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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2006 16:29:51 GMT -5
I feel like I'm not. Everywhere I turn these days, there are complaints about one aspect of the NFL or another.
The announcers are terrible, reporting on the league is terrible, network broadcasts are terrible, there are too many rules, there are now rules that effect/alter other rules (that stupid "I'll trade you a 10-second runoff for an extra timeout" moment in last night's game... and I was rooting for Carolina), quarterbacks are treated like fine china, players caught CHEATING using steroids are given a free pass by fans and the media, players who are taking medication to LIVE are suspended under those same "banned substance" rules (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2687451), more players arrested than the worst years of the NBA (and that's just the Bengals), more and more MEDIOCRE play league-wide (some call it "parity"), the owners take a little more fun out of the league every year...
... ugh. I love football. A lot. I'm a die hard fan of the SPORT. Unfortunately, I'm starting to get tired of the LEAGUE and its Teflon qualities. The worst part is, I'm not sure what needs to be done to fix the "problem," if there even is one. Sorry for the rant, I just thought venting here might help me find a few more frustrated souls.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Dec 5, 2006 16:38:08 GMT -5
Who cares about football???
The Bruins are creeping up out of last place and into playoff contention, bay-bee!!!!
;D
As much as all of the collateral issues may be annoying, I don't think I'll ever get tired of the NFL.
I have cut back on the number of games I watch each week, though, so maybe you have a point.
Samuel L. Jackson's character in "Unbreakable" could play quarterback in the NFL these days, that much is true. And it sucks.
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ichirohoya
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Post by ichirohoya on Dec 5, 2006 16:45:49 GMT -5
I agree with much of what you're saying. The roughing the passer rule is one of those calls that always has the potential to really alter the outcome of games. Clearly its in the head of players (see Titans vs Giants in week 13) and it doesnt keep headline QBs off of IR (see McNaab, Donovan and Culpepper, Daunte).
The league must have some kind of deal with the press over the Shawn Merriman business. If this was Albert Pujols or Ryan Howard testing positive for something that counts as 'roids-- think it would have lead off on Sportscenter every night?? My guess is YES!
Where we disagree a little is on "parity." I don't think thats necessarily a bad thing nor merely another word for mediocre play. As a Ravens fan, I'm a benificiary of the defending champion Steelers tanking this year-- so- at least today- i think that "parity" is a good thing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2006 17:21:56 GMT -5
ichiro - I think we are discussing "parity" on two different levels. I agree with you - it isn't such a bad thing for the league that SEASON TO SEASON different teams rise and fall.
My complaint is that league wide WITHIN A SEASON the play is so mediocre. Average. Good football is rarely played by two teams in the same game. More often than not, its a battle of who makes fewer mistakes. Look at the standings and check out how many teams are within a game or two of .500. Some people think that's the beauty of the NFL, but more and more I see it as poor coaching, poorly built teams, players that aren't 100% dedicated to their craft... mediocrity all around.
For example, my beloved Bills pretty much stink at 5-7. Yet they have lost to the Patriots, Jets, Lions, Colts and Chargers (four of which are considered "elite" teams) by a COMBINED 17 points. I know I'm not UNDERrating the Bills... as RDF would say, I know what I see, and I see crap... I just think the product the league is putting before us week in and week out has gotten rather sloppy.
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Post by AustinHoya03 on Dec 5, 2006 17:36:12 GMT -5
more and more MEDIOCRE play league-wide (some call it "parity"), the owners take a little more fun out of the league every year... This is really it for me. At this juncture, I know EXACTLY what I am going to get when I watch an NFL game, and it's more or less the same every time. Rarely do I see a great game anymore. And often, the "great games" are games that happened to come down to the wire between two average teams. There are few big games or great teams in the NFL anymore. And with a weekly sport, that kills the anticipation interest, which is a big deal in football. I think that "parity" affects the reporting on the league as well. The Merril Hoges of the world could get things right more often in the age of the dynasty. "The Bills are going to be good this season" was an easy call for quite some time from 1990 on. Now, who knows? Except for a few good analysts out there, everyone is guessing. I think the parity affects the coverage in another critical way as well. Teams are no longer the story, star players/coaches are the story. While true stars (Lawrence Taylor, Jerry Rice) have always been media stories, I don't need to know about T.O.'s every utterance. And it seems like every time I flip Sportscenter on before bed, there is a Bill Parcells Press Conference of High Importance being shown. For me, and others who didn't grow up in an NFL city and don't live in an NFL city, the parity makes the first part of the season completely unwatchable. I know that after 8 weeks, the majority of teams are going to be 3-5, 4-4, or 5-3. Since I have no heavy rooting interest and no consistent media coverage, why bother tuning in before the playoff hunt? Look at the current standings and see how many teams are 5-7, 6-6, or 7-5. Sixteen. While parity might make the season interesting for diehards, it leaves those of us outside of NFL markets yearning for the Cowboys dynasty days. |
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Post by RockawayHoya on Dec 5, 2006 18:48:01 GMT -5
I'm not sick of the NFL. It would take a lot for me to consider it dead like I do hockey (which lost me after the strike). But the roughing the passer calls are just absolute garbage and it NEEDS to be addressed. In addition to the Kiwanuka play you cited RB, Dwight Freeney did the same thing to Brady in the Pats game. Defenders are now literally afraid to hit the QB, and it's ruining the game. And for what? To keep QBs healthy? Look at this list of QBs who have missed time this year due to injury:
Donovan McNabb
Daunte Culpepper
Trent Green
Ben Rothlisberger
Byron Leftwich
Aaron Brooks
Chris Simms
Matt Hasslebeck
And that doesn't even include guys who missed parts of games, like Charlie Frye, David Carr, Brett Favre, and Mark Brunell (I think). A lot of good the RTP calls are doing to protect QBs. I bet the old school QBs in their respective studios (Young, Aikman, Jaworski, Theismann, Marino, Boomer, etc.) have a lot less respect for today's QBs and their inability to stay healthy, considering if you even breathe on them these days it's 15 yards.
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Joe Hoya
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Post by Joe Hoya on Dec 6, 2006 0:05:19 GMT -5
Clearly its in the head of players (see Titans vs Giants in week 13) and it doesnt keep headline QBs off of IR (see McNaab, Donovan and Culpepper, Daunte). Daunte Culpepper is still a headline QB? Thanks for telling me. Last night's game was pretty good. I know I'm just a slight bit biased but, results aside, the second half was two teams getting after each other, trading points on every possession until one team forced the other into a mistake. Jeff Garcia took two devastating helmet-to-helmet hits on back-to-back plays, but only one of them was flagged. The second (unflagged) one was a little late, as well. By the way, when the fans essentially booed Garcia getting up...not one of our finer moments, I will say. Keyshawn Johnson throwing a temper-tantrum because Lito Sheppard played spectacular, legal defense...a fine, fine moment indeed. |
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Dec 6, 2006 9:16:45 GMT -5
more and more MEDIOCRE play league-wide (some call it "parity"), the owners take a little more fun out of the league every year... This is really it for me. At this juncture, I know EXACTLY what I am going to get when I watch an NFL game, and it's more or less the same every time. Rarely do I see a great game anymore. And often, the "great games" are games that happened to come down to the wire between two average teams. There are few big games or great teams in the NFL anymore. And with a weekly sport, that kills the anticipation interest, which is a big deal in football. I think that "parity" affects the reporting on the league as well. The Merril Hoges of the world could get things right more often in the age of the dynasty. "The Bills are going to be good this season" was an easy call for quite some time from 1990 on. Now, who knows? Except for a few good analysts out there, everyone is guessing. I think the parity affects the coverage in another critical way as well. Teams are no longer the story, star players/coaches are the story. While true stars (Lawrence Taylor, Jerry Rice) have always been media stories, I don't need to know about T.O.'s every utterance. And it seems like every time I flip Sportscenter on before bed, there is a Bill Parcells Press Conference of High Importance being shown. For me, and others who didn't grow up in an NFL city and don't live in an NFL city, the parity makes the first part of the season completely unwatchable. I know that after 8 weeks, the majority of teams are going to be 3-5, 4-4, or 5-3. Since I have no heavy rooting interest and no consistent media coverage, why bother tuning in before the playoff hunt? Look at the current standings and see how many teams are 5-7, 6-6, or 7-5. Sixteen. While parity might make the season interesting for diehards, it leaves those of us outside of NFL markets yearning for the Cowboys dynasty days. Aside from the Vikings, I feel pretty much the same way you do, Austin. The other games just don't really interest me b/c they're pretty much mediocre slopfests that hinge on turnovers. The fact that da Bears are 10-2 this year despite Grossman says a lot about the quality of play. That team is good on defense, but they aren't 2000 Ravens / 1985 Bears good, and yet all the offenses they're playing are so bad they are carrying that team. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2006 9:35:10 GMT -5
Rockaway - It ain't dead to me, but I think TBird and Austin are onto something.
Outside of the Bills, I find little reason to watch any other games. There used to be a time when I couldn't get enough of the NFL, but it is now at the point where - outside the random Pats-Colts game, for example - every other game hardly interests me anymore.
Why watch the Bears? I know they're going to win or lose a 13-10 game. The Chargers and Cowboys are starting to get "fun," but every other "top" team in the league plays in snooze-fests more often than not. Four exciting teams out of 32 doesn't make for an enjoyable league week-to-week.
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ichirohoya
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Post by ichirohoya on Dec 6, 2006 13:36:02 GMT -5
That team is good on defense, but they aren't 2000 Ravens / 1985 Bears good, and yet all the offenses they're playing are so bad they are carrying that team. Thanks for giving the 2000 Ravens their due shout-out. |
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Dec 6, 2006 15:33:24 GMT -5
Brad Johnson was QB-ing the Vikes towards the playoffs. LI thought Bartolo Colon winning the 2005 Cy Young was absurd but the SP in the American League just werent good that year. Then sure enough Johan was great this year. I think something similar will happen with the teams in the NFL. Just one of those things. I'm not "frustrated" with the league though. Two issues with your post. 1) Brad Johnson was NOT QB-ing the Vikes towards the playoffs last year. He just wasn't getting in the way of the defense and special teams like he has this year. No one says that Trent Dilfer QB-ed the Ravens to their Super Bowl title, and they shouldn't act like Brad Johnson was the reason for the Vikes turn around last year. 2) Johan should have won the Cy Young in 2005, but voters couldn't deal with his lack of wins (he only had 16) due to a lack of run support. I mean, he lead the AL in Ks, and was second in ERA by a tenth of a run. I don't want to hijack this thread, but you can't say that his 2005 season wasn't deserving of a Cy Young or even mediocre. sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=4280 |
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Dec 6, 2006 19:04:22 GMT -5
Two issues with your post. 1) Brad Johnson was NOT QB-ing the Vikes towards the playoffs last year. He just wasn't getting in the way of the defense and special teams like he has this year. No one says that Trent Dilfer QB-ed the Ravens to their Super Bowl title, and they shouldn't act like Brad Johnson was the reason for the Vikes turn around last year. 2) Johan should have won the Cy Young in 2005, but voters couldn't deal with his lack of wins (he only had 16) due to a lack of run support. I mean, he lead the AL in Ks, and was second in ERA by a tenth of a run. I don't want to hijack this thread, but you can't say that his 2005 season wasn't deserving of a Cy Young or even mediocre. sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/stats?playerId=4280 Uhoh, the nitpick police from Minnesoter are out.....if you really want to nitpick those two little things, cool.... --Brad Johnson finished the season 7-2 as the QB for the Vikings, if you have your "issues" with saying that a quarterback on a team heading towards the playoffs was "quarterbacking a team toward the playoffs" then I apologize a thousand times; it was an interesting storyline for a team that still had mike tice and culpepper.....it was really a minor point, but since you asked.... Peyton Manning is quarterbacking the Colts to the playoffs. Brad Johnson was the quarterback on a team making a playoff push. See the difference? And really, a quarterback's win/loss record says absolutely nothing about their performance (though it keeps getting referenced for some obnoxious reason). Really it's lazy analysis, and it's emblematic of a media that does an awful job covering football. And last year also had a lot examples of a league that isn't as good as it once was--the Vikings won a game where they had more points than yards for most of the game. The Skins set a record for worst offensive output of a playoff game winner. The Super Bowl was horribly officiated (and Big Ben set a record for worst performance by a Super Bowl winning QB). Bettis forgot to protect the ball when the Steelres were closing out the 2nd round game against the Colts. The Giants flamed out badly in the first round. Just sloppy, sloppy football, really. [And Dux--why the names? Were you worried your arguments couldn't stand up on their own, and thus felt the need to belittle me in an attempt to weaken my points?] |
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JimmyHoya
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Post by JimmyHoya on Dec 6, 2006 19:37:38 GMT -5
As a Redskin fan, of course I am sick of the season. The only time I year I'm not sick of the NFL is during the summer camps when I can pencil us in for the Superbowl and not have to answer to anyone or anything.
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Joe Hoya
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Post by Joe Hoya on Dec 6, 2006 20:11:40 GMT -5
TBird...QBs are judged on wins and losses, much like coaches. See McNabb, Donovan. Best QB...by far, there will be no debate on this issue, Giants/Falcons/Seahawks fans...in the NFC. He is constantly treated by his home fans like a second-class athlete. Why? 2002 NFC Championship...2003 NFC Championship...2004 NFC Championship...Super Bowl XXXIX...he's won a turd-load of games, much like Peyton Manning...but only once has he won a "big one." If your QB is 7-2, and your team is making a run at the postseason...the two are directly related. He may not be lighting it up, but the quarterback is the single most important player on the football field.
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Post by StPetersburgHoya (Inactive) on Dec 6, 2006 20:35:36 GMT -5
Any league that gives you this:
must be ok.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2006 10:35:50 GMT -5
NOW I'm sick of the NFL.....
I have the NFL Network on my cable system. I flipped to it at 8:00 last night, only to be greeted by some NFL Films garbage, and the following (paraphrased) scrolling across the screen: "You are not able to watch tonight's game because you do not have the NFL Network Games Package. Without the NFL Games Package, you are unable tonight's game unless you are in greater Pittsburgh or greater Cleveland. Call [some 1-800 number] now to get the NFL Games Package, or you will miss out on future NFL Network games...."
WHAT?!?!?!?!
Not that I really cared about the game, but ARE YOU KIDDING ME? It's not enough to have the NFL Network (and apparently, I'm one of 87 people in the country who have it), but I need their "Games Package" too? They should be flattered that I even bothered to think about watching that dreck last night...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2006 11:40:10 GMT -5
NOW I'm sick of the NFL..... I have the NFL Network on my cable system. I flipped to it at 8:00 last night, only to be greeted by some NFL Films garbage, and the following (paraphrased) scrolling across the screen: "You are not able to watch tonight's game because you do not have the NFL Network Games Package. Without the NFL Games Package, you are unable tonight's game unless you are in greater Pittsburgh or greater Cleveland. Call [some 1-800 number] now to get the NFL Games Package, or you will miss out on future NFL Network games...." WHAT?!?!?!?! Not that I really cared about the game, but ARE YOU KIDDING ME? It's not enough to have the NFL Network (and apparently, I'm one of 87 people in the country who have it), but I need their "Games Package" too? They should be flattered that I even bothered to think about watching that dreck last night... Give it a couple of years, Cam. By then, I GUARANTEE either Monday Night or Sunday Night Football will be on the NFL Network permanently. Hell, they've already prepped people for the move by shoving Monday Night Football onto cable. That, on top of these stuipd Thursday night games. Or the Saturday games that start this week or next week. Eventually the networks are only going to be left with Sunday afternoon games, and the NFL Network will "flex" all the marquee games to their network for prime-time viewing, whether it be Sunday or Monday night. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 8, 2006 11:50:44 GMT -5
It's ridiculous. I just went to the NFL Network website, and there's no mention of any "Games Package" anywhere that I could find. I guess it's some arbitrary something that someone came up with.
What a big, steaming pile of crap.
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HealyHoya
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Post by HealyHoya on Dec 13, 2006 17:50:16 GMT -5
Yes. The NFL is the most professionally packaged major sport. It is a marketing, licensing, ratings monster. It is popular in every geographic demographic, economic demographic, age demographic and shows the most consistent viewership level across race/ethnicity. If you are sick and tired of the NFL, you are in the, ahem, minority.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Dec 13, 2006 18:22:57 GMT -5
Yes. The NFL is the most professionally packaged major sport. It is a marketing, licensing, ratings monster. It is popular in every geographic demographic, economic demographic, age demographic and shows the most consistent viewership level across race/ethnicity. If you are sick and tired of the NFL, you are in the, ahem, minority. Wasn't that true of the NBA Bird/Magic/Jordan years? Baseball for most of the 19th century? Any product can alienate its customer base if it isn't careful. |
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