clear option available with far less risk.

Mine is an extreme example of course, but I think your position has to be to play Trey there. Or else it falls apart logically.

No, under that Nirvana scenario, you stay with Bradley and Jessie. But, how many times does that happen in a competitive game? No foul trouble and both playing great? In the case of cupcakes and blowouts, you experiment with Trey and the rest if the starters for around 5 mpg. He'll end up averaging that and playing more than 2/3 of the games. But, most importantly, when the refs go crazy in March, you have a slightly experienced option to go to.

[prhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 17:01:54 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 16:54:30 GMT -5 aleutianhoya said:

But this is the crux of it. No one argues about those scenarios. The issue is what to do in the following: We are playing Villanova. Big game. Brad plays the first ten minutes and is playing great. No foul issues. No turnovers. Etc. Coach puts in Jesse. And, lo and behold, he plays great too! We now have five minutes left in the first half of a tie game with Villanova. Stick with Jesse? Go back to Brad? Of throw Trey out there?

Me? Either door one or two works. But playing Trey there makes no sense. It could well cost us the game. Might not. But there's a clear option available with far less risk.

Mine is an extreme example of course, but I think your position has to be to play Trey there. Or else it falls apart logically.

No, under that Nirvana scenario, you stay with Bradley and Jessie. But, how many times does that happen in a competitive game? No foul trouble and both playing great? In the case of cupcakes and blowouts, you experiment with Trey and the rest if the starters for around 5 mpg. He'll end up averaging that and playing more than 2/3 of the games. But, most importantly, when the refs go crazy in March, you have a slightly experienced option to go to.

EDIT: I see you edited your post while I was typing to include this:

Dec 9, 2015 16:54:30 GMT -5 aleutianhoya said:

I will now return to my promise to ignore this thread....

We'll see.

[rockhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 16:41:12 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 15:22:25 GMT -5 rockhoya said:

Also, he's pretty much had the most professional success of a post player that we've had since Monroe.

Sims?

At their respective levels in development (I.e rookie campaign) Jish hit the ground running harder than Henry and there is still some basketball to be played. Not saying he's gonna have a better career but he has the opportunity ahead of him.

[dreamhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 9:53:02 GMT -5 Cambridge said:

Dec 8, 2015 22:25:07 GMT -5 dreamhoya said:

Does anyone think that Hibbert's a ton > than Hayes?

Is this for real? Have we reached peak Hayes delusion?

I'm not saying that I think that just a poll ?

[dreamhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 14:24:46 GMT -5 This Just In said:

Dec 9, 2015 13:12:20 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

I think the statistics contradict that Smith was "not good at all." I think the problem is that your argument benefits from hindsight.

As of 2013, the only real problem with Smith was that he was overweight and not conditioned. He remained academically eligible at UCLA. He was eligible out of high school, he always came across well in interviews, and he obviously had raw talent. In that context, why wouldn't you give somebody a second chance?

Do you consider the Josh Smith experiment an success?

i think jtiii did as good a job as any college coach could have. I could be wrong, but i do think jtiii did a good job, Josh is just....Josh

[dreamhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 7:19:26 GMT -5 dense said:

Dec 8, 2015 22:23:26 GMT -5 dreamhoya said:

Maybe it's not those things, or part of those things. And when JTIII says he had a coach that just didn't play him, maybe he's right...sometimes coaches get into a routine with the players they envision in certain roles within the system they teach ....sometimes coaches get stuck on the fact that a player is "project" and miss the fact that they may or could be more than that ...sometimes, in "practice" players don't get the same reps as first teamers and key bench players who all are pretty much interchangeable except the seven footer who ....sometimes, the fact that a player works hard, studies tape and knows as much or more about scouting report than the entire team (as JTIII has stated about Hayes) you'd think would earn a player SOMEthing ...sometimes a player doesn't fit the mold of player that the coach likes ...sometimes a coach doesn't like mistakes within a system and doesn't have the patience to allow a player to get better (see RGIII) unless your name is M. Hopkins ....anyway. that's the past. Hayes could stand to improve in a few areas and it seems like he's not being coached on those things. Like keeping the ball high or not switching constantly on smaller guys and to time his jumps better to block more shots etc. etc. Proud of the guy.

i dont think your point of what he is not being coached on makes much sense. He could be being coached on keeping the ball high and he is just not doing it. The switching thing isnt really something that can be changed. You either have switching principles or not and usually that is discussed by the coach prior and determined on the floor by the players. You cant coach dont switch in these particular situations(because a particular player is involved in the screening action) but do in these causes massive confusion on the court because everyone has to see the same thing in a split second.

Sometimes... i don't know what it is so i don't have a clear point of view on it. But i don't just accept that oh, well, coaches see him in practice everyday so he must've sucked.

[michaelgrahmstylie]

Dec 8, 2015 23:11:36 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

Dec 8, 2015 22:03:02 GMT -5 dreamhoya said:

That's my next discussion. Trey really should be playing a lot more. Put him with Hayes, defense will be better. Period. Trey's another gamer.

And who is sitting?

Great question!

[bmartin]

Dec 9, 2015 19:13:36 GMT -5 michaelgrahmstylie said:

Dec 8, 2015 23:11:36 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

And who is sitting?

Great question!

Trey is more of a forward than a center but the pt at forward is even harder to come by than at center.

[Filo]

Strummer - can you change the title of this thread to - "B. Hayes: The Ultimate Contest to See Who Gets the Last Word In!"

PRHoya - I think you are winning. Good work!

[tashoya]

Dec 9, 2015 18:32:54 GMT -5 dreamhoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 7:19:26 GMT -5 dense said:

i dont think your point of what he is not being coached on makes much sense. He could be being coached on keeping the ball high and he is just not doing it. The switching thing isnt really something that can be changed. You either have switching principles or not and usually that is discussed by the coach prior and determined on the floor by the players. You cant coach dont switch in these particular situations(because a particular player is involved in the screening action) but do in these causes massive confusion on the court because everyone has to see the same thing in a split second.

Sometimes... i don't know what it is so i don't have a clear point of view on it. But i don't just accept that oh, well, coaches see him in practice everyday so he must've sucked.

And there's the rub. Not sucked. Just not quite good enough to steal minutes from players ahead of him. Big difference. Hop was a very solid interior defender. Bradley is a work in progress on that front even right now with as well as he's been playing. He's been moving his feet better and that's a step in the right direction. His feet looked nailed to the floor in comparison nearly every time he played before this season. On offense, Joshua got double teamed every time which opened up our offense. Bradley isn't really getting double teamed even now with the press that he's gotten about the incredible improvement in his offensive game. That's a bit of a chicken/egg thing too as we have a lot of offensive weapons this year so it's more costly to double down low but that lends even more credence to keeping Joshua on the floor offensively last year. If Bradley did one thing glaringly well (like rebound), he'd have gotten more minutes. Hop had him dead to rights defensively last year and Joshua had him similarly offensively both by what he could do and by the way opponents played with him on the floor.

[prhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 21:28:53 GMT -5 Filo said:

Strummer - can you change the title of this thread to - "B. Hayes: The Ultimate Contest to See Who Gets the Last Word In!"

PRHoya - I think you are winning. Good work!

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

[williambraskyiii]

Dec 9, 2015 22:42:17 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 21:28:53 GMT -5 Filo said:

Strummer - can you change the title of this thread to - "B. Hayes: The Ultimate Contest to See Who Gets the Last Word In!"

PRHoya - I think you are winning. Good work!

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

Pr has rocketed up the charts of HT members I'd least like to have a beer with. Him and YB are now 1A and 1B.

[tashoya]

Dec 9, 2015 23:48:41 GMT -5 williambraskyiii said:

Dec 9, 2015 22:42:17 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

Pr has rocketed up the charts of HT members I'd least like to have a beer with. Him and YB are now 1A and 1B.

You must be kidding unless you literally meant one beer. It's fun to go back and forth over things that can't be changed or agreed upon over a few beers. Also, I'd love to pick YaBoy's brain on recruiting. I don't agree with pr in his views on Bradley for the most part but I do love that he's passionate about the program and sticks to his guns in rooting for a player that he clearly has a lot of faith in. He's a fan. I'm a fan. We, as a group, could use more of them.

[dense]

Id like to echo the thoughts above this post. I have a fondness for everyone here because we all live and die by this one thing. Message boards are glorified support groups so I can definitely know with certainty that we all want the same result. I'll say it when we went to final four last time I called my mom and dad who are huge hoya fans and cried like a baby especially because they knew it was me and I was so happy.

[prhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 23:53:45 GMT -5 tashoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 23:48:41 GMT -5 williambraskyiii said:

Pr has rocketed up the charts of HT members I'd least like to have a beer with. Him and YB are now 1A and 1B.

You must be kidding unless you literally meant one beer. It's fun to go back and forth over things that can't be changed or agreed upon over a few beers. Also, I'd love to pick YaBoy's brain on recruiting. I don't agree with pr in his views on Bradley for the most part but I do love that he's passionate about the program and sticks to his guns in rooting for a player that he clearly has a lot of faith in. He's a fan. I'm a fan. We, as a group, could use more of them.

Thanks, tas, feel the same way about you. Looks like willy is still holding a grudge from a back-and-forth several years ago.

[prhoya]

Dec 9, 2015 23:48:41 GMT -5 williambraskyiii said:

Dec 9, 2015 22:42:17 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

Pr has rocketed up the charts of HT members I'd least like to have a beer with. Him and YB are now 1A and 1B.

I don't always drink beer, but when I do... it's with good company, not with people like you who hold grudges.

[Filo]

Dec 9, 2015 23:53:45 GMT -5 tashoya said:

Dec 9, 2015 23:48:41 GMT -5 williambraskyiii said:

Pr has rocketed up the charts of HT members I'd least like to have a beer with. Him and YB are now 1A and 1B.

You must be kidding unless you literally meant one beer. It's fun to go back and forth over things that can't be changed or agreed upon over a few beers. Also, I'd love to pick YaBoy's brain on recruiting. I don't agree with pr in his views on Bradley for the most part but I do love that he's passionate about the program and sticks to his guns in rooting for a player that he clearly has a lot of faith in. He's a fan. I'm a fan. We, as a group, could use more of them.

He is referring to the grandmaster of the Charlie Daniels Ballroom Dancing Society, not one of the best posters around (YaBoyNyP).

Dec 9, 2015 22:42:17 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

Absolutely correct! And, honestly, I tried, oh how I tried. But, just when I thought I was out, you pull me back in. I am seeking help. Will let you know how it turns out.

[prhoya]

Dec 10, 2015 7:06:29 GMT -5 Filo said:

Dec 9, 2015 22:42:17 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

Absolutely correct! And, honestly, I tried, oh how I tried. But, just when I thought I was out, you pull me back in. I am seeking help. Will let you know how it turns out.

Please do.

[tashoya]

Dec 10, 2015 7:06:29 GMT -5 Filo said:

Dec 9, 2015 23:53:45 GMT -5 tashoya said:

You must be kidding unless you literally meant one beer. It's fun to go back and forth over things that can't be changed or agreed upon over a few beers. Also, I'd love to pick YaBoy's brain on recruiting. I don't agree with pr in his views on Bradley for the most part but I do love that he's passionate about the program and sticks to his guns in rooting for a player that he clearly has a lot of faith in. He's a fan. I'm a fan. We, as a group, could use more of them.

He is referring to the grandmaster of the Charlie Daniels Ballroom Dancing Society, not one of the best posters around (YaBoyNyP).

Dec 9, 2015 22:42:17 GMT -5 prhoya said:

Thanks!? If you don't care for the discussion, you might want to skip this thread.

Absolutely correct! And, honestly, I tried, oh how I tried. But, just when I thought I was out, you pull me back in. I am seeking help. Will let you know how it turns out.

Gotcha. I was really confused by that. Thank you for the clarification.