SFOHoya
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 503
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Post by SFOHoya on Jun 20, 2008 17:51:39 GMT -5
Are the Turks the team of destiny (like Greece last time)? Amazing!
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The Stig
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,844
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Post by The Stig on Jun 20, 2008 18:49:10 GMT -5
Are the Turks the team of destiny (like Greece last time)? Amazing! It would be quite the irony if they were, since Turkey and Greece aren't exactly best friends!
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Post by HometownHoya on Jun 20, 2008 19:52:17 GMT -5
Can't believe it ended like that. Croatia had a few chances earlier in the game that they should have converted. Germany will be licking their chops to be facing this team plagued with injuries and suspensions.
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The Stig
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,844
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Post by The Stig on Jun 21, 2008 16:18:23 GMT -5
Whoa.....
Guus Hiddink strikes again!
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FLHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Proud Member of Generation Burton
Posts: 4,544
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Post by FLHoya on Jun 21, 2008 16:27:51 GMT -5
Andrei Arshavin, ladies and gentlemen. Jeebus. Unexpected but highly deserved for Russia and their--bizarrely--mostly shirtless fans.
The last two games have been absolutely thrilling stuff, so much for soccer being boring huh? Get Spain through tomorrow and we'll have 3.25 exciting teams in the semifinals and two great underdog stories to boot.
Side note--are there only like three match referees left in all of UEFA? Seems like the entire tournament is some combo of Herbert Fandel, Roberto Rosetti (yesterday) and Lubos Michel (today).
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moe09
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,101
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Post by moe09 on Jun 21, 2008 20:50:02 GMT -5
Except for the whole Spain getting through tomorrow. Forza Azzurri!
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moe09
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,101
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Post by moe09 on Jun 22, 2008 16:33:51 GMT -5
Well, the story of tonight was clearly the mustache of Toni. I mean, what was that guy thinking? Doesn't he own a mirror?
Seriously, though, entertaining match for a 0-0 drought. Toni really needed to cash in on some of those opportunities, though, I mean if Totti wasn't such a sissy, and he played for the national team, the Azzurri could've taken this one. Of course, it's always nice having Gianluca Buffon in goal, not to mention their defense held off some strong attacks from Spain. Still don't know how I feel about the shootout endings, but it is what it is.
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fatthew
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 115
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Post by fatthew on Jun 22, 2008 21:45:20 GMT -5
Best part of the match for me was listening to Andy Gray rip the refs, then rip the players for flopping, then rip the refs again for not carding the players who flopped. It is a joy to hear an announcer really take it to the officials... ESPN should have him on its NBA announcing team.
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thornski
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 155
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Post by thornski on Jun 22, 2008 22:20:42 GMT -5
I'm extremely happy they brought on Andy Gray for this tournament. A really excellent soccer commentator (I believe he's normally with Sky Sports?). A total breath of fresh air, and he always tells it like it is with regards to the flopping and such as you mentioned, fatthew...(he especially went completely off on Di Natale if I remember correctly).
Was happy for Spain. Italy definitely had their game plan to play very well defensively, and I think they executed it well, but in my mind Spain were deserving winners.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Jun 24, 2008 9:14:11 GMT -5
That italy game was depressing. but it was amazing watching it in italy in the middle of a piazza surrounded by italians and a smattering of Spain supporters. Really upset they lost. The enviornment was so incredible.
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moe09
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,101
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Post by moe09 on Jun 24, 2008 17:41:24 GMT -5
Flopping is one thing that I just can't take in soccer. I only got to listen to the game with Italian commentary, and they never mention it, unless I just don't know what the word for "flopping" is in Italian, but I'm glad someone is mentioning it. It won't go away, though, until the refs stop blowing the whistles for it.
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thornski
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 155
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Post by thornski on Jun 25, 2008 12:39:32 GMT -5
The diving and exaggeration of injuries on the foul itself has always been a problem for many many tournaments and I agree it's really disgusting.
I think an arguably bigger problem this tournament at least is the (very related) problem of players really abusing the "fair play" principle by staying down when a foul is not called, the player is obviously not really hurt, and the opposing team feels forced to kick it out so he can "get attention" - even if the other team has a decent counterattack going or has a favorable position on the field (and of course the player suddenly becomes OK as soon as the ball is kicked out). Andy Gray has mentioned this a bunch too during these games.
Not sure how you can really deal with this stuff other than more yellow cards for diving or more warnings/suspensions after a post-match review by UEFA...
Hope we get a good game today...is it basically guaranteed now that Turkey will score at least one goal in the 88th+ minute?
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,899
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Post by SFHoya99 on Jun 25, 2008 12:59:00 GMT -5
I deal with the flopping by not watching soccer. It completely destroys the sport when entire teams have a basic offensive strategy to fall down so they can get a free kick. Yes, I know that basketball players flop all the time and try to get fouls more than make the shot, too, but it doesn't have an much an effect on the game.
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Boz
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
123 Fireballs!
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Post by Boz on Jun 25, 2008 13:20:24 GMT -5
Well, I actually had a much longer response written here, but my browser just crashed, so I'll simply ask a question:
Why does soccer only have one referee?
OK, I'll answer it too.
I took a look at the rule book and it seems that the assistants/linesmen are allowed to make some infraction calls if the referee doesn't see them, but these seem to limited to hand balls on most occasions. I never see the linesmen making foul calls. Mostly, they stick to OB, offsides and corners.
Hockey has a small ice surface and has two referees and two linesmen for each game. Soccer's playing field is HUGE in comparison, and they only have one. I think they need at least two, maybe three.
I think this would help a lot with the flopping. I saw some replays in the Italy-Spain match where a player went down but there was no contact. But in real time -- and from a distance which, with one referee, seems to be the case more often than not -- they sure looked like contact was made. I can't really blame the referee for making those calls, and not calling a dive instead.
Also, Andy Grey was pretty upset that calls being made in mid-field were not being made in or around the penalty area. Well, duh! Mid-field calls are not likely to be game changers. Calls in the box are. If the ref is not right on top of the play, I don't blame them for exercising a little more caution about calling a foul in the penalty area.
If it were up to me, I'd have three referees for soccer, one for each offensive zone and one for the midfield area. I realize this could cause a problem if there was disagreement on a call, but I think the benefits outweigh the risks. I think it would allow the referees to stay much closer to the play and be sure of making calls on whether a player was fouled, flopped, or maybe just slipped.
The alternative is to have the assistants making more calls, but I think they should stick to what they're doing. Offsides is so close all the time, they should be focusing on that.
So, there you have it. More referees = better calls and less flopping (or better enforcement of flopping). With the exception of that wuss Alexei Kovalev, who flops like a beached whale, hockey seems to have gotten rid of diving in large part.
Also, the running clock and the "allowance time at the referee's discretion" are stupid, anachronistic rules. Get rid of them.
Other than that, I think this is a great sport and I love watching it.
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moe09
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,101
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Post by moe09 on Jun 25, 2008 13:36:56 GMT -5
I think we all know the reason for 1 referee in soccer: inefficient European bureaucracy! You've gotta keep it up in all aspects of society! Seriously, though, Boz is right. 3 would definitely be a good number. There's really no reason for this not to happen.
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thornski
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 155
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Post by thornski on Jun 25, 2008 15:48:40 GMT -5
Of all games, THIS is the one where there had to be TV technical difficulties caused by bad weather?!??!? What a finish again!
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,387
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Post by hifigator on Jun 25, 2008 16:03:00 GMT -5
That was a great game. It was about as exciting as soccer can get. Germany started out looking like an outclassed team, but after they got the goal to tie it at 1 it was a different contest. I got busy with customers and missed both teams second goals. I heard the roar on the last goal and ran over to see the replay and I couldn't believe it was 3-2. It was 1-1 when I started helping the customers. That's a funny thing about soccer when that happens. You go something like 70 minutes without a goal and then have 3 in ten minutes. Still, that was quite a game. Does it qualify as an "instant classic?"
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2008 16:03:40 GMT -5
Germany gave Turkey a taste of its own medicine with the late winner. Wow - what a finish...
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njhoya06
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 228
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Post by njhoya06 on Jun 26, 2008 18:51:29 GMT -5
Hope Torres is saving it for the finals. Spain had one heck of a second half today.
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SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
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Post by SirSaxa on Jun 27, 2008 4:13:59 GMT -5
Germany gave Turkey a taste of its own medicine with the late winner. Wow - what a finish... Oddly, I happened to catch the end of a couple games (Ger v Turkey). They are becoming like the NBA, just tune in to the last 5 minutes.
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