Barack Obama is smart...

[strummer8526]

...and it's amazing that after 8 years of President "I make decisions with my instinct," this country still does not value education. It reminds me of a storyline from the West Wing that was pretty identical to the situation now: no one likes the kid who was first in the class. It may be jealousy or some kind of general deep-seeded anti-intellectualism in this country, but either way I have two problems with it:

First, I DID like the kid who was first in the class. In most instances, the smartest guy is also humble and generous. Best of all, he has knowledge and insight. The guy you have to watch out for is the one who's third in the class and will do anything to get to number one.

Second, it's staggering that in so many cases, raw intelligence is turned into some kind of "elitism" argument. There's nothing "elitist" about being raised by a single mother. There's nothing "elitist" about choosing NOT to make as much money after law school. There's nothing "elitist" about finishing paying off your student loans after you're 45.

I can understand that it's not the best strategy to just say, "I will always vote for the smarter candidate." That's not what I'm advocating. But can we please begin to appreciate nuance--appreciate someone who sees all the shades of gray and wants to examine facts and evidence before making informed decisions. It's been 8 years since we've had a President who I believe has any kind of intellectual merit. Either way, we will have an intelligent, far more thinking president soon enough (thank God). But for some reason, it's consistently turned into a negative for Obama. Once and for all, let's appreciate the brains that some leaders in this country have and stop treating it like a minus.

[TBird41]

Sept 10, 2008 7:27:02 GMT -5 strummer8526 said:

...and it's amazing that after 8 years of President "I make decisions with my instinct," this country still does not value education.

Like having a degree from Harvard and Yale? That kind of education?

;D

[Boz]

Ahhh, the old tried and true "George Bush is stupid" argument.

This is absolutely ridiculous. But if it makes you feel better, by all means, keep watching MTV and keep believing it.

OK, Barack Obama is smart. Wonderful for him. It appears that the argument you are making though -- in addition to saying that the current President is some kind of special needs child -- is that his opponents are NOT smart.

That entire premise is flawed.

First of all, let's get one thing straight. Education does not equal intelligence. They are independent factors.

Secondly, yes, we want educated leaders of course. But everyone on either ticket is highly educated. Nowhere in the Constitution does it require you to go to law school to be President.

Third, there is a difference between nuance and indecision. Barack Obama has shown a lot of evidence of both over the course of his interminable run for office.

Finally, people seem to keep misinterpreting -- deliberately, I think -- the meaning of the word "elitism."

Elitism does not mean you have an education or not. It does not mean you have money or not. It does not even mean you have a high IQ or not. Elitism is an attitude. And yes, Barack Obama has it. He is ridiculously condescending (not just to black people, Rev. Jackson).

But if you really want people to appreciate intelligence, maybe a good way to start would be not to call the other side dumb. I don't think that's too intelligent, do you?

[Elvado]

He'sso smart that he spent the last week touting his qualifications against Sarah Palin, like a carp taking bait.

Then he called her a pig for good measure.

[JohnJacquesLayup]

Sept 10, 2008 7:53:55 GMT -5 Elvado said:

He'sso smart that he spent the last week touting his qualifications against Sarah Palin, like a carp taking bait.

Then he called her a pig for good measure.

I've been following this race fairly closely, and can't figure out if you're kidding or I REALLY missed something. I can just imagine how that line came out: ". . . so she's clearly not ready to run this country! And she's a pig."

[strummer8526]

1. George Bush is not smart. Dad can buy you into whatever schools he wants, but that man is not what I'd call an intellectual powerhouse. This is not a partisan issue. Nixon was smart, Reagan was in many ways smart, Daddy Bush was smart. So were Bill and Al. So are Hillary, Romney, and Joe Biden. George W. Bush is not smart.

And no, education does not equal intelligence. Being EIC of Harvard Law Review means you're intelligent though. It's totally different than bumbling your way into Yale and escaping with a diploma like a thief in the night.

2. I specifically DID NOT say that his opponents are unintelligent. I think quite the opposite. McCain clearly does have strong merits.

3. My POINT is that for some reason, that intelligence is being used only against Obama. Why do I constantly hear his staff meetings called like "The Faculty Lounge"? Yes, he was a professor. Why is that a negative. It baffles me that we DON'T want The Faculty Lounge in the White House.

4. This had nothing to do with MTV (although last night, I did enjoy a few minutes of the recap of the VMAs because the Lil' Wayne performance was alright). I was actually getting frustrated w/ Joe and Pat Buchanan this morning.

5. Sarah Palin called herself a dog. Does either animal reference really matter? Nope. Elvado, you're one of the people who loves saying that she's second on the ticket. So enough about her.

[Elvado]

Agreed. Tell the Dems and their friends in the mainstream media to climb off her back. Every attack made on her shoots her numbers higher. Someone as smart as Barry O should get that.

[Filo]

Great, now we get into intellectual relativism. Seriously, who cares if BO has an IQ that is 10 points higher than the next guy. I think I am smart, but that does not mean I think I can lead the country (although I am williing to give it a whirl if some folks want to fund my candidacy).

This raw intelligence thing is pretty out of control with BO. Yeah, he's smart. So are lots of other folk. If it's all about raw intelligence, why don't we just get Marilyn Vos Savant (or whatever her name is) to run the country. She has all the answers.

It is also pretty silly to say that "the country" does not value education. Perhaps it is the type of education that some parts of the country don't really value. I am not sure everyone in middle America is saying, "Hurrah, Obama was EIC of the Harvard Law Review. I am so excited, since I really want to see another East Coast liberal lawyer running the country."

[Bando]

Sept 10, 2008 7:53:55 GMT -5 Elvado said:

He'sso smart that he spent the last week touting his qualifications against Sarah Palin, like a carp taking bait.

Then he called her a pig for good measure.

No he didn't. If you still think he did, you're either blatantly lying or a complete idiot.

[strummer8526]

Sept 10, 2008 8:31:02 GMT -5 Filo said:

Great, now we get into intellectual relativism. Seriously, who cares if BO has an IQ that is 10 points higher than the next guy. I think I am smart, but that does not mean I think I can lead the country (although I am williing to give it a whirl if some folks want to fund my candidacy).

This raw intelligence thing is pretty out of control with BO. Yeah, he's smart. So are lots of other folk. If it's all about raw intelligence, why don't we just get Marilyn Vos Savant (or whatever her name is) to run the country. She has all the answers.

It is also pretty silly to say that "the country" does not value education. Perhaps it is the type of education that some parts of the country don't really value. I am not sure everyone in middle America is saying, "Hurrah, Obama was EIC of the Harvard Law Review. I am so excited, since I really want to see another East Coast liberal lawyer running the country."

The argument that lots of other people are smart is practically my point! And in 9 out of 10 situations in life, we appreciate someone who's on the ball. "Hey, they guy in the office next to mine is pretty quick. That's good. It's helpful. I'm happy he's not a boob." When's the last time someone has said, "Damn, on this project, I have to rely on that old Harvard Law Review EIC. We're screwed"?

But then, when a Democrat with some book-learnin' shows up, the reaction is to assume that he's an a*hole who sits in an armchair reading all day and has no idea how to improve the lives of non-"east coast liberal elites."

It just doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. I'm not saying that his education/intelligence should be a reason TO vote for him or a huge "++" on the letter grade you give him. But it should really stop being a basis for attacks and for negative opinions.

[TBird41]

Sept 10, 2008 9:41:30 GMT -5 strummer8526 said:

Sept 10, 2008 8:31:02 GMT -5 Filo said:

Great, now we get into intellectual relativism. Seriously, who cares if BO has an IQ that is 10 points higher than the next guy. I think I am smart, but that does not mean I think I can lead the country (although I am williing to give it a whirl if some folks want to fund my candidacy).

This raw intelligence thing is pretty out of control with BO. Yeah, he's smart. So are lots of other folk. If it's all about raw intelligence, why don't we just get Marilyn Vos Savant (or whatever her name is) to run the country. She has all the answers.

It is also pretty silly to say that "the country" does not value education. Perhaps it is the type of education that some parts of the country don't really value. I am not sure everyone in middle America is saying, "Hurrah, Obama was EIC of the Harvard Law Review. I am so excited, since I really want to see another East Coast liberal lawyer running the country."

The argument that lots of other people are smart is practically my point! And in 9 out of 10 situations in life, we appreciate someone who's on the ball. "Hey, they guy in the office next to mine is pretty quick. That's good. It's helpful. I'm happy he's not a boob." When's the last time someone has said, "Damn, on this project, I have to rely on that old Harvard Law Review EIC. We're screwed"?

But then, when a Democrat with some book-learnin' shows up, the reaction is to assume that he's an a*hole who sits in an armchair reading all day and has no idea how to improve the lives of non-"east coast liberal elites."

It just doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. I'm not saying that his education/intelligence should be a reason TO vote for him or a huge "++" on the letter grade you give him. But it should really stop being a basis for attacks and for negative opinions.

Well, he did claim that people are clinging to their guns and religion because their bitter...that kind of comment tends to make one look like they think they're smarter than everyone else

[JohnJacquesLayup]

Sept 10, 2008 9:49:55 GMT -5 TBird41 said:

Well, he did claim that people are clinging to their guns and religion because their bitter...that kind of comment tends to make one look like they think they're smarter than everyone else

They're.

[TBird41]

Sept 10, 2008 9:55:35 GMT -5 JohnJacquesLayup said:

Sept 10, 2008 9:49:55 GMT -5 TBird41 said:

Well, he did claim that people are clinging to their guns and religion because their bitter...that kind of comment tends to make one look like they think they're smarter than everyone else

They're.

Figures I would do something like that. Just figures.

[Elvado]

Bando:

While you are technically correct, is it lost on you that one week after she references being a pitbull "with lipstick" in her speech and the entire left wing hit squad attempts to damage her (and fails) that Barry would use the "lipstick on a pig" reference?

Barry O's camp is unglued over Sarah Palin and it shows.

[Bando]

Sept 10, 2008 10:09:55 GMT -5 Elvado said:

Bando:

While you are technically correct, is it lost on you that one week after she references being a pitbull "with lipstick" in her speech and the entire left wing hit squad attempts to damage her (and fails) that Barry would use the "lipstick on a pig" reference?

Barry O's camp is unglued over Sarah Palin and it shows.

The Republican Party: Banking on Bull since 2000!

[Elvado]

Bando:

I respect your passion and I respect your intellect. We'll just have to disagree on this one.

If you don't think that line was targeted at her based on her use of the lipstick line in her speech,then I take you at your word and respectfully differ.

[kchoya]

Sept 10, 2008 9:36:59 GMT -5 Bando said:

Sept 10, 2008 7:53:55 GMT -5 Elvado said:

He'sso smart that he spent the last week touting his qualifications against Sarah Palin, like a carp taking bait.

Then he called her a pig for good measure.

No he didn't. If you still think he did, you're either blatantly lying or a complete idiot.

Did he say, "Sarah Palin is a pig" ? No, he didn't. But I would hope you were sober enough during your time at Georgetown to realize that there are more subtle ways to say something then coming out and directly saying it.

He knew what he was saying and the effect it would have. I'm glad he's getting down in the mud (pun intended) and focusing all his attention on the GOP VP candidate. It only hurts his campaign.

[strummer8526]

I'm just completely over Sarah Palin. I see nothing (or very, very little) good in her as a candidate. Others disagree. Whatever. As much as I think there are dozens of things about her that should reflect poorly on McCain, that doesn't seem to be the way this race is going. Moving along...

[HealyHoya]

Intelligence is terrific. Both JSM and BHO are intelligent. We can certainly debate the IQ differential between the two but that debate is too narrowly focused. If JSM "suffers" from a minor raw IQ deficit vis-a-vis BHO (which I am not conceding), I would suggest that the addition of the experience factor moves JSM ahead. That's just my opinion.

Raw, IQ-type intellect doesn't make up for a complete lack of military experience. IQ doesn't account for the transformative experience of serving in war, leading men, forming an appreciation for your country while being tortured year after year, and so forth.
Again, in my opinion, such experience is tremendously valuable, especially in an executive position.

Obama's intellect is great and best used within the legislative process. While I disagreed with the vast majority of his positions, there is no doubt that the superior intellect of Daniel Patrick Moynihan made this nation better. There is a former Congressman from California named Tom Campbell. He made a very good congressman but he was never a legitimate candidate for President. His IQ? Who knows. His intellect? Who knows. His resume? BA, MA, PhD Economics, University of Chicago; JD, Harvard Law School; White House Fellow; youngest tenured law professor, Stanford Law School; congressman at 36; and so forth.

It ain't about the smartest but the best equipped to lead.

[Bando]

Sept 10, 2008 10:37:44 GMT -5 kchoya said:

Sept 10, 2008 9:36:59 GMT -5 Bando said:

No he didn't. If you still think he did, you're either blatantly lying or a complete idiot.

Did he say, "Sarah Palin is a pig" ? No, he didn't. But I would hope you were sober enough during your time at Georgetown to realize that there are more subtle ways to say something then coming out and directly saying it.

He knew what he was saying and the effect it would have. I'm glad he's getting down in the mud (pun intended) and focusing all his attention on the GOP VP candidate. It only hurts his campaign.

The full context of Obama's quote:

John McCain says he’s about change, too — except for economic policy, health care policy, tax policy, education policy, foreign policy and Karl Rove-style politics. That’s just calling the same thing something different.”

With a laugh, he added: “You can put lipstick on a pig; it’s still a pig. You can wrap an old fish in a piece of paper called change; it’s still going to stink after eight years.”

I reiterate: continuing to claim that Obama called Palin a pig, either directly or indirectly, your are either a liar or a moron.