DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Mar 2, 2006 13:39:21 GMT -5
I don't see any conspiracy here--when the Big East unilaterally cuts the ticket order, Georgetown doesn't have much choice in the matter.
A Hoop Club gift is not a gift for tickets--it is a gift to the Annual Fund which provides priority on tickets, but it's no guarantee.
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Madgesdiq
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by Madgesdiq on Mar 2, 2006 14:03:31 GMT -5
I don't see any conspiracy here--when the Big East unilaterally cuts the ticket order, Georgetown doesn't have much choice in the matter. A Hoop Club gift is not a gift for tickets--it is a gift to the Annual Fund which provides priority on tickets, but it's no guarantee. No one is suggesting that a Hoop Club Gift is a gift for tickets, as they merely provide an opportunity to purchase Big East tickets. However, there is a reason that the Hoya Hoop Club benefits page lists Big East tickets as the first benefit under the amount of donation. It is the largest tangible benefit that one receives for becoming a Hoop Club member. If you were to conduct a poll on this board of what is meant by the text in the row that states BIG EAST TICKETS, I believe that the result would be overwhelmingly in the camp of "entitles the member to purchase X number of Big East tickets. What would be the purpose of stating that a Gold Hoya is entitled to "2 Big East tickets" and a Silver Hoya is entitled to "2 Big East tickets (if seats are available)" if there is no difference in the benefit? I can't imagine any Hoop Club Member reading this chart any differently. When is the Hoop Club meeting at the Big East tournament?
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 2, 2006 14:15:50 GMT -5
The other change made was changing the Golden Hoya BET ticket allocation level from 2 Priority to 2 seats. I'm with DFW: the Hoop Club and Ticket Office have to make do with whatever they are allocated, and seemingly a decrease in number of tickets in the face of increased demand. That said, transparency is crucial to good 'customer relations.' An important variable for the HHC to take into account is one I mentioned to Madge in a PM. For example, to me a HHC member who has donated for 20+ years and gives $2500 this year should have some different priority than one who just began giving this season at $2500. I am not sure if they take that into account, but that has always been my understanding. Apart from selfish desire to be able to attend games, there are few tangible benefits out-of-town HHC members receive. While DFW is correct that a donation is not a quid pro quo for tickets, it is a perk that the HHC uses to increase donations. For out-of-town supporters like myself, it is probably the major one and the HHC and ticket office need to do it right.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 2, 2006 15:02:46 GMT -5
Regardless of the situation, the Hoop Club made a commitment.
Keep your promises. If that means a loss, that means a loss. Go on ebay, contact other schools, offer to pay a premium. It is unfortunate, but you made a commitment. Keep it.
This kind of service is rewarded with future loyalty.
I suppose we're only an ethical University when it is in the budget?
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 2, 2006 15:20:33 GMT -5
Regardless of the situation, the Hoop Club made a commitment. Keep your promises. If that means a loss, that means a loss. Go on ebay, contact other schools, offer to pay a premium. It is unfortunate, but you made a commitment. Keep it. This kid of service is rewarded with future loyalty. I suppose we're only an ethical University when it is in the budget? The communications I've had with the ticket office indicate that they are at least contacting other schools to attempt to source tickets.
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YB
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Post by YB on Mar 2, 2006 15:25:44 GMT -5
I was at the discussion where the news was broken to us. I, for the record, was denied tickets... in fact, I had two seperate people from the Ath Dept call to break me the good news.
I think this has more to do with the conception of the HHC as what it was before and what it is becoming. The numbers of the HHC grew tremendously this year, and that is a great thing. But it used to be that dangling tickets out there was the only way to get people to give. They should have completely changed the literature this year. I mean, if I was looking at this in purely quid pro quo terms, as the lit seems to suggest that we do but that I think was always incorrect, I got absolutely zilch for my $500 donation this year- I didn't even get in the $500 donation seats.
I do it for love of the program, but not everyone will be so generous if the message from McD does not prompt us to that mindset.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 2, 2006 15:28:39 GMT -5
I'm not saying, Dan, that the Hoop Club isn't doing this.
I'm saying what I think they should do. I have no idea how they are handling this.
I don't care if it is from other schools, from Hoop Club board members giving up their seats, off ebay, from scalpers or snuck in through the service entrance. They promised BE tickets to some folk (certainly not me) and the ethical and moral thing to do is to deliver at any cost.
From a business case perspective, it's an easy choice. Someone like Madge already upped his contribution partially or wholly to get these tickets, and now he doesn't get them? How likely is he to donate next year if he's screwed this year?
How many tickets can you get off ebay for the present value of a donor's future donations? A heckuva lot, I'd think.
And then next year, you can be mroe careful what you promise.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 2, 2006 15:32:01 GMT -5
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YB
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Post by YB on Mar 2, 2006 15:37:04 GMT -5
...and all 6 who are able to get tix to the BET will get to go to the Open Membership Meeting.
For the record, I think GU has to do a lot to update and modernize, standardize really, how it handles tickets. Too much demand, too many donors, to do the mom-and-pop shop way anymore.
Maybe an automated system, with someone monitoring to take care fo special cases?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2006 15:59:18 GMT -5
...and all 6 who are able to get tix to the BET will get to go to the Open Membership Meeting. For the record, I think GU has to do a lot to update and modernize, standardize really, how it handles tickets. Too much demand, too many donors, to do the mom-and-pop shop way anymore. Maybe an automated system, with someone monitoring to take care fo special cases? You can't automate that which you do not control. MCI has the power when it comes to distributing the tickets. There is no Ticketmaster outlet at McDonough, and we can't do anything about that, short of building our own arena (but let's not beat that dead horse in this thread, please). And the "too much demand, too many donors" part - while true - is a new issue, and you're right that the athletic dept. needs to figure out a new infrastructure. Keep in mind that the Hoop Club's membership count this year is the second highest ever (behind only 1984), and will continue to grow through the end of the fiscal year (June). Now is the time for those in McD to view that as a base (not a spike), and put the appropriate systems in place to deal with it...I think Bernard Muir has put the wheels in motion and things will only get better.
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Madgesdiq
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by Madgesdiq on Mar 2, 2006 16:46:24 GMT -5
How likely is he to donate next year if he's screwed this year? Next year, I will make a smaller donation. Period. I will not be fooled by any misleading marketing material asking for me to move to the next level, that is for sure. If I had made the same donation that I made to the Hoop Club to my graduate school (also a BE school) I would have received 4 BE tickets. I was told by the athletic department of the school that they did not renege on any of their promises to donors at levels that indicated that BE tickets would be available for purchase at certain donation levels. They use the same chart that we do, with the same (if seats are available) disclaimer at lower levels of donation. With all due respect to DFW, Dan and YB are absolutely right. Big East tickets are the #1 marketing tool used by the Hoop Club to increase donations to the program. If Hoyas Unlimited wants to take a position that a donation to the Hoop Club does not guarantee Big East tickets, then don't dangle them when soliciting new donors or asking current donors to increase their levels of giving. I can't believe that a Gold Hoya member who is a 20+ year season ticket holder got shut out. That is ridiculous.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Mar 2, 2006 17:12:26 GMT -5
Keep in mind that the Hoop Club's membership count this year is the second highest ever (behind only 1984), and will continue to grow through the end of the fiscal year (June). Are you sure 1984 was the peak? I think the numbers peaked after that.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2006 17:20:26 GMT -5
Keep in mind that the Hoop Club's membership count this year is the second highest ever (behind only 1984), and will continue to grow through the end of the fiscal year (June). Are you sure 1984 was the peak? I think the numbers peaked after that. If memory serves (from the HHC Open meeting last month), it was 84 (might have been 85, now that I think about it). Either way, '06 has the 2nd highest count ever, which is a good thing.
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Post by DuddingtonHoya on Mar 2, 2006 17:23:45 GMT -5
The lesson is clear: everyone join the booster club for USF hoops.
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YB
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Post by YB on Mar 2, 2006 17:31:55 GMT -5
LOL. I just think the Ath Dept is being naive in thinking people won't rebel against this. They need to take ticket priviledges off the "benefit" list.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 2, 2006 17:41:35 GMT -5
LOL. I just think the Ath Dept is being naive in thinking people won't rebel against this. They need to take ticket priviledges off the "benefit" list. That is not the answer, specifically because ticket access is inherent in all hoops booster clubs. More transparency about what access specific levels of support ( including taking into account giving history in the formula) will get you to tickets is needed. Hey, it could be worse. We could be BenedictArnold College fans, who were held up for a minimum $10K to be able to purchase ACC tournament tickets.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2006 17:43:04 GMT -5
LOL. I just think the Ath Dept is being naive in thinking people won't rebel against this. They need to take ticket priviledges off the "benefit" list. I'll preface this by saying that I didn't get BET tickets, nor did I get Villanova tickets, and neither made me happy in any way: "Rebelling" is counterproductive. If everyone gets in a snit and decreases their donation next year, and Coach can't get the things he needs to run the program to its potential, and we go 6-10 and barely make the BET, then what? No one will want Big East tickets, and no one will give a Gerry McNamara's Ass what the Hoop Club brochure says anyway. Unfortunately, some people are getting the shaft. We beat Duke, we're going to the NCAAs for the first time in 5 years, everybody's back on the bandwagon, and the infrastructure was not in place to handle the implications of that. I've said it in a different thread: I'd MUCH rather have a good team, and have people Editeded off about not being able to get tickets, than the nonsense we put up with from 2002-2004. If there was a simple "If Available" on the ENTIRE ticket list, there wouldn't be any issues. There wasn't, and I trust people will learn from that and fix it for the future.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 2, 2006 17:45:02 GMT -5
LOL. I just think the Ath Dept is being naive in thinking people won't rebel against this. They need to take ticket priviledges off the "benefit" list. I'll preface this by saying that I didn't get BET tickets, nor did I get Villanova tickets, and neither made me happy in any way: "Rebelling" is counterproductive. If everyone gets in a snit and decreases their donation next year, and Coach can't get the things he needs to run the program to its potential, and we go 6-10 and barely make the BET, then what? No one will want Big East tickets, and no one will give a Gerry McNamara's Ass what the Hoop Club brochure says anyway. Unfortunately, some people are getting the shaft. We beat Duke, we're going to the NCAAs for the first time in 5 years, everybody's back on the bandwagon, and the infrastructure was not in place to handle the implications of that. I've said it in a different thread: I'd MUCH rather have a good team, and have people Editeded off about not being able to get tickets, than the nonsense we put up with from 2002-2004. If there was a simple "If Available" on the ENTIRE ticket list, there wouldn't be any issues. There wasn't, and I trust people will learn from that and fix it for the future. word
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YB
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by YB on Mar 2, 2006 17:47:13 GMT -5
I'd rather have a good team too, and I don't begrudge my zilch benefits I got for it; BUT I think their lack of transparency, not being forthcoming with explanations, and unstandardized way of dealing with tickets in general does encourage the notion that they still don't care much ab out donors, or take them for granted. I think this is pervasive throughout the University, but here, it is preventable: Muir needs to come out with a statement to all HHC members on the ticketing issue, apologize for misunderstandings and offer something in return for this year's donors.
Transparency makes all better, I think. Upgrading the ticketing process would resolve things long-term too.
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FormerHoya
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Post by FormerHoya on Mar 2, 2006 18:00:49 GMT -5
I'd rather have a good team too, and I don't begrudge my zilch benefits I got for it; BUT I think their lack of transparency, not being forthcoming with explanations, and unstandardized way of dealing with tickets in general does encourage the notion that they still don't care much ab out donors, or take them for granted. I think this is pervasive throughout the University, but here, it is preventable: Muir needs to come out with a statement to all HHC members on the ticketing issue, apologize for misunderstandings and offer something in return for this year's donors. Transparency makes all better, I think. Upgrading the ticketing process would resolve things long-term too. Careful what you wish for. Muir comes from ND. Non-graduates of ND can't get football tickets through the school (except those with ancient grandfathered season tickets which they do not sell anymore). Graduates face a required donation to even be in the lottery for any tickets. After the donation you are required to send in funds to cover any tickets that you might receive. There is a strong chance that you will only get the Navy game. People try to get around this by joining the $1000 Sorin Society. Once in the Society you are guaranteed.... nothing. Although it usually works that members do get tix. In addition, Bowl tickets are entirely separate. Sorin Society members do get shut out. All I'm saying is that Muir comes from a money-making factory and will know how to squeeze every last dime out of you. Thing is, you'll pay happily assuming the team is playing well. He knows that too.
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