astrohoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 303
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Post by astrohoya on Mar 6, 2023 14:02:13 GMT -5
Anything past Thursday is a huge sign our admin is absolutely as clueless as we think it is.
One good sign is that they have not already announced his return as they did last year.
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,135
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Post by RBHoya on Mar 6, 2023 14:35:31 GMT -5
A news dump during selection sunday??? Given how ham-handed our public relations people seem to be, I'm not even sure they're strategic enough to try to dump this at a time when sports media is fixated on something else. It all feels so silly. Everyone with any fraction of a brain can see that this is over, but we're still continuing the charade. I'm not sure who we think we're fooling (or placating) by not just saying the very obvious thing. But I suspect my frustration with that will only grow in the next week or so. Whomever suggested the Ides of March is probably in the right neighborhood. And the fanbase may melt down between now and then. Despite the fact that all of this could have been sewn up by now, I think they will start trying to formally negotiate an exit late this week, and after all the requisite reviews and approvals it's probably a week or so after the last buzzer sounds before there's an announcement. Hope I'm wrong.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 6, 2023 14:45:59 GMT -5
I think it has already been negotiated, including the language and the timing. Remember, there has basically been zero indication of any recruiting for weeks and months. So they all know. Patrick, Jack, the Board (hopefully Ronnie). They all know.
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Post by practice on Mar 6, 2023 15:12:39 GMT -5
I think it has already been negotiated, including the language and the timing. Remember, there has basically been zero indication of any recruiting for weeks and months. So they all know. Patrick, Jack, the Board (hopefully Ronnie). They all know. Can I buy some of whatever you are taking?
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DonkDonk
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 428
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Post by DonkDonk on Mar 6, 2023 15:19:33 GMT -5
A news dump during selection sunday??? Given how ham-handed our public relations people seem to be, I'm not even sure they're strategic enough to try to dump this at a time when sports media is fixated on something else. It all feels so silly. Everyone with any fraction of a brain can see that this is over, but we're still continuing the charade. I'm not sure who we think we're fooling (or placating) by not just saying the very obvious thing. But I suspect my frustration with that will only grow in the next week or so. Whomever suggested the Ides of March is probably in the right neighborhood. And the fanbase may melt down between now and then. Despite the fact that all of this could have been sewn up by now, I think they will start trying to formally negotiate an exit late this week, and after all the requisite reviews and approvals it's probably a week or so after the last buzzer sounds before there's an announcement. Hope I'm wrong. It is all so silly, and proves how untethered the administration is to reality. The players -- the ones who actually go to Georgetown and matter more than anyone -- are continuing to be left in the dark with what next year looks like. Such a shame.
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,135
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35 Days
Mar 6, 2023 15:36:45 GMT -5
Post by RBHoya on Mar 6, 2023 15:36:45 GMT -5
I think it has already been negotiated, including the language and the timing. Remember, there has basically been zero indication of any recruiting for weeks and months. So they all know. Patrick, Jack, the Board (hopefully Ronnie). They all know. Very much hope this is correct. I do think there is broad understanding that we've come to the end of the road, but my supposition is that Falk and Patrick want to get the best compensation package for themselves so they're continuing to go through the motions. Thus even if all parties know a break up is imminent, there may still be posturing and negotiation to unfold. Does JD have carte blanche to negotiate termination for Ewing, or does the Board have to play some role (as they did in approving his contract extension), anyone know?
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Post by hoyasaxaphone on Mar 6, 2023 15:38:56 GMT -5
Friday, March 17th.
ST. PATRICK'S Day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Let's make it a "sent Patrick" day!
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hoyaguy
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,861
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35 Days
Mar 6, 2023 16:05:10 GMT -5
Post by hoyaguy on Mar 6, 2023 16:05:10 GMT -5
I think it has already been negotiated, including the language and the timing. Remember, there has basically been zero indication of any recruiting for weeks and months. So they all know. Patrick, Jack, the Board (hopefully Ronnie). They all know. Very much hope this is correct. I do think there is broad understanding that we've come to the end of the road, but my supposition is that Falk and Patrick want to get the best compensation package for themselves so they're continuing to go through the motions. Thus even if all parties know a break up is imminent, there may still be posturing and negotiation to unfold. Does JD have carte blanche to negotiate termination for Ewing, or does the Board have to play some role (as they did in approving his contract extension), anyone know? Honestly doubt they have everything worked out, the earliest I think is next a week from today. And we better hope JD doesn't have carte blanche because he might give up the keys to Healy and rename a library after Ewing just to make sure pat gets "hIs fAiR sHaRE". Actually come to think of it, Lau being renamed for Ewing would be a kind of fitting reflection of his coaching tenure, hideous lol
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1427hoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 351
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35 Days
Mar 6, 2023 17:00:33 GMT -5
Post by 1427hoya on Mar 6, 2023 17:00:33 GMT -5
I think it has already been negotiated, including the language and the timing. Remember, there has basically been zero indication of any recruiting for weeks and months. So they all know. Patrick, Jack, the Board (hopefully Ronnie). They all know. Very much hope this is correct. I do think there is broad understanding that we've come to the end of the road, but my supposition is that Falk and Patrick want to get the best compensation package for themselves so they're continuing to go through the motions. Thus even if all parties know a break up is imminent, there may still be posturing and negotiation to unfold. Does JD have carte blanche to negotiate termination for Ewing, or does the Board have to play some role (as they did in approving his contract extension), anyone know? My guess is that the board set parameters for a termination package and JD will negotiate within those parameters
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nbhoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 408
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Post by nbhoya on Mar 6, 2023 17:09:20 GMT -5
This is a case study in never allowing a hire with personal and emotional attachment to the University president.
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,777
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Post by DFW HOYA on Mar 6, 2023 17:31:32 GMT -5
My guess is that the board set parameters for a termination package and JD will negotiate within those parameters The board would have nothing further to do with it. Coaching contracts generally have an explicit "termination without cause" which would kick in with a termination notice without further delay, so there's no negotiation needed unless both parties agreed otherwise. Given that only one blog source has ever claimed contract terms, people can speculate but we have no copy of the agreement to compare a termination section to as would exist at public universities. For example, Dan Hurley: publicrecords.uconn.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/1836/2018/03/Hurley-MOU-Final.pdfUnless and until the men's basketball coach is a re-org back to Lee Reed, negotiations for the succeeding coach goes through the President's office, just as it would for any dean, SVP or higher position that becomes vacant.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,358
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35 Days
Mar 6, 2023 18:08:19 GMT -5
Post by prhoya on Mar 6, 2023 18:08:19 GMT -5
My guess is that the board set parameters for a termination package and JD will negotiate within those parameters The board would have nothing further to do with it. Coaching contracts generally have an explicit "termination without cause" which would kick in with a termination notice without further delay, so there's no negotiation needed unless both parties agreed otherwise. Given that only one blog source has ever claimed contract terms, people can speculate but we have no copy of the agreement to compare a termination section to as would exist at public universities. For example, Dan Hurley: publicrecords.uconn.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/1836/2018/03/Hurley-MOU-Final.pdfA previous post with plenty of examples: Since GU probably is going to be in contract negotiations soon, here’s my Christmas gift to our negotiators and those interested in how NCAA basketball contracts are structured. “ Introducing the Mid-Major Madness Coaching Contract Database:” www.midmajormadness.com/platform/amp/2019/11/4/20946421/ncaa-basketball-head-coach-contract-salary-database-mid-major-2019-20The linked article includes a pdf copy of 149 contracts or letters of intent between a school and its head coach. Some highlights of the article: “ Many contracts, though, including ones for mid-major coaches, include additional guarantees for media appearances, public speaking, or through guarantee game revenue.”
“Also note that most contracts include bonuses for appearing in the NCAA Tournament or NIT, winning the conference championship (both regular season and tournament), and having strong academic performance (and an APR that keeps the school eligible for postseason play).“
“In addition to compensation, contracts include buyouts, both on the team and coach side. These clauses are the bread and butter of the coaching carousel each April, especially for successful mid-major programs. But, because of how complicated they are, we have not moved any of those clauses into the overall spreadsheet.”
“The coaching contracts we received also help demonstrate a school’s expectations and commitment to its men’s basketball program. Most head coaching contracts outline not just what the coach will receive, but his ability to pay assistants, host summer camps, the required guarantee games, and what postseason appearances are worthy of bonuses.“ Some notable contract clauses: “• UT Martin’s Anthony Stewart receives an automatic four-year extension if he wins more than 50 percent of his games, finishes in the top four of the OVC standings, finishes in the top two in the OVC West standings, or makes the conference semifinals.
• Billy Wright’s contract with Western Illinois requires him to play a third guarantee game every other season in order to fund the salary for the team’s Director of Basketball Operations position.”
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caip
Member
Posts: 87
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Post by caip on Mar 6, 2023 18:09:27 GMT -5
My guess is that the board set parameters for a termination package and JD will negotiate within those parameters The board would have nothing further to do with it. Coaching contracts generally have an explicit "termination without cause" which would kick in with a termination notice without further delay, so there's no negotiation needed unless both parties agreed otherwise. Given that only one blog source has ever claimed contract terms, people can speculate but we have no copy of the agreement to compare a termination section to as would exist at public universities. For example, Dan Hurley: publicrecords.uconn.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/1836/2018/03/Hurley-MOU-Final.pdfUnless and until the men's basketball coach is a re-org back to Lee Reed, negotiations for the succeeding coach goes through the President's office, just as it would for any dean, SVP or higher position that becomes vacant. Let’s hope GU is sensitive to APR and has resultant clauses in the contract tied to it. Or maybe UConn more sensitive to those off the court issues. As with other decisions regarding the program, I have my doubts about how well Jack protected GU. If I were Falk, I think I’d like my matchup against Jack and the lawyers working for him.
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Highsmith
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,490
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Post by Highsmith on Mar 6, 2023 18:54:31 GMT -5
This exchange between Bobby Bancroft and CasualHoya over on his site made me feel at least a little more optimistic-
Bobby said- The big question now is how much does the school care about maintaining a men's basketball team that can consistently compete at the highest levels without a link to the past leading the charge....
Casual's response was- I think the answer to that question is that the school absolutely cares and is keenly aware that this needs to be a splash hire. I was thinking the other day that if only Lee Reed was given the chance to make the hire post-JT3 or even at the end of last season that this program would be in a very different position right now. My understanding now is that he will get that opportunity.
Hopefully good news in that the school is looking to make a "splash hire" and that the actual AD will be in charge of making this decision. Fingers crossed!
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35 Days
Mar 6, 2023 19:17:03 GMT -5
Post by hsaxon on Mar 6, 2023 19:17:03 GMT -5
I think it has already been negotiated, including the language and the timing. Remember, there has basically been zero indication of any recruiting for weeks and months. So they all know. Patrick, Jack, the Board (hopefully Ronnie). They all know. Yes, that makes sense. But it should be announced this Thursday.
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Post by hsaxon on Mar 6, 2023 19:20:57 GMT -5
Friday, March 17th. ST. PATRICK'S Day!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Let's make it a "sent Patrick" day! Let's make in March 9, Thursday.
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thedragon
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Posts: 2,332
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Post by thedragon on Mar 6, 2023 19:22:08 GMT -5
This exchange between Bobby Bancroft and CasualHoya over on his site made me feel at least a little more optimistic- Bobby said- The big question now is how much does the school care about maintaining a men's basketball team that can consistently compete at the highest levels without a link to the past leading the charge.... Casual's response was- I think the answer to that question is that the school absolutely cares and is keenly aware that this needs to be a splash hire. I was thinking the other day that if only Lee Reed was given the chance to make the hire post-JT3 or even at the end of last season that this program would be in a very different position right now. My understanding now is that he will get that opportunity. Hopefully good news in that the school is looking to make a "splash hire" and that the actual AD will be in charge of making this decision. Fingers crossed! Would be first time in 50+ years Georgetown had a traditional heirarchy. And we would have very little idea what LR values in a coaching hire. Young and up and coming? Older and experienced? System? Culture? Character? Media presence? Crazy to think that hiring Ewing and then extending him could be the final nail in the Presidents office control of the men's bball program. Hard to believe but hopefully it's true.
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Post by hsaxon on Mar 6, 2023 19:24:22 GMT -5
That’s only your opinion. I’ll be celebrating Georgetown finally moving away from the HC who should have been gone after last season. I will be celebrating the renewed hope of having a leader of this program who both can develop basketball players and restore this program back to some level of respect and prominence. There is much to celebrate, in my opinion. I don't think there's anything to celebrate at all. This entire experience has been depressing. I don't mean to fan-shame, but I honestly think that if you love Georgetown basketball, you should have been rooting for Ewing to succeed, and hung on to that hope for as long as you possibly could. I didn't love the hire when it happened - fearing pretty much the exact scenario that has come to pass (though reality has been far worse than my worst forecast) - but I truly hate the way it's all ending. As necessary as it is to turn the page unequivocally from Coach Patrick Ewing, and from the entire half-century-long Thompson Era of Georgetown basketball, it's also profoundly sad. Especially under these circumstances. Absolutely sad - and depressing.
Eight years of a poor team and six years of a poor program.
Extremely sad for all stakeholders.
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,777
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35 Days
Mar 6, 2023 19:34:45 GMT -5
Post by DFW HOYA on Mar 6, 2023 19:34:45 GMT -5
Hopefully good news in that the school is looking to make a "splash hire" and that the actual AD will be in charge of making this decision. Fingers crossed! Splash hires aren't in the Georgetown DNA. The University has hired three deans in the last two years for undergraduate schools, and none of them had any dean level academic or fundraising experience. The new dean of the College was the chair of the women's studies department at Michigan, the dean of Nursing was a clinical professor at Drexel, and the dean of Health was only an associate professor at Georgetown. The next Peter Krogh wasn't walking through that door. As for athletics, I can think of one, and only one, splash hire in the last 40 years: David Urick. Urick's arrival represented fundamental change in how lacrosse would be viewed at Georgetown and outside it. Too often, coaches are recruited to Georgetown without neither flash nor change, even in the major sports: women's basketball coach James Howard was a career assistant who had not been a head coach since 1997 at Division III Wesley College (now closed). We'll find out eventually but a splash hire would certainly be against standard procedure.
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hoyajmw
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,031
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Post by hoyajmw on Mar 6, 2023 19:47:49 GMT -5
Hopefully good news in that the school is looking to make a "splash hire" and that the actual AD will be in charge of making this decision. Fingers crossed! Splash hires aren't in the Georgetown DNA. The University has hired three deans in the last two years for undergraduate schools, and none of them had any dean level academic or fundraising experience. The new dean of the College was the chair of the women's studies department at Michigan, the dean of Nursing was a clinical professor at Drexel, and the dean of Health was only an associate professor at Georgetown. The next Peter Krogh wasn't walking through that door. As for athletics, I can think of one, and only one, splash hire in the last 40 years: David Urick. Urick's arrival represented fundamental change in how lacrosse would be viewed at Georgetown and outside it. Too often, coaches are recruited to Georgetown without neither flash nor change, even in the major sports: women's basketball coach James Howard was a career assistant who had not been a head coach since 1997 at Division III Wesley College (now closed). We'll find out eventually but a splash hire would certainly be against standard procedure. Thoughtful and fact based counter to be sure on the norm so thank you and really puts meat on the bones of one of the reasons for the uneasy feeling many of us have about the path that may be taken in the new hire. But I think the chorus (I among them) responds with “If not now, when?”
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