rockhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by rockhoya on Nov 8, 2016 17:15:52 GMT -5
Otto is not a guy you run offense through. He plays off of others. Does well at finding gaps to attack and cutting for cheap buckets. He does not create offense for himself or others. All of that reads present tense to me....it doesn't mean he cant develop those skills. 5-6 years ago he was limited outside of the paint, now look at him.
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Post by stafford72 on Nov 9, 2016 20:18:42 GMT -5
Otto with 20 and 8 boards and 2 blocks at half against Celtics. Not too shabby.
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Post by sleepyjackson21 on Nov 9, 2016 21:23:00 GMT -5
Maybe the best game of his career. 34 pts 14 rbs 4 asts 3 stls 3 blocks and 0 turnovers.
My apologies Otto for not using you in most of my fanduel lineups.
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hoyainspirit
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
When life puts that voodoo on me, music is my gris-gris.
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Post by hoyainspirit on Nov 9, 2016 21:25:44 GMT -5
Otto's 34 points and 14 rebounds are career highs.
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dense
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by dense on Nov 9, 2016 21:32:38 GMT -5
He was amazing tonight. 34 and 14 and an amazing block on Jaylen Brown
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zxhoya
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Post by zxhoya on Nov 9, 2016 22:04:58 GMT -5
Listened to the game on the radio and the Wizards color commentator, Glenn Consor called Otto a poor mans Kahwi Leonard. I think that's a favorable comparison aside from the "poor man" part. Otto has been the teams most consistent player this season and you can see he has bulked up some from last season.
Typical Ernie Grunfeld, doesn't pick up the extension on Otto, the teams best 'basketball player'
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vv83
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by vv83 on Nov 9, 2016 22:25:18 GMT -5
Listened to the game on the radio and the Wizards color commentator, Glenn Consor called Otto a poor mans Kahwi Leonard. I think that's a favorable comparison aside from the "poor man" part. Otto has been the teams most consistent player this season and you can see he has bulked up some from last season. Typical Ernie Grunfeld, doesn't pick up the extension on Otto, the teams best 'basketball player' I am far from an expert on the NBA salary cap, but I think there may be some reasons beyond Otto's on court play that impacted the Wiz decision not to offer Otto the extension I am fairly sure that David Falk is his agent. Falk usually recommends that his client decline the 4th year extension if it is offered. This would make the player a full unrestricted FA at the end of year 4. This is what Monroe did. Risky for Otto in that you turn down a lot of guaranteed money by turning down the extension, but it also potentially maximizes your contract/team options as an unrestricted FA at the end of year 4. So the wizards may have known that otto/Falk would decline the 4th year option if offered. If that is the case - the Wiz may have figured it is better not to offer it. That way - Otto becomes a restricted FA at the end of year 4. So the Wiz would still have the right to keep him by matching any contract he is offered, rather than risk losing him as an unrestricted FA if they offer the extension and Otto/Falk turn it down. It also gives the team another year of play to assess Otto's long term value. The risk for the wiz is that Otto has a good/great season - leading to another team offering him a significantly bigger contract than what the Wiz might have been able to get him for with an extension before the 4th year. But, again, if they were pretty certain Otto/Falk would turn down any extension offer - then the Wizards may well be in a better position not to make the offer at all, and retain their rights to match any contract offer otto receives at the end of season 4. There may also be some "cap hold" advantages for the Wizards in not signing otto to an extension and waiting until after season 4 to negotiate with him as an unrestricted FA, but I don't know nearly enough about that aspect of the NBA labor rules to understand this angle.
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zxhoya
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Post by zxhoya on Nov 9, 2016 23:23:27 GMT -5
Listened to the game on the radio and the Wizards color commentator, Glenn Consor called Otto a poor mans Kahwi Leonard. I think that's a favorable comparison aside from the "poor man" part. Otto has been the teams most consistent player this season and you can see he has bulked up some from last season. Typical Ernie Grunfeld, doesn't pick up the extension on Otto, the teams best 'basketball player' I am far from an expert on the NBA salary cap, but I think there may be some reasons beyond Otto's on court play that impacted the Wiz decision not to offer Otto the extension I am fairly sure that David Falk is his agent. Falk usually recommends that his client decline the 4th year extension if it is offered. This would make the player a full unrestricted FA at the end of year 4. This is what Monroe did. Risky for Otto in that you turn down a lot of guaranteed money by turning down the extension, but it also potentially maximizes your contract/team options as an unrestricted FA at the end of year 4. So the wizards may have known that otto/Falk would decline the 4th year option if offered. If that is the case - the Wiz may have figured it is better not to offer it. That way - Otto becomes a restricted FA at the end of year 4. So the Wiz would still have the right to keep him by matching any contract he is offered, rather than risk losing him as an unrestricted FA if they offer the extension and Otto/Falk turn it down. It also gives the team another year of play to assess Otto's long term value. The risk for the wiz is that Otto has a good/great season - leading to another team offering him a significantly bigger contract than what the Wiz might have been able to get him for with an extension before the 4th year. But, again, if they were pretty certain Otto/Falk would turn down any extension offer - then the Wizards may well be in a better position not to make the offer at all, and retain their rights to match any contract offer otto receives at the end of season 4. There may also be some "cap hold" advantages for the Wizards in not signing otto to an extension and waiting until after season 4 to negotiate with him as an unrestricted FA, but I don't know nearly enough about that aspect of the NBA labor rules to understand this angle. I believe you are correct vv83. You know far more than I do on the Cap issue but I do know that the Wiz have control over his rights so everything you described makes sense. Otto's play will earn him a lucrative contract next summer and I'm sure the Wiz wont let him go.
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jester
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by jester on Nov 10, 2016 1:13:59 GMT -5
“Otto has been great,” Coach Scott Brooks said. “He gives you a lot of winning basketball plays. You can look at his field goal percentage, you can look at all the things that he does — his mid-range game, his three-point shot has developed, his offensive rebounds. But what he gives you, he gives you a winning spirit, and he does that throughout the game on both ends.”
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aristides
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
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Post by aristides on Nov 10, 2016 8:03:24 GMT -5
Fair or not, the feeing around DC has pretty much solidified now that Otto is an official bust. I've been surprised at how ineffective he has been in the pros even in the limited opportunities given to him by Nitwit, er, Wittman. Hard not to be disappointed by how his career has gone so far. So has Otto moved out of "official" bust category?
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Nov 10, 2016 8:11:33 GMT -5
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SSHoya
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"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Post by SSHoya on Nov 10, 2016 9:31:42 GMT -5
Otto is not a guy you run offense through. He plays off of others. Does well at finding gaps to attack and cutting for cheap buckets. He does not create offense for himself or others. 95, see my quote in post above. I didn't see the game but if Thomas said that the Wiz ran iso plays for him, that means he's creating his own offense.
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SirSaxa
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Post by SirSaxa on Nov 10, 2016 9:38:27 GMT -5
Listened to the game on the radio and the Wizards color commentator, Glenn Consor called Otto a poor mans Kahwi Leonard. I think that's a favorable comparison aside from the "poor man" part. Otto has been the teams most consistent player this season and you can see he has bulked up some from last season. Typical Ernie Grunfeld, doesn't pick up the extension on Otto, the teams best 'basketball player' I am far from an expert on the NBA salary cap, but I think there may be some reasons beyond Otto's on court play that impacted the Wiz decision not to offer Otto the extension I am fairly sure that David Falk is his agent. Falk usually recommends that his client decline the 4th year extension if it is offered. This would make the player a full unrestricted FA at the end of year 4. This is what Monroe did. Risky for Otto in that you turn down a lot of guaranteed money by turning down the extension, but it also potentially maximizes your contract/team options as an unrestricted FA at the end of year 4. So the wizards may have known that otto/Falk would decline the 4th year option if offered. If that is the case - the Wiz may have figured it is better not to offer it. That way - Otto becomes a restricted FA at the end of year 4. So the Wiz would still have the right to keep him by matching any contract he is offered, rather than risk losing him as an unrestricted FA if they offer the extension and Otto/Falk turn it down. It also gives the team another year of play to assess Otto's long term value. The risk for the wiz is that Otto has a good/great season - leading to another team offering him a significantly bigger contract than what the Wiz might have been able to get him for with an extension before the 4th year. But, again, if they were pretty certain Otto/Falk would turn down any extension offer - then the Wizards may well be in a better position not to make the offer at all, and retain their rights to match any contract offer otto receives at the end of season 4. There may also be some "cap hold" advantages for the Wizards in not signing otto to an extension and waiting until after season 4 to negotiate with him as an unrestricted FA, but I don't know nearly enough about that aspect of the NBA labor rules to understand this angle. Thanks for that informative post vv83. David Falk was Otto's agent and still is as far as I know (OK, that's not very far!) In addition to maximizing Otto's earnings over the life of his career, I imagine Falk and Porter are also looking at his best chance to build a winning legacy. At this point, that doesn't appear to be a path that would include the Wizards. Personally, I hope he gets a huge contract, but with a first class organization -- e.g San Antonio. Falk knows the league and all it's key owners and execs. Hopefully he will guide Otto to a optimal landing spot. Signing for a few million less, is not as important as being in a winning environment... at least in my estimation. At some point, the value of an additional million or two is outweighed by the chance to contribute to a winning team. Here's hoping Otto gets both.
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vv83
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by vv83 on Nov 10, 2016 9:57:50 GMT -5
Otto is not a guy you run offense through. He plays off of others. Does well at finding gaps to attack and cutting for cheap buckets. He does not create offense for himself or others. 95, see my quote in post above. I didn't see the game but if Thomas said that the Wiz ran iso plays for him, that means he's creating his own offense. I don't watch every Wizards game, but I try to watch pieces of most of them. Otto definitely was more central to the offensive plan last night. This game was kind of similar to the Syracuse game at the dome his soph year. He was very aggressive in looking for his shot, scoring most of his points on open 3s and mid range jumpers. Just as importantly, he was all over the court on both ends. Passing to set up teammates, rebounding everything near him, deflecting passes and generally messing up the Celtic offense. He was playing with an aggressiveness that has been largely missing in his NBA career. My guess is that the game is slowing down for him. It took a few seasons, but he is starting to anticipate the game in similar ways to the way he played in college. Now, this was the first really great game he has played. But he has been showing flashes of these more aggressive, advanced elements throughout the first weeks of this season. If he can put together games like last night on a fairly consistent basis - he may be able to get himself close to a max contract at the end of the year.
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Post by wahoohoya on Nov 10, 2016 10:42:32 GMT -5
95, see my quote in post above. I didn't see the game but if Thomas said that the Wiz ran iso plays for him, that means he's creating his own offense. I don't watch every Wizards game, but I try to watch pieces of most of them. Otto definitely was more central to the offensive plan last night. This game was kind of similar to the Syracuse game at the dome his soph year. He was very aggressive in looking for his shot, scoring most of his points on open 3s and mid range jumpers. Just as importantly, he was all over the court on both ends. Passing to set up teammates, rebounding everything near him, deflecting passes and generally messing up the Celtic offense. He was playing with an aggressiveness that has been largely missing in his NBA career. My guess is that the game is slowing down for him. It took a few seasons, but he is starting to anticipate the game in similar ways to the way he played in college. Now, this was the first really great game he has played. But he has been showing flashes of these more aggressive, advanced elements throughout the first weeks of this season. If he can put together games like last night on a fairly consistent basis - he may be able to get himself close to a max contract at the end of the year. Similar to you - I try to watch as much Otto as I can (pieces of Wizards games) - but I did watch the entire game last night. Agree with your assessment - the game has slowed down and he is continuing to gain more confidence (and his teammates are noticing it). He started off with two quick 3's and he was off to the races. Beautiful game all around. Next step in his evolution is to finish more drives and get to the line more. Once he starts doing that, then look out. To respond to the earlier comment - I wouldn't say the Wizards were running iso plays for him. It was mostly Otto playing his typical game - finding the right spots - which is the way he creates offense. It's clear that he should be more of a focal point in the offense. That doesn't mean they need to run a bunch of sets for him - they just have to look for him more and give him the ball back after he makes his initial pass. And without a doubt, he needs to be part of the 4th quarter game plan instead of Wall and Beal feeling like they have to play hero ball to close out games. That formula doesn't work. I suspect that Brooks understands this - and hopefully Wall will quickly realize that Otto is the running mate that he really needs - more so than Beal.
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by guru on Nov 10, 2016 11:08:58 GMT -5
Fair or not, the feeing around DC has pretty much solidified now that Otto is an official bust. I've been surprised at how ineffective he has been in the pros even in the limited opportunities given to him by Nitwit, er, Wittman. Hard not to be disappointed by how his career has gone so far. So has Otto moved out of "official" bust category? Hope so - and hoping the wizards will regret not thinking him enough of a priority to extend already. 34 point games help. And if you re-read my post that you dug up, I wasn't calling him a bust, just noting that was the feeling in DC. I do think he has been a disappointment for a player taken 3rd overall - but I love the kid, and hopefully he can keep up his strong play from last night.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Nov 10, 2016 11:13:06 GMT -5
Now that he is healthy and has some experience, I believe he has the ability to be a very good player.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 12:39:46 GMT -5
We need to remember, that that draft was one of the weakest, if not the weakest on record. In most other years, Otto wouldn't have made the top 10, let alone number 3.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Nov 10, 2016 12:50:54 GMT -5
We need to remember, that that draft was one of the weakest, if not the weakest on record. In most other years, Otto wouldn't have made the top 10, let alone number 3. I think it is s little strong to claim he would not go in the top 10 in "most other years" - but yeah definitely not #3.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Nov 10, 2016 12:56:02 GMT -5
Watched a little. They run close to zero sets for him and he hustled for everything he got. He will have to continue that effort to get paid. Wall/Beal really don't seem to mesh and Beal can't stay healthy. If I am Wiz, I would bet on Otto before Wall/Beal.
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