|
Post by hoyas2008 on Jul 24, 2006 13:51:24 GMT -5
While I havent seen any Kenner games this summer, I have to say that while he wasn't "good" at being selfish in the Mcdonald's All-American game, he did have some nice plays (including a very nice alley-oop dunk). I'm not doubting Macklin, I think he has unlimited potential.
|
|
GIGAFAN99
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,487
|
Post by GIGAFAN99 on Jul 24, 2006 14:01:54 GMT -5
I'm with you there too. I don't think Macklin's stock has dropped as much as it was set ridiculously high (it was the anti-Ignatius hype of Roy). People actually said he might start over Roy. That was, shall we say, a bit ambitious.
But he is as good as realistically advertised, so he's not out of the equation or anything. It's just that Summers' all-around game is more developed at this minute, not that he'll always be ahead of Macklin or that Macklin isn't a tremendous prospect.
|
|
SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,791
|
Post by SFHoya99 on Jul 24, 2006 14:15:33 GMT -5
It's interesting how Macklin's stock has dropped compared to when we first got his verbal. I'm hoping he pleasantly surprises as the backup to Roy/Jeff inside. If he's coachable, he has the raw talent. That talent hasn't displayed well in relatively uncoached AAU and Kenner League play, but maybe the staff can develop him to do certain things. We need rebounding and that should be his strength. I think his stock has dropped a little bit with gurus, but I think people have just understood his game a bit better and where his strengths/weaknesses are. Macklin has always been a high upside guy, not a project but certainly not a Top 15 guy for his polish. Things like rebounding and defense are his strengths and at the same time are harder to measure. (To see what I mean, remember how disappointed some were with his McD's game, where he had six boards in ten minutes?) However, I think that we've also been spoiled by how good Jeff was at the noticeable things...freshmen forwards who are actually 18 rarely play like Jeff. I bet Vernon is a significant contributor this year, getting between 12-15 mpg, filling in for Roy mostly and showing more than just flashes of brilliance.
|
|
|
Post by hoyas2008 on Jul 24, 2006 14:18:44 GMT -5
Not to mention some electrifying plays that will get momentum going. If he can do that, I'll be very content. Oh and some sweet dunks at Midnight Madness
|
|
SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,791
|
Post by SFHoya99 on Jul 24, 2006 14:23:34 GMT -5
My best guess at BE-style minutes:
Roy: 28 mpg Jeff: 33 mpg Pat: 25 mpg Jesse: 30 mpg Jon: 35 mpg
Mack: 15 mpg DaJuan: 19 mpg Marc: 12 mpg JR/JT: 3 mpg
|
|
|
Post by hoyas2008 on Jul 24, 2006 14:32:25 GMT -5
You think Tyler isn't gonna get substantial minutes? I'd give him at least 12-15 per game
|
|
YB
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,494
|
Post by YB on Jul 24, 2006 14:33:14 GMT -5
I'm thinking Tyler at the 2, Summers at the 3- Ewing may be better for energy off the bench- but I may be way off. I was just thinking of getting the 2 best players who can shoot 3s on the floor to compliment our front court.
|
|
hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,346
|
Post by hoyaboy1 on Jul 24, 2006 14:41:23 GMT -5
I really don't understand why people think Crawford has a chance to start. Consider:
1 - Last year as a freshman Sapp played a major role, while Crawford played none despite a year in the system.
2 - Jumps between freshman and sophomore year are usually bigger than between sophomore and junior year.
3 - Sapp is playing with Hibbert on Clyde's - he replaced Cook in that role.
4 - In my opinion, he has looked a lot better overall than Tyler this summer.
I just can't figure out why people think Tyler is going to make what would be a huge leap over Sapp. Last year he never played; why is he suddenly above a freshman that play a lot last year? A shout out by coach to a guy we already knew was a hard worker isn't near enough evidence.
I would generally agree with SFHoya's minute projections, except that I have no idea who will be getting the minutes he gave to Egerson.
|
|
SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,791
|
Post by SFHoya99 on Jul 24, 2006 14:49:48 GMT -5
You think Tyler isn't gonna get substantial minutes? I'd give him at least 12-15 per game If you feel Tyler will beat out Marc, you can give him Marc's minutes. The two play a very similar game, as far as I can tell. I don't think they will both get minutes. Whoever wins that competition will be the third guard, I think. People seem to be assuming Tyler's PT based upon Thompson's remark at the banquet last year. I read that comment completely differently than most. Tyler is an off-the-court leader, and so Thompson was saying (to my thinking) that Tyler deserved more PT not because he was better than Marc but because that kind of work ethic and leadership should be rewarded. I personally think the comment was meant both to reward Tyler and spur Marc to work harder. I sang the praises of Tyler last year before the season (search for the "Case for Tyler Crawford"). But reality is that III gave Marc those minutes. Now Tyler makes sharper cuts and looks like he plays better D, but Marc got the minutes. So I gots to go with that. I just really don't see us going past the 8 man rotation except for a few emergency minutes to another guard.
|
|
YB
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,494
|
Post by YB on Jul 24, 2006 14:56:23 GMT -5
I'm basing it on Tyler's having 2 years in the system, being strong and able to shoot 3s. Look at Marc- he couldn't smell the floor the last 1/2 of the season. Sapp is a backup 2 in my book- and that will largely be his role, with some run alongside JW and the rest in a smaller lineup. But Sapp can't shoot- and Tyler can. I guess my projection was based on the different lineup situation we have coming up this year.
It is nice to have options, no?
|
|
hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,346
|
Post by hoyaboy1 on Jul 24, 2006 15:02:55 GMT -5
I think you are grossly overestimating Tyler's ability to shoot. I'm also not sure how important him being strong is, since Sapp is just as good a rebounder and solid enough for a SG himself. He is also quicker laterally on defense than Tyler, making up for any problems his strength might cause.
I also don't see the relevance of his 2 years in the system, since his experience advantage last year got him nothing, and the returns on year 2 can't be greater than what Sapp learned in year 1.
I would be shocked if Tyler started. I'd offer 9-1 if i was a bookie.
|
|
|
Post by TrueHoyaBlue on Jul 24, 2006 15:11:01 GMT -5
|
|
hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,346
|
Post by hoyaboy1 on Jul 24, 2006 15:18:39 GMT -5
And that's a good argument for him to be the 3rd guard, but not to hop over Sapp and start.
|
|
YB
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,494
|
Post by YB on Jul 24, 2006 16:10:08 GMT -5
If our team breakdown was similar to last year's- where we had plenty of outside shooting, and need slashing and passing- I'd say Sapp over TC (and apparently, so did III). But because it's a different mix on the team now, I'd give the edge to TC unless he totally bombs. Plus Coach likes TC's work ethic and panned Jessie's.
Then again, this is all speculative, right? I mean, if we were coach we'd all have done things a little different, so we'll just have to see.
|
|
SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,791
|
Post by SFHoya99 on Jul 24, 2006 16:14:15 GMT -5
Panned Jesse's? I remember III making a comment about "the freshmen" but I don't think he was referring to Jesse in particular or even as part of that group.
Work ethic doesn't win you that job. III was almost always certain to have two ballhandlers on the floor last year. As a result, when TC or Marc did play, it was as often at the 3 as the 2. Unless Tyler's handle has vastly improved (and it might have), I have Jesse at the 2.
|
|
GIGAFAN99
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,487
|
Post by GIGAFAN99 on Jul 24, 2006 16:23:26 GMT -5
I think the collegehoops.net interview is very revealing. JTIII chooses his words carefully all the time and he mentioned Pat, Jessie, and Tyler by name as stepping in. That's a pretty good sign for those three. As for Marc, he lost minutes last year as the season went on. If Marc had kept a steady flow of minutes all year like Jessie, I'd put him in the lead. But that didn't happen. When March rolled around, even the "no fouls at the end of half" were more Tyler's than Marc's so I can't put him ahead of Tyler.
I think 9-1 is generous on him starting. Tyler is exactly what he was advertised as coming in; a big, hard-working guard who can hit the open shot and will need a couple years to adjust to Big East play. His time has come to step into that role.
But Sapp is better than Tyler in every facet of the game. There's a reason why of all the role players JTIII had to choose from last year, the one he could not keep off the floor was Jessie. And yes, I think after working this summer that statement will even be true of long-range shooting.
|
|
hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,346
|
Post by hoyaboy1 on Jul 24, 2006 16:44:03 GMT -5
I agree with you GIGA. I think Tyler's chances in of starting are less than 5%, but I didn't want to offer 20-1 in case YB actually called me on it.
I'm poor.
|
|
|
Post by michiganhoya on Jul 24, 2006 16:51:55 GMT -5
Anthony Perry is an All American, how much longer does he have to sit on the bench?
|
|
SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
|
Post by SirSaxa on Jul 24, 2006 18:20:41 GMT -5
I agree with you GIGA. I think Tyler's chances in of starting are less than 5%, but I didn't want to offer 20-1 in case YB actually called me on it. I'm poor. Barring injury, there is no way that Tyler jumps over Jessie to start. Jessie has a much more complete game - at both ends of the floor. How many minutes was Jessie averaging in the later part of the season? 15? 20? Tyler - a sophomore with 2 years in the system -- got essentially none. And Marc.... his minutes seriously dropped off over the last 10 games or so -- to almost nothing.
|
|
|
Post by TrueHoyaBlue on Jul 24, 2006 18:25:31 GMT -5
And that's a good argument for him to be the 3rd guard, but not to hop over Sapp and start. Right, I wasn't arguing that he'll be the starter ... just that I think he'll average at least 10-15 a game...
|
|