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Post by FrazierFanatic on Sept 4, 2019 11:28:48 GMT -5
Idk... I'll believe the 2 bigs at once when I see it, mainly because I see no benefit to that lineup. Naji Marshall plays a lot of 4 for Xavier. Alpha Diallo plays a lot of 4 for Providence. I don't see any of our bigs being capable of guarding them. I'm sure both guys would be salivating at that matchup, and none of our bigs are capable of exploiting their mismatch on the other end. Pat doesn't play zone much so that lineup for anything more than a minute or two would be a headscratcher. I would not expect to see two bigs often, true. But Naji, Diallo et al. don't play 40 minutes. We have some very athletic bigs who should be able to extend more than Jessie and some of our other recent bigs, so for short stretches against the right line-ups it could be effective.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2019 11:34:18 GMT -5
Idk... I'll believe the 2 bigs at once when I see it, mainly because I see no benefit to that lineup. Naji Marshall plays a lot of 4 for Xavier. Alpha Diallo plays a lot of 4 for Providence. I don't see any of our bigs being capable of guarding them. I'm sure both guys would be salivating at that matchup, and none of our bigs are capable of exploiting their mismatch on the other end. Pat doesn't play zone much so that lineup for anything more than a minute or two would be a headscratcher. I would not expect to see two bigs often, true. But Naji, Diallo et al. don't play 40 minutes. We have some very athletic bigs who should be able to extend more than Jessie and some of our other recent bigs, so for short stretches against the right line-ups it could be effective.Fwiw both guys averaged around 36min per game last season. A question for anyone that wants to answer. In what way is it effective? What are the benefits? Not being snarky. I just don't see many benefits, other than it gets guys run, and I am interested in seeing what you guys see..
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Sept 4, 2019 12:57:41 GMT -5
Blocks shots.
Intimidation.
Physicality.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Sept 4, 2019 12:58:07 GMT -5
Also:
Rebounds.
Throw in some elbows.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Sept 4, 2019 13:16:53 GMT -5
I would not expect to see two bigs often, true. But Naji, Diallo et al. don't play 40 minutes. We have some very athletic bigs who should be able to extend more than Jessie and some of our other recent bigs, so for short stretches against the right line-ups it could be effective.Fwiw both guys averaged around 36min per game last season. A question for anyone that wants to answer. In what way is it effective? What are the benefits? Not being snarky. I just don't see many benefits, other than it gets guys run, and I am interested in seeing what you guys see.. Fair question, and I respect your basketball knowledge enough to second guess myself when you ask. With Wilson, I see (if I squint really hard đ) some of the same things I see with Josh except even more size and even more length. They are definitely not the same player, but they are both hyper-athletic, bouncy, and finish offensive rebounds strongly. I see both players rim protecting in similar ways with helping defense. Of course, the comparison would fail once Josh starts increasing his offensive utilization especially if he can keep his shooting percentages anywhere near where they were last year....but I donât believe he has yet done that IMHO. At times, I wonder about Wilson on the perimeter, but then I remember that play in the Bahamas when he was beat and then he blocked the player from behind. Sometimes I wonder if he has enough offensive game to avoid opposing teams leaving him a bit unguarded, but then I think about what he could do at the rim with offensive boards if someone wasnât boxing him out. I am trying to think of another 6â10â Hoya who is as nimble (at least north and south) as he seems to be. He is a gazelle and could likely outrun the front court of most of our opponents....which just puts more pressure on them. He seems to have a great attitude and be coachable. I think the sky is the limit with what he can accomplish. Hoya fans seem pretty consistent that he should be a red shirt candidate, but there has been zero evidence from the program that this is the case. In fact, Malcolm has refuted it. At this point, I think the red-shirt narrative for Wilson is false.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 4, 2019 13:20:53 GMT -5
I would not expect to see two bigs often, true. But Naji, Diallo et al. don't play 40 minutes. We have some very athletic bigs who should be able to extend more than Jessie and some of our other recent bigs, so for short stretches against the right line-ups it could be effective.Fwiw both guys averaged around 36min per game last season. A question for anyone that wants to answer. In what way is it effective? What are the benefits? Not being snarky. I just don't see many benefits, other than it gets guys run, and I am interested in seeing what you guys see.. I mean to be honest I would feel comfortable leaving Diallo alone and unguarded beyond the three-point line in an empty gym. He's not a good example IMO. If Wilson had to guard him on the perimeter I would instruct Wilson to give himself about five feet of space in between in order to prevent the drive; we could live with the result of Diallo jacking up threes.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2019 13:51:43 GMT -5
Fwiw both guys averaged around 36min per game last season. A question for anyone that wants to answer. In what way is it effective? What are the benefits? Not being snarky. I just don't see many benefits, other than it gets guys run, and I am interested in seeing what you guys see.. I mean to be honest I would feel comfortable leaving Diallo alone and unguarded beyond the three-point line in an empty gym. He's not a good example IMO. If Wilson had to guard him on the perimeter I would instruct Wilson to give himself about five feet of space in between in order to prevent the drive; we could live with the result of Diallo jacking up threes. Diallo shot 33% from 3 last year. I don't think you can afford to leave him open. Like most college guys when they're left open they can make them, see Josh. I don't think any of us think Josh is a great 3 point shooter, but if you leave him wide open he can make them. Imo Wilson at best would be our 4th best power forward behind Josh, Alexander, and Pickett. Against lesser opponents it might not hurt you for a stretch, but in the BE when the margins are going to be super tight it's really risky imo. On offense you're going 4 on 5 with that lineup. Defensively I don't see lot of benefit because both Pickett and Josh are + defenders who are more versatile. It is what it is. We'll see how it plays out, and obviously the staff knows more about the game than me sooo...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2019 13:59:16 GMT -5
Fwiw both guys averaged around 36min per game last season. A question for anyone that wants to answer. In what way is it effective? What are the benefits? Not being snarky. I just don't see many benefits, other than it gets guys run, and I am interested in seeing what you guys see.. Fair question, and I respect your basketball knowledge enough to second guess myself when you ask. With Wilson, I see (if I squint really hard đ) some of the same things I see with Josh except even more size and even more length. They are definitely not the same player, but they are both hyper-athletic, bouncy, and finish offensive rebounds strongly. I see both players rim protecting in similar ways with helping defense. Of course, the comparison would fail once Josh starts increasing his offensive utilization especially if he can keep his shooting percentages anywhere near where they were last year....but I donât believe he has yet done that IMHO. At times, I wonder about Wilson on the perimeter, but then I remember that play in the Bahamas when he was beat and then he blocked the player from behind. Sometimes I wonder if he has enough offensive game to avoid opposing teams leaving him a bit unguarded, but then I think about what he could do at the rim with offensive boards if someone wasnât boxing him out. I am trying to think of another 6â10â Hoya who is as nimble (at least north and south) as he seems to be. He is a gazelle and could likely outrun the front court of most of our opponents....which just puts more pressure on them. He seems to have a great attitude and be coachable. I think the sky is the limit with what he can accomplish. Hoya fans seem pretty consistent that he should be a red shirt candidate, but there has been zero evidence from the program that this is the case. In fact, Malcolm has refuted it. At this point, I think the red-shirt narrative for Wilson is false. I'm very high on Wilson. I don't think he's ready right now but he has as much pro potential as anyone on the team based on pure natural ability. He's a long way from realizing his full potential, but he's the type of athlete scouts would salivate over if he can start to put it all together. I had heard the staff was looking to redshirt him over the summer, but haven't seen much to indicate that's the case since then. It makes sense to do that with one of the 3 guys because it would help with class balance and it's going to be difficult to find time for 4 centers. TBF they don't have to decide any time soon but I agreee it seems unlikely at this point.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Sept 4, 2019 14:36:59 GMT -5
I mean to be honest I would feel comfortable leaving Diallo alone and unguarded beyond the three-point line in an empty gym. He's not a good example IMO. If Wilson had to guard him on the perimeter I would instruct Wilson to give himself about five feet of space in between in order to prevent the drive; we could live with the result of Diallo jacking up threes. Diallo went 4 of 8 from 3 from the new distance during the Pan Am Games in July. We cannot leave a playmaker alone from 3. An extended Wilson with his quick recovery (block from behind that jwp91 described) could work.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Sept 4, 2019 14:40:09 GMT -5
I mean to be honest I would feel comfortable leaving Diallo alone and unguarded beyond the three-point line in an empty gym. He's not a good example IMO. If Wilson had to guard him on the perimeter I would instruct Wilson to give himself about five feet of space in between in order to prevent the drive; we could live with the result of Diallo jacking up threes. Diallo shot 33% from 3 last year. I don't think you can afford to leave him open. Like most college guys when they're left open they can make them, see Josh. I don't think any of us think Josh is a great 3 point shooter, but if you leave him wide open he can make them. On offense you're going 4 on 5 with that lineup. Defensively I don't see lot of benefit because both Pickett and Josh are + defenders who are more versatile. Offensively, I am not sure we have enough basketballs for 5 players. đ
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 4, 2019 14:48:44 GMT -5
I mean to be honest I would feel comfortable leaving Diallo alone and unguarded beyond the three-point line in an empty gym. He's not a good example IMO. If Wilson had to guard him on the perimeter I would instruct Wilson to give himself about five feet of space in between in order to prevent the drive; we could live with the result of Diallo jacking up threes. Diallo shot 33% from 3 last year. I don't think you can afford to leave him open. Like most college guys when they're left open they can make them, see Josh. I don't think any of us think Josh is a great 3 point shooter, but if you leave him wide open he can make them. Good grief, Yaboy, I'm being facetious. But thanks for letting me know D1 athletes left open can make their long jumpers. LOL. You are obviously too deep into Serious Mode for this discussion. That said, your man Diallo shot under 30% from three his first two years and then got to 33% in year #3 which isn't all that great either. Point being he has never proven to be deadly from beyond the three-point line. That's not where he does his damage which is why I thought he was a bad example. What I do know is that you put a guy with an impressive wingspan and quick feet on him and he's in trouble. Pickett gave him all sorts of problems in both games.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 4, 2019 14:51:32 GMT -5
I mean to be honest I would feel comfortable leaving Diallo alone and unguarded beyond the three-point line in an empty gym. He's not a good example IMO. If Wilson had to guard him on the perimeter I would instruct Wilson to give himself about five feet of space in between in order to prevent the drive; we could live with the result of Diallo jacking up threes. Diallo went 4 of 8 from 3 from the new distance during the Pan Am Games in July. We cannot leave a playmaker alone from 3. An extended Wilson with his quick recovery (block from behind that jwp91 described) could work. Ha ha. Not you too.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2019 14:53:26 GMT -5
Diallo shot 33% from 3 last year. I don't think you can afford to leave him open. Like most college guys when they're left open they can make them, see Josh. I don't think any of us think Josh is a great 3 point shooter, but if you leave him wide open he can make them. Good grief, Yaboy, I'm being facetious. But thanks for letting me know D1 athletes left open can make their long jumpers. LOL. You are obviously too deep into Serious Mode for this discussion. That said, your man Diallo shot under 30% from three his first two years and then got to 33% which isn't all that great either. Point being he has never proven to be deadly from beyond the three-point line. That's not where he does his damage which is why I thought he was a bad example. What I know of him is that you put a guy with an impressive wingspan ad quick feet on him and he's in trouble. Pickett gave him all sorts of problems in both games. Huh? 5 feet is essentially wide open for a college guy. Not really taking anything too serious in this thread tbh. lol... He's not a bad example, he's one of the best players in the league for a reason. Pickett gave him all sorts of trouble so it makes sense to let him guard him rather than trying something new that may or may not work.
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centercourt400s
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Post by centercourt400s on Sept 4, 2019 15:11:03 GMT -5
We also have to consider that Ewing is really working on two goals: wins for his team and developing pro-potential for his players. He's ambitious enough to try to accomplish both at once. He also doesn't think in small and limited ways... he wants to dominate.
So if that means Wilson and Wahab are going to learn to play as wings while another big is in the game and learn to cover players on the perimeter, while Mac develops his handle and distribution skills enough to play point guard when needed, then I'm guessing that is just what we're going to try to do.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 4, 2019 15:16:08 GMT -5
Huh? 5 feet is essentially wide open for a college guy. Not really taking anything too serious in this thread tbh. lol... He's not a bad example, he's one of the best players in the league for a reason. Pickett gave him all sorts of trouble so it makes sense to let him guard him rather than trying something new that may or may not work. 1- If you have a great wingspan you can get away with that five feet because Diallo is not a very good shooter. This is just a hypothetical anyway but Wilson's wingspan is so impressive, as is his reach, that as soon as Diallo goes into motion to take the shot I'm sure Wilson can use his arms and legs quickly enough to close in and take away any true clean looks. 2-He is indeed one of the better players in the league; he's also been around long enough to get to that point. He has ability but he's nothing special. He was a junior last season and a player people expected not only to be a First Team All BE, but a guy who was predicted to lead the Friars to the Big Dance. He failed on both counts. Also despite having a prototypical build/frame for the NBA as well as the length, he was likely not getting drafted in either the first or the second round if he had submitted his name for the 2019 Draft. That's nothing to be ashamed of but that doesn't necessarily paint a picture of someone that we have to be in awe of in during a message board conversation. 3-Of course the preference would be to put Pickett on him. And then either Alexander, LeBlanc, Gardner. But again this is hypothetical talk. We mentioned a scenario in which we could envision Wilson seeing spot duty at the 4 and you followed up by imagining a scenario in which Diallo was moved to the 4 and Wilson had to cover him at that instance. So its not as if I think it would be ideal for Wilson to cover Diallo before those other Hoyas I listed had a crack at him. I am merely relaying reasons why I think Wilson could have a chance if such an unlikely turn-of-events came about.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Sept 4, 2019 18:20:34 GMT -5
Like most college guys when they're left open they can make them... If I didn't know better, I would say you haven't been watching Hoya basketball for the last decade.
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