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Post by HometownHoya on Apr 20, 2011 10:59:32 GMT -5
I'd have to say I agree with HSB. Also seems like most of his shots are off good moves and he is getting open but they just aren't falling. I would attribute his shots missing to him being tentative but I think that he is just having trouble finding himself in the reduced minutes. Who knows the last time (if ever) that Jeff has avged less then 25 min a game. He is trying to make an impact in what little time he has but he is also concerned that he won't be able to impact the game, thus throwing of his confidence.
Good luck to Jeff and I hope this series provides him with a breakout game.
PS I wish the Celtics would use him at SF more rather then as Garnett's sub at PF
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RDF
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Post by RDF on Apr 20, 2011 11:08:12 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if he doesn't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy.
Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether he's "comfortable" or not.
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757hoyafan
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Post by 757hoyafan on Apr 20, 2011 11:12:41 GMT -5
How much did OKC offer? This is my first time ever hearing this.
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by guru on Apr 20, 2011 11:13:23 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if he doesn't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy. Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether he's "comfortable" or not. Normally the sheer awfulness of the NBA brand of basketball keeps me away, but I watched part of last night's game and I was pretty surprised at how bad Green looks out there. Just kind of stands around, looking confused. Disappointing, to say the least. |
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Post by HometownHoya on Apr 20, 2011 11:14:59 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if you don't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy. Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether you are "comfortable" or not. I'm not sure what you are watching RDF but it sure seems like Jeff is trying there. He seems to be happy hes at the Celtics. He is getting the ball, making moves, and taking shots. His shots aren't falling, hes not airballing them but they are just off. The entire Celtic bench is doing awful right now but that's not just on Jeff. After just standing and watching for 3 years, it takes some time to readjust to needing to be multi-faceted. Yes he is a pro but that doesn't mean he isn't human. If you get transferred to a new department/group/company/etc, it takes some time for you to get adjusted. WHAT?!? But you are a professional accountant, manager, VP, etc. Its not like Jeff is wining and just sitting on the bench. He's still trying and still putting in the effort. Sorry RDF, usually agree with you but even if they are pros, they are still human and struggle like the rest of us. |
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swhoya
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Post by swhoya on Apr 20, 2011 11:18:01 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if he doesn't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy. Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether he's "comfortable" or not. Okay, time to walk away from this board for a bit. My initial reaction was just to say: "RDF, shut the F up." I guess that's still my reaction. You really have zero idea what you're talking about, in terms of both the conversations of what happened, and what it takes to adjust to a new situation/team. This board is ridiculous. |
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RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by RDF on Apr 20, 2011 11:29:54 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if he doesn't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy. Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether he's "comfortable" or not. Okay, time to walk away from this board for a bit. My initial reaction was just to say: "RDF, shut the F up." I guess that's still my reaction. You really have zero idea what you're talking about, in terms of both the conversations of what happened, and what it takes to adjust to a new situation/team. This board is ridiculous. Jeff Green was a tremendous Hoya. He's a great person. He's also been a complete stiff in his postseason time. I don't want to see that--as I think he's got the ability to do more--but call it like you see it--and he's stunk in postseason-both last year and this. To say it's because he's on a different team, etc...he was acquired to play a role--provide the 2nd unit a boost and be an aggressive/fill the lane/get out and run type of player. Right now--if you are a Knicks fan--you hope he and 2nd unit get into the game--because it's automatic run to get back into the game or take the lead. A coach can only put you in position--this isn't college-it's the NBA--you either do it or don't. So the "Jeff's a SF not a PF...." He's a "PF not a SF".. he'd be better if you.......it comes down to making plays and being involved/engaged. The closest thing he did to being involved-getting into it with Bill Walker after Celtics just got possession/timeout. Great. Show that type of attitude on the court and start playing. He's been a defensive liability and offensively he's doing what he did last year in OKC--just in limited time--which is good for Boston. |
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Apr 20, 2011 11:59:27 GMT -5
Normally the sheer awfulness of the NBA brand of basketball keeps me away, I always get a kick out of these comments from my fellow college bball fans. It is as if we who watch the college game haven't been paying attention to the overall quality of play of collegiate hoops for the past ten plus years. NBA has boring arenas with too many indifferent folks in the stands. Like with all professional sports with long seasons it has more than share of bad games, but the level of performance and skill you see on the floor KILLS anything you see in college ball. And anyone who watched the last eight games played by Gtown this past season should know what horrible basketball looks like. As for Jeff I don't think I'm making an excuse regarding his play. Just pointing out the obvious regarding his confidence. As for his standing around I've been there and done that. Whenever I bring it up a few posters accuse me of Jeff-bashing. I'm not looking to get into any arguments on that front. I'll only say again he must DEDICATE himself to improving his skill level. What you can get away with in college you can't necessarily get away with in the NBA. The anti-NBA crowd like to blame the NBA's alleged lack of teamwork to explain why some college stars don't fare as well at the pro level. Ridiculous. First of all college bball is full of teams with players who go one-on-five (one of them just won the national title). Second of all the fact is one needs to elevate his game when going to the NBA. Period. |
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guru
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Post by guru on Apr 20, 2011 12:21:21 GMT -5
Normally the sheer awfulness of the NBA brand of basketball keeps me away, I always get a kick out of these comments from my fellow college bball fans. It is as if we who watch the college game haven't been paying attention to the overall quality of play of collegiate hoops for the past ten plus years. NBA has boring arenas with too many indifferent folks in the stands. Like with all professional sports with long seasons it has more than share of bad games, but the level of performance and skill you see on the floor KILLS anything you see in college ball. And anyone who watched the last eight games played by Gtown this past season should know what horrible basketball looks like. As for Jeff I don't think I'm making an excuse regarding his play. Just pointing out the obvious regarding his confidence. As for his standing around I've been there and done that. Whenever I bring it up a few posters accuse me of Jeff-bashing. I'm not looking to get into any arguments on that front. I'll only say again he must DEDICATE himself to improving his skill level. What you can get away with in college you can't necessarily get away with in the NBA. The anti-NBA crowd like to blame the NBA's alleged lack of teamwork to explain why some college stars don't fare as well at the pro level. Ridiculous. First of all college bball is full of teams with players who go one-on-five (one of them just won the national title). Second of all the fact is one needs to elevate his game when going to the NBA. Period. Don't mind me interrupting your straw man construction, but please point out where I said that the last seven games of the Hoyas season was anything but horrible basketball. I find the NBA to be a soulless league - the quality of college hoops has declined considerably recently as well, but I'm willing to put up with it a bit more and I enjoy the intensity and long-term rivalries, etc. I don't watch enough NBA hoops to try to analyze why Jeff s ucked the other night. I was just pointing out that he did. |
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hoopsmccan
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Post by hoopsmccan on Apr 20, 2011 12:33:23 GMT -5
Normally the sheer awfulness of the NBA brand of basketball keeps me away, I always get a kick out of these comments from my fellow college bball fans. It is as if we who watch the college game haven't been paying attention to the overall quality of play of collegiate hoops for the past ten plus years. NBA has boring arenas with too many indifferent folks in the stands. Like with all professional sports with long seasons it has more than share of bad games, but the level of performance and skill you see on the floor KILLS anything you see in college ball. And anyone who watched the last eight games played by Gtown this past season should know what horrible basketball looks like. As for Jeff I don't think I'm making an excuse regarding his play. Just pointing out the obvious regarding his confidence. As for his standing around I've been there and done that. Whenever I bring it up a few posters accuse me of Jeff-bashing. I'm not looking to get into any arguments on that front. I'll only say again he must DEDICATE himself to improving his skill level. What you can get away with in college you can't necessarily get away with in the NBA. The anti-NBA crowd like to blame the NBA's alleged lack of teamwork to explain why some college stars don't fare as well at the pro level. Ridiculous. First of all college bball is full of teams with players who go one-on-five (one of them just won the national title). Second of all the fact is one needs to elevate his game when going to the NBA. Period. As a college fan that has all but abandoned the NBA, it is not the skill level (which is obviously much higher than in the NBA). It’s the lack of caring/effort that seemingly goes on from October to March in all but a few marquee games. And in quarters 1-3 in pretty much every game. It is why I tune in come playoff time, when things really matter, the crowds are into it and the intensity level is there. But even in the playoffs, you can’t get away from the star system that is perpetuated by the referees. I could average 6-8 points if the NBA powers decided to make it happen. Sort of on topic, if Green got anymore time, the parquet spot in corner baseline would need replacing every few games due to wear and tear. I love the guy and he was a great Hoya, but I do think he is lost right now. He does everything kinda well, but is not great at anything. Maybe there is a system that will be perfect for him, but I don’t pretend to know what it is or if it exists. Based on the limited sample size of a few regular season games and the playoffs, the Celtics system does not seem to be it. hm |
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Apr 20, 2011 12:53:59 GMT -5
Don't mind me interrupting your straw man construction, but please point out where I said that the last seven games of the Hoyas season was anything but horrible basketball. No one ever wrote you said any such thing. You didn't need to say it for me to make that point, though. |
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Apr 20, 2011 13:27:03 GMT -5
As a college fan that has all but abandoned the NBA, it is not the skill level (which is obviously much higher than in the NBA). It’s the lack of caring/effort that seemingly goes on from October to March in all but a few marquee games. And in quarters 1-3 in pretty much every game. It is why I tune in come playoff time, when things really matter, the crowds are into it and the intensity level is there. But even in the playoffs, you can’t get away from the star system that is perpetuated by the referees. I could average 6-8 points if the NBA powers decided to make it happen. I don't want this to get away from the topic of this thread because the mods will end up creating a thread for it on their own and take all the posts over there. That being said your comments about the NBA is the typical arguments that come from Sports Radio Nation. A bunch of fans who don't watch the NBA or barely watch the NBA and yet claim with certainty that the players don't care, that no one plays until the last two minutes, that all the players have bad attitudes, that no one gives a ::bleep:: until the playoffs, etc. With all due respect that's ridiculous. As a person who does watch the NBA every season I catch plenty of early season/regular season games in which not only the players act like they care but their play itself leads to exciting and competitive contests. And its not as if I'm watching a bunch of NBA games to find these gems. Trust me I don't watch much sports at all these days. Just don't understand why folks paint the league with such a broad brush. Its more percepton than reality anyway IMO. But its curious considering how much AWFUL basketball we see in college. All the rivalries in the world don't matter if the enthusiasm is the stands is the only thing truly worthwhile you come away with when watching a game. As for the whining about the refs (another phenom of sports talk radio) we keep doing that for every college game too. I recall fans griping about the Duke whenever the Blue Devils win. Basketball fans are never happy about calls and that is at every level. However it suddenly becomes an evil conspiracy when it involves the NBA. People start believing stars get all the calls and forget (or don't realize) that "stars" like Dwight Howard get called for their share of fouls too. You want a real star system? Check out the NFL which goes out of its way to make rules to protect its most important stars (quarterbacks and to a lesser extent the dudes they throw the ball to). Now I have to add that any criticism regarding the NBA is probably legit if it is a game playing on ABC. ;D Seriously ABC games tend to be horrible in part because the production is so dull. And half of the games involve the boring Lakers.  |
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hoyainspirit
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
When life puts that voodoo on me, music is my gris-gris.
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Post by hoyainspirit on Apr 20, 2011 14:11:13 GMT -5
A significant difference exists between the skill levels of college and pro players. NBA players are really good. The college and pro versions of basketball are quite different games, however, though they are both basketball. This difference goes beyond just the skill of the players. Recognizing the differences, I just enjoy the college game better than I do the pros. I must admit, I usually enjoy the playoffs, though. Now, back to NBA Hoyas....
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hoopsmccan
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Post by hoopsmccan on Apr 20, 2011 14:13:44 GMT -5
As a college fan that has all but abandoned the NBA, it is not the skill level (which is obviously much higher than in the NBA). It’s the lack of caring/effort that seemingly goes on from October to March in all but a few marquee games. And in quarters 1-3 in pretty much every game. It is why I tune in come playoff time, when things really matter, the crowds are into it and the intensity level is there. But even in the playoffs, you can’t get away from the star system that is perpetuated by the referees. I could average 6-8 points if the NBA powers decided to make it happen. I don't want this to get away from the topic of this thread because the mods will end up creating a thread for it on their own and take all the posts over there. That being said your comments about the NBA is the typical arguments that come from Sports Radio Nation. A bunch of fans who don't watch the NBA or barely watch the NBA and yet claim with certainty that the players don't care, that no one plays until the last two minutes, that all the players have bad attitudes, that no one gives a ::bleep:: until the playoffs, etc. With all due respect that's ridiculous. As a person who does watch the NBA every season I catch plenty of early season/regular season games in which not only the players act like they care but their play itself leads to exciting and competitive contests. And its not as if I'm watching a bunch of NBA games to find these gems. Trust me I don't watch much sports at all these days. Just don't understand why folks paint the league with such a broad brush. Its more percepton than reality anyway IMO. But its curious considering how much AWFUL basketball we see in college. All the rivalries in the world don't matter if the enthusiasm is the stands is the only thing truly worthwhile you come away with when watching a game. As for the whining about the refs (another phenom of sports talk radio) we keep doing that for every college game too. I recall fans griping about the Duke whenever the Blue Devils win. Basketball fans are never happy about calls and that is at every level. However it suddenly becomes an evil conspiracy when it involves the NBA. People start believing stars get all the calls and forget (or don't realize) that "stars" like Dwight Howard get called for their share of fouls too. You want a real star system? Check out the NFL which goes out of its way to make rules to protect its most important stars (quarterbacks and to a lesser extent the dudes they throw the ball to). Now I have to add that any criticism regarding the NBA is probably legit if it is a game playing on ABC. ;D Seriously ABC games tend to be horrible in part because the production is so dull. And half of the games involve the boring Lakers. Fair enough, MCI. I have no way of knowing if a player cares (and I acknowledged that by hedging and writing “seemingly”). But from where I’m sitting, the intensity level is not there during a Knicks/Thunder game in November, December, January or February. The defense is generally terrible and the crowd listless. It is only the exceptional display of athleticism that keeps me tuned in at all. Maybe my problem is that I’ve been "following" the Knicks that last 8 years. I’m also unlucky enough that the one game I attended this year, Knicks/Heat at the Garden, had the intensity (one of the marquee games I mentioned), but man was the play awful. As for the star player argument, don’t hurt your back constructing all those straw men today. Actually, that doesn’t really work here, but I felt like writing it. I’m not complaining about specific calls (i.e., whining about the refs), I’m whining about putting Dwayne Wade on the line 25 times. As for the NFL analogy, it doesn’t work. The equivalent would be if the NBA decided across the board that centers can lower their shoulder and bulldoze opponents. Instead, the NBA decides that Iverson can carry, Ewing can walk, Shaq can bulldoze, you can’t look at Reggie Miller when he is shooting, etc. (And yes, I realize all my references are 10-15 years old). On a personal note, I am dismayed to find that my views track Sports Radio Nation…I haven’t listened to that stuff since I was a young man in short pants hm |
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Post by hoyahalffull on Apr 20, 2011 17:49:03 GMT -5
How much did OKC offer? This is my first time ever hearing this. RDF, I'm as confused as 757 on this. When did OKC offer Jeff an extension? I'm pretty sure he would have gladly taken it. My recollection is that OKC specifically did not offer Jeff an extension, so that they could let the market determine his value at the end of this year. |
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hoya95
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Post by hoya95 on Apr 20, 2011 17:54:27 GMT -5
How much did OKC offer? This is my first time ever hearing this. RDF, I'm as confused as 757 on this. When did OKC offer Jeff an extension? I'm pretty sure he would have gladly taken it. My recollection is that OKC specifically did not offer Jeff an extension, so that they could let the market determine his value at the end of this year. They negotiated, but they never signed him to an extension. www.dailythunder.com/2010/10/jeff-green-wont-be-getting-a-contract-extension/The best thing Jeff can do is to keep getting out and running the floor as much as possible. He's got far more speed than most everyone realized, and he's one of the few that can keep up with Rondo. Run out, get some easy ones and hope things start to click after that. The whole Celtics 2nd unit looks out of sorts, and Jeff is only a part of that. The more good things that can happen before the defense sets up, the better. But come on, don't give up on Jeff Green yet! |
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Apr 20, 2011 18:17:43 GMT -5
Easily ignored because of their lack of flash, but essential to that victory last night, were several solid picks Green set to free Allen and Pierce.
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jester
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Post by jester on Apr 21, 2011 9:37:12 GMT -5
Jeff Green at $6mm - you resign him. Jeff Green at $9-10mm - maybe doesnt make sense for Thunder, esp as backup to Ibaka. I believe Falk conceded he wasnt worth that to Thunder, but said that he could be worth that to another team. Which could be true - Wizards etc could offer an experienced, no trouble versatile veteran more money to come play on a less attractive team. I guess Celtics plan was to resign him. I dont know how his performance affects that decision. He concedes perhaps a bit too much to the stars, but they wont be there perhaps in 2 yrs, and given the chance to be more of a focal point he has done much better.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 21, 2011 10:38:14 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if he doesn't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy. Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether he's "comfortable" or not. What did they offer him? |
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RDF
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Post by RDF on Apr 21, 2011 11:46:21 GMT -5
Quit making excuses--this isn't HS/College--you are a Pro--if he doesn't have confidence--then sit on the bench and let someone else play. Team didn't trade a key player for a guy who is "afraid to step on toes"--and if that's what he thinks--he should've taken the extension OKC offered him--because that is role he seems to be comfortable doing--being a stand/watch guy. Green isn't doing anything. How long are guys going to be coddled/protected? It's time to start playing--and nobody has time to worry about whether he's "comfortable" or not. What did they offer him? 7 to 8 million per year-and 4 to 5 years. |
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