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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2015 11:49:19 GMT -5
Agau isn't coming in and getting anywhere near 8/6. Look at the recent history of our 1st year big men. Almost none had anywhere near the type of production (or minutes) you guys are talking about, except for Greg and Jeff -- who were more thoroughbreds than bangers (and also happened to be high 1st round draft picks). See Roy, Julian, Henry, Nate, Hop, PEJr even. Hell, even Dajuan (9/4) and Otto (9.7/6.8) barely navigated around those numbers and they were 5-star guys, more 3/4 than 4/5, superior athletes, offensive talents, and future NBA-ers. JT3 is going to have a hard time swallowing major minutes from a green Center, be it Govan or Agau. They won't be "7th or 8th" guys in our lineup, as much as they will have their own little rotation at the 5 spot -- along w/ Hayes. They were all Freshman and you have to evaluate roster make-up… Kid will be a 21 year old Junior (Soph in eligibility)...
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 6, 2015 12:01:36 GMT -5
Agau isn't coming in and getting anywhere near 8/6. Look at the recent history of our 1st year big men. Almost none had anywhere near the type of production (or minutes) you guys are talking about, except for Greg and Jeff -- who were more thoroughbreds than bangers (and also happened to be high 1st round draft picks). See Roy, Julian, Henry, Nate, Hop, PEJr even. Hell, even Dajuan (9/4) and Otto (9.7/6.8) barely navigated around those numbers and they were 5-star guys, more 3/4 than 4/5, superior athletes, offensive talents, and future NBA-ers. JT3 is going to have a hard time swallowing major minutes from a green Center, be it Govan or Agau. They won't be "7th or 8th" guys in our lineup, as much as they will have their own little rotation at the 5 spot -- along w/ Hayes. They were all Freshman and you have to evaluate roster make-up… Kid will be a 21 year old Junior (Soph in eligibility)... Cool, so let's use some recent examples. Josh came in last year and in the non-conference season (13 games before he became ineligible) put up 11.5 ppg and 3.4 rpg. Obviously Josh is very unique due to his size and has a ton of proven offensive talent (unlike Agau), but he came in as a grown man similar to what we're saying about Agau... Mikael and Nate might be better examples of guys with more similar size/skills to Agau (although both Mikael and Nate were bigger). Nate last year averaged 5.1 points and 5.4 rebounds in 25 minutes per game. So to get to 8 and 6, Agau would have to be a better offensive player and superior rebounder in fewer minutes. Hopkins this year is averaging 3.9 points and 5.7 rebounds in 22 minutes per game. So again, to get to 8 and 6 requires Agau to be more productive than Nate and Hop in their 4th year in the system. Is this possible? Sure, particularly on the scoring side where Nate and Mikael were/are extremely limited. However, I wouldn't expect it based on Agau's production in high school/college and his highlight videos. He looks like a garbage man type without much in the way of sophisticated offensive skills...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2015 12:05:46 GMT -5
I’m not saying he’s a 7th man…I’m pointing out the current state of the roster. BTW you do realize in 17 min AB puts up 8 and 2 and nobody is going to call AB a skilled offensive player, he’s an effort guy . His team was loaded, they beat Oak Hill his Senior year. Marcus averages less for Brewster. Tre averaged less for St Johns. He averaged 17 and 7 in EYBL (Short Stint) and by the time he plays for us HS would have been 3 years ago.. Time didn’t stand still, he has been developing wether we’ve been able to see it or not. Rick Pitino in late July/early August called him “The Biggest Surprise of the Summer” Then he got hurt and missed 2 months. IMO You are completely underselling what he brings and overselling the current guys on the roster. Plus undervaluing the role Physical Maturity plays. There’s a big difference between a 21 yr old player who will have been in a College level strength and Conditioning program for 3 years and a 18/19 year old Frosh that has not. @jonrothstein: Rick Pitino said the biggest surprise so far this summer for Louisville has been the 6-8 F Akoy Agau. Pitino said guards Terry Rozier and Anton Gill and star power forward Montrezl Harrell are all "in awesome shape." He said backup power forward Akoy Agau "looks terrific" and shows the "big difference" between freshmen and sophomores. YaBoy, I love you as a poster, man, but you know you're comparing apples to oranges when you bring up Derrickson's and Campbell's high school stats. Marcus plays for a freaking all star team at Brewster where individual minutes are limited, if he was playing for some podunk school in Omaha, he'd be averaging 20+ easy. Re: Tre, are you claiming he's going to average 8 points a game next year as a backup? That's obviously not his role... You're high on Agau, I get it, cool. I agree that physical development means something and is an advantage he'd have over people like Derrickson and Mourning. I think Agau can get 20 mpg next year if he comes here, playing mostly at the 5 position - if that's what Agau wants to do and if JT3 plays an undersized 5 which he hasn't seemed very willing to do in the past. Even if he gets 20 minutes, I'm still taking the under on both the 8 and 6 prediction. I'd love to add him as a depth guy, but really hope he's not being sold on a lot of minutes at the forward positions being available, as that doesn't appear accurate and could lead to chemistry issues... I’m always high on adding talented players in roles where we are weak or unproven. Marcus averaged less at Paul the VI as well and Omaha Central is not some Podunk school in Nebraska. They played a National schedule including playing in the City of Palms tourney. Probably the best HS tourney in the Nation. He had 20 and 10 vs Oak Hill and took home a W.. Teams that lack talent don’t beat Oak Hill by 8. They also lost to Poly who was ranked #2 in the Nation by a buzzer beater. They were a top 20 team according to MaxPreps.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Jan 6, 2015 12:06:44 GMT -5
Love drawing those conclusions based on internet videos... boya, you do remember that we recruited him heavily when he was coming out, right? In fact, just before he visited L'ville and subsequently announced for the Cards, Agau named the Hoyas as his leader. Think I'll trust III on this one.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2015 12:10:46 GMT -5
They were all Freshman and you have to evaluate roster make-up… Kid will be a 21 year old Junior (Soph in eligibility)... Cool, so let's use some recent examples. Josh came in last year and in the non-conference season (13 games before he became ineligible) put up 11.5 ppg and 3.4 rpg. Obviously Josh is very unique due to his size and has a ton of proven offensive talent (unlike Agau), but he came in as a grown man similar to what we're saying about Agau... Mikael and Nate might be better examples of guys with more similar size/skills to Agau (although both Mikael and Nate were bigger). Nate last year averaged 5.1 points and 5.4 rebounds in 25 minutes per game. So to get to 8 and 6, Agau would have to be a better offensive player and superior rebounder in fewer minutes. Hopkins this year is averaging 3.9 points and 5.7 rebounds in 22 minutes per game. So again, to get to 8 and 6 requires Agau to be more productive than Nate and Hop in their 4th year in the system. Is this possible? Sure, particularly on the scoring side where Nate and Mikael were/are extremely limited. However, I wouldn't expect it based on Agau's production in high school/college and his highlight videos. He looks like a garbage man type without much in the way of sophisticated offensive skills... Akoy isn’t Nate Josh or Hop… He will have his own career and it won’t be based on what anybody else has done before him. If you’re basing your evaluation on HS Highlights that might be part of the problem. Watch the game vs Oak Hill, some of his other games online, or wait and see as time will tell...
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hoyaboya
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Post by hoyaboya on Jan 6, 2015 12:23:07 GMT -5
Love drawing those conclusions based on internet videos... boya, you do remember that we recruited him heavily when he was coming out, right? In fact, just before he visited L'ville and subsequently announced for the Cards, Agau named the Hoyas as his leader. Think I'll trust III on this one. Sure do, and was excited about him at the time. But after Agau chose the Ville, JT3 successfully recruited Isaac Copeland, Paul White, Marcus Derrickson and Jesse Govan. A lot of the minutes at the 3-5 positions are now accounted for with those recruits, which is a change compared to when Agau was initially recruited. Additionally, in the 1.5 years at Louisville, Agau got essentially zero high major game experience (unlike Josh Smith before he transferred here) and he also suffered a serious injury that required surgery. That's in addition to being suspended a couple games last year for an attitude issue, when Pitino said "He wasn't acting the way a University of Louisville basketball player should." Totally trust JT3 and that if we land this guy, the minutes will take care of themselves and the coach will effectively manage any chemistry issues. Personally, I just don't understand why Agau would want to choose Georgetown compared to his other options (assuming he wants to play heavy minutes at a position that suits his size) and I think the 8 and 6 expectations/Jeff Green comparisons being placed on this kid are completely unrealistic.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Jan 6, 2015 13:02:36 GMT -5
boya, who knows why kids choose their destinations. In most cases, for us as fans, the reasons matter not, as long as they choose us. I just can't fashion an argument against taking him now if he wants to come, especially since he would provide depth and competition for minutes at a position where, as SirSaxa, deacon, sf and others have pointed out in this thread, we need it. Actually, I agree with your earlier post when you said that you didn't think that your views disagreed that much from what others are saying. What's curious is the negative tone regarding Agau in your posts. We lose Hopkins, and we lost Dickerson. Seems to me Agau would be an excellent pickup, especially this late in the game.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2015 13:04:57 GMT -5
Everyone seems to agree that he'd have a role here on next year's team, and that our lineup would look better with him in the rotation than not.
I'm gonna hold off on considering his future productivity for the next few days. Tomorrow is his 2nd Nebraska visit, and it looks like they're a big favorite right now.
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Post by daymondmyles on Jan 6, 2015 13:14:04 GMT -5
What part of 3 scholarships open next year do y'all not understand? There isnt a plethora of talent left in 2015 and I'd rather take a guy like this than just sit on it for no reason because we don't have a crunch for 2016 either. we are thin next year for both bigs and guards so I'd prefer to have an option there at least. Worst case scenario is he doesn't work out and then he's not scaring anybody away either. But you can't tell me he won't be better than Moses was and I'm glad we had him.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Jan 6, 2015 13:22:03 GMT -5
What part of 3 scholarships open next year do y'all not understand? There isnt a plethora of talent left in 2015 and I'd rather take a guy like this than just sit on it for no reason because we don't have a crunch for 2016 either. we are thin next year for both bigs and guards so I'd prefer to have an option there at least. Worst case scenario is he doesn't work out and then he's not scaring anybody away either. But you can't tell me he won't be better than Moses was and I'm glad we had him. Our center rotation for 2016 currently consists of Govan and [insert non-center here]. While I personally think that LJ Peak can do anything he sets his mind to on the court, do we really want to count on him for minutes at the 5
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njhoya78
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Post by njhoya78 on Jan 6, 2015 13:22:50 GMT -5
Based upon our projected front court next year as compared to Nebraska's projected front court next year, there is no question that if the sole determinative factor is playing time, Akoy Agau will be enrolling at Nebraska. They will be able to offer far more than a limited bench role, as it appears we are offering.
Now, if you factor academics into the situation, it could be different; however, as a former Nebraska chancellor purportedly said years ago, the N on the football stadium in Lincoln doesn't just stand for Nebraska, it also stands for Knowledge.
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dense
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Post by dense on Jan 6, 2015 14:17:43 GMT -5
I like how everyone is assuming he will be on the bench. Maybe he comes here and wins the starting gig. We know with III nothing is promised.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2015 14:23:31 GMT -5
I like how everyone is assuming he will be on the bench. Maybe he comes here and wins the starting gig. We know with III nothing is promised. Not me Dense!
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Post by williambraskyiii on Jan 6, 2015 14:33:19 GMT -5
I like how everyone is assuming he will be on the bench. Maybe he comes here and wins the starting gig. We know with III nothing is promised. Not me Dense! What, you don't think 12+ minutes of Bradley Hayes at 25+ minutes from a freshman C is a given? That's silly. Clearly, Agau would be slated for a "limited bench role" if he came here. #sarcasm I especially love when people slate Hayes for significant minutes next year since he's shown us so much to date.
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Jan 6, 2015 14:43:34 GMT -5
One fact that is becoming apparent from this debate is that the Hoyas need another big (and a shooter) for next season. There are three possible options. First, recruiting a kid from high school at this time seems unlikely to produce anything but another project. Next, there is the transfer route and depending upon the situation most transfers must sit a year. Besides, a transfer is hit or miss and in most instances there is no way to know at this time who might be available. Finally there is junior college, a path the Hoyas have rarely followed. Given these choices it is difficult not to pursue Agau.
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dense
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Post by dense on Jan 6, 2015 15:12:27 GMT -5
Not me Dense! What, you don't think 12+ minutes of Bradley Hayes at 25+ minutes from a freshman C is a given? That's silly. Clearly, Agau would be slated for a "limited bench role" if he came here. #sarcasm I especially love when people slate Hayes for significant minutes next year since he's shown us so much to date. I'm saying it might even be C he starts at. Who knows??? Maybe he starts and Govan does.
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OldHoyafan
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Post by OldHoyafan on Jan 6, 2015 16:58:18 GMT -5
Some are saying that at 6'8" he would not get much playing time next year? I seem to remember a former commit(Dickerson) who at 6'8" was predicted to get plenty of playing time next year. Maybe he thought like those same folks.
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hoyabinx
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Post by hoyabinx on Jan 6, 2015 21:24:11 GMT -5
Apparently Nebraska got a commitment from an Aussie today, so they are full starting next year. Not sure what that really means, but this guy believes it takes them out of the running:
He writes for a Lincoln, NE paper.
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Jan 6, 2015 21:46:52 GMT -5
Heck, after tonight's game, we need any and all help we can get. Agau, come on down!
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 6, 2015 21:57:58 GMT -5
Apparently Nebraska got a commitment from an Aussie today, so they are full starting next year. Not sure what that really means, but this guy believes it takes them out of the running: He writes for a Lincoln, NE paper. According to their VC page, Nebraska is over the scholarship limit.. Hopefully this works out in the staffs favor verbalcommits.com/schools/nebraskaMarquette may not be appealing either considering they'll have Upperclassmen Taylor & Fischer to go along with freshman Ellenson & Heldt who are both 6-10 post players.. verbalcommits.com/schools/marquette
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