vcjack
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by vcjack on Nov 28, 2008 19:52:09 GMT -5
I see some references to the Davidson game, which was inevitable after our first loss. But this is completely different, that was a game that we shouldn't have lost because we were one of the top 10 teams in the nation. This year we are NOT a top 10 team (yet), but we took a top ten team (they will be one after this week) to the brim and almost beat them.
and guess what, we're only getting BETTER! As JTIII said, we CAN be a good team, but it will take time.
I'll trade this learning experiance for a win at Duke or a win at Notre Dame later in January.
Props to the Vols, they will dominate the SEC and probably get a 1 seed out of that. Hopefully for their sake Pearl keeps them hungry and learning.
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Post by bronxhoya87 on Nov 28, 2008 19:58:03 GMT -5
I am still scratching my head over the guy saying we miss Vern. When did Vern become Chuck Oakley on the boards? Vern was awful in every phase of the game. He and Rivers will not be missed.
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vcjack
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by vcjack on Nov 28, 2008 20:02:46 GMT -5
I am still scratching my head over the guy saying we miss Vern. When did Vern become Chuck Oakley on the boards? Vern was awful in every phase of the game. He and Rivers will not be missed. I miss Jeremiah's athleticism, but its clear that Omar has already exceded Jeremiah's shooting skills. Not all of the guards we will play are as fast as Tennessee's so Omar will be fine against them
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Nov 28, 2008 21:02:16 GMT -5
I am still scratching my head over the guy saying we miss Vern. When did Vern become Chuck Oakley on the boards? Vern was awful in every phase of the game. He and Rivers will not be missed. You're clueless.
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sleepy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by sleepy on Nov 28, 2008 21:10:40 GMT -5
I don't really understand the point of saying he was missed. Yes, he could have helped, any big guy that has expeirence in JTIII's offense would have helped today. If we are going to bring up Macklin we might as well say Jeff Green really could have helped today as well. I don't think you can say Macklin was missed though, because you can't be miss something you never expierenced, and we never really expierenced Vernon Macklin.
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Post by justabballfan on Nov 28, 2008 21:11:50 GMT -5
I would have liked to have seen Clark get some more minutes. I thought he played well in the game. He drew two charges, and had two steals. He was effective on the defensive end of the game. On offense he only took one shot, a three, and drained it. Jessie was clearly not having his best game, and played 33 minutes. I think we would have been better off with Clark playing confident in the game for 15 minutes, instead of 7, and Jessie in for 25 instead of 33.
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Post by bronxhoya87 on Nov 28, 2008 21:16:28 GMT -5
You are clueless. Macklin was awful. He was on this team last year when we got destroyed on the boards over and over. Stop the excuses. I am still scratching my head over the guy saying we miss Vern. When did Vern become Chuck Oakley on the boards? Vern was awful in every phase of the game. He and Rivers will not be missed. You're clueless.
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by tashoya on Nov 28, 2008 22:19:55 GMT -5
We don't miss the Ticket. We missed the fundamentals a little today. The team is untested. Did a nice job with the first big test. It wasn't the youngins that cost us this one. I thought JC looked pretty darn good. Silly fouls aside, good all around. Free had some passing issues. Monroe wasn't in the game enough in the first to dominate inside. Vaughn and Simms are still getting up to speed. It's 4 games in and, really, only one real GAME in and we're writing guys off. Not fair in the least. These guys are Hoyas for a reason. Give them time to show you why. Vern had way more time to show why and never did. Good luck to him and good riddance. All the best. Don't let the door hit you in the bleep on the way out. I'll take Wattad 0-5 or whatever it was prior to today over Rivers every day of the week and twice on Sunday simply for the THREAT of offense and the fact that the kid actually goes after rebounds and has a body that will make him capable of getting some. Not that Rivers didn't. For his size, Rivers was a capable rebounder. But, more likely than not, he'd toss a pass to a defender after grabbing one or doing something boneheaded or simply allowing a scoring threat to get double teamed and not being able to make them pay. I like that our young guys got some run against a real team and looked OK. There was some good, some bad but overall, correctable errors. And, DaJuan showed up for the whole game on both ends. I have been waiting way too long to see it. And, he showed some fire too. At no point did he look like he wasn't into it. After the monster stuff, the little look saying, "I'll take you anytime I want." Not the ridiculous yelling of Tatum after the lucky 3 off the glass or one of his other ill-advised 3's that he made. Just a little look. Loved it. Plus, Tatum is not exactly a true freshman (should be a junior I think). Not the point. Lotsa good things to take away today. Lots of them. I think we're officially on the right path. All of you that feel badly about today, rewatch the Wichita and Jacksonville games. There's always going to be mistakes made. Some are acceptable. Some are not. Vaughn and Simms not up to speed... more than acceptable. Freeman tossing 2 passes that I could have stolen... not so much. Monroe picking up a couple of cheap fouls... way more than acceptable for a guy who clearly realizes how much he has to do on a consistent basis for this team to win but hasn't yet found where that boundary is. Jessie in the second half... not so much. It's a process. And today proves that we're progressing in the right direction and the guys are getting it. Realize that we could have won (pretty easily) today after a super shaky performance ONE DAY EARLIER against a team that shouldn't be able to hang with us for more than the first 10 minutes of the first half.
Great effort today. Fewer errors tomorrow. Keep doing that and we're in for a lot of great games. We're gonna get beat up. We're gonna do some beating up. But I think this team has the ability to be in every game in the strongest (by far) league in the country.
Imagine come March.... being able to put Monroe as the PF, Vaughn or Henry at C and DS at the 3 like he should be. This is gonna be fun as hell.
Again.... DS woke up today. Put your hand up if you think that isn't the best thing that could have happened today or all of last year? Thought so. Also, I think, and this is just from watching on TV, that the guys are looking to DS and Monroe more than Sapp to set the tone. Opinions?
GO HOYAS!!!!
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by tashoya on Nov 28, 2008 22:20:35 GMT -5
Oh... and GTown's DS still > Nintendo DS
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Nov 28, 2008 22:49:18 GMT -5
I think Summers woke up yesterday to be honest, his shot just didn't start falling till the second half. There was a quote from him in an article after the game yesterday that showed he has matured from last year, something about how this game proved to him that even if you get off to a bad start you just need to keep giving it your best effort and that you will start getting going, and it that in past games if he didn't start well he would disappear but that game was the first time he proved to himself he could work through it. Or something to that effect, it was much more eloquent in his words.
And I said yesterday, he is the best player on this team, he just needs to keep playing like it.
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Nov 28, 2008 23:05:23 GMT -5
I totally agree Tas.... its the best 3 halves of bball I've seen from Dajuan in a long, long time!!!
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PopeJohn2
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Ultimate bailout is yet to come and unavoidable. Uncle Sam gonna pay your debt for you!
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Post by PopeJohn2 on Nov 28, 2008 23:06:52 GMT -5
if we had vern we would have won that game. no doubt in my mind we would be a much better team.
frontcourt depth is a huge problem for us especially when monroe and summers get 2 fouls before half and 4 before the end of the game. vern would have given us more fouls as well as decent offensive skilz.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Nov 28, 2008 23:24:16 GMT -5
if we had vern we would have won that game. no doubt in my mind we would be a much better team. frontcourt depth is a huge problem for us especially when monroe and summers get 2 fouls before half and 4 before the end of the game. vern would have given us more fouls as well as decent offensive skilz. There is no point in brining this up because he isn't here anymore. We might as well discuss how useful Roy Hibbert would have been this game and that we should have red-shirted him his freshman year. Or talk about how much better we would be if Jeff Green were still here and found a way to become elligable. At the end of the day none of these things are going to happen, so we should stop focusing on the past. Give Simms and Vaughn some more time to adjust to the offense and their teammates before we throw them under a bus. They need to get better, they all need to get better, just be patient.
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Post by strummer8526 on Nov 28, 2008 23:27:04 GMT -5
if we had vern we would have won that game. no doubt in my mind we would be a much better team. frontcourt depth is a huge problem for us especially when monroe and summers get 2 fouls before half and 4 before the end of the game. vern would have given us more fouls as well as decent offensive skilz. This post is flat out wrong, if for no other reason than that you used the word "skilz."
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Just Cos
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Eat 'em up Hoyas
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Post by Just Cos on Nov 29, 2008 0:22:46 GMT -5
if we had vern we would have won that game. no doubt in my mind we would be a much better team. frontcourt depth is a huge problem for us especially when monroe and summers get 2 fouls before half and 4 before the end of the game. vern would have given us more fouls as well as decent offensive skilz. And if my mother was my father...
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Nov 29, 2008 0:27:47 GMT -5
I was far from the biggest Macklin hater, but there's no denying this:
Vernon Macklin's defensive rebounding % his sophomore year was 10.6%.
Jeremiah Rivers' was 11.7%.
In terms of D rebounding, Macklin was the third worst at grabbing D boards on our team. Now maybe he was just boxing out, allowing others to grab the boards, but I think we all know that's not true.
Vern had some good points. But he SUCKED at defensive rebounding. SUCKED.
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Post by screamingcorn on Nov 29, 2008 2:59:18 GMT -5
Being at all of the games, one thing I have seen that is consistent regardless of who is playing is the awful officiating. Dont get me wrong, it has nothing to do with the result of today's game. But the officials have blown a lot of calls all tournament long. Some have benefited the Hoyas, some have not. Just my 2 cents. actually...that comment probably wasn't worth 2 cents. Just thought I would mention it. Anyway...need to relax on the day off tomorrow, come back and crush the terps. In the meantime...go Gators...beat the 'noles!
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Nov 29, 2008 7:19:30 GMT -5
The negativity here is killing me. Its Nov 29th and the only one who hasn't been thrown under the bus yet this season is Monroe and i'm sure his time will come.
This team is so far ahead 06-07 team at the same in Nov. , when we could barely guard Fairfield and Patrick could barely earn 5 minutes a game.
We are missing the defensive stopper in Rivers. clearly evident in the last 5 minutes.
You win and close out games at the end with defense. We are not there yet. The rotation on the help defense we play is still somewhat mechanical you can see us thinking too much instead of reacting and will continue too result in foul trouble inside until resolved with more experience.
Freeman and Sapp continue to get beaten badly off the dribble by any kind of quickness.
Can some also please explain to me why is putting the ball in Sapps hands so much and leaving our best ball handler in Wright playing off the ball. Especially against UT's quickness?
The good thing is outside of Uconn i don't think we will play against the same team speed the rest of the season and yes that includes Memphis.
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PopeJohn2
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Ultimate bailout is yet to come and unavoidable. Uncle Sam gonna pay your debt for you!
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Post by PopeJohn2 on Nov 29, 2008 9:07:54 GMT -5
oh, also i was lamenting that if hibbert had redshirted his freshman year like he was supposed to how mad sick awesome we would be this year. we DEFINITELY would have won yesterday and we would crush unc. can you imagine hibbert vern summers and monroe??? that would be mad sick!
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Nov 29, 2008 12:59:09 GMT -5
As an "outsider," I wasn't as disappointed in the Hoya performance as I was impressed with Tennessee. They are legit. They are extremely athletic and have enough playmakers that they are going to be tough to beat on any night. In spite of that, if you turn around just a couple of plays, then the game goes down to the wire. One play in particular comes to mind. With just a couple of minutes left and down 4, I think, a three on two which should have been an easy hoop was swatted out by one Vol player to another, and it resulted in a breakaway old fashioned 3 point play. We were swimming upstream against a strong current the rest of the way and UT didn't oblige by missing enough free throws. That play and the 3 pointer from that friggin freshman with about a minute to go after 34 1/2 seconds of good defense really did us in. Turn those two plays around and the result may very well have been different. I know, all the plays count, but I'm still impressed by what I saw. I'm telling you right now, Tennessee is going to be around well into the dance.
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