eagle54
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Post by eagle54 on Mar 8, 2017 22:15:07 GMT -5
Eh, edited because I'm bad with technology, but Bobby Bancroft made notes on the postgame per twitter. JTIII dodged big-picture questions on the direction of the program and when pressed on when it'd be time to discuss, he said "not now." Of course, he needs JT2 and DeGoia to tell him what to say when they figure it out. Not the direction of the program just how to try and explain this away as not a big deal.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Mar 8, 2017 22:15:11 GMT -5
What a horrible ending for the players. Despite all the flaws and there are many, they did not give up. The problem, again, was no PG on the roster. Everyone knew LJ was getting the ball, and 4of 5 SJU defenders made plays on him. a PG would have driven and dished, but this is not LJ's skill set. So SJU simply collapsed on him, and won. JT3 is probably a good in game coach with the proper players, but his roster construction is horrible. The Peak class killed us. Did anyone think at the end of the Utah game, that White and Copeland would transfer, and that Campbell would contribute essentially nothing this year? Folks can't get revisionist & start pining for PW & Copes now, the main theme for both after they left was that they wouldn't have played much this year anyway..
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Post by jld54 on Mar 8, 2017 22:16:31 GMT -5
Not pining at all. Just stating that when the core of your forward rotation disappears, it is hard to recover.
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beenaround
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Post by beenaround on Mar 8, 2017 22:16:34 GMT -5
LJ was a warrior again, as always. Gotta be one of my all time fave Hoyas. Rodney had some nice moments and hammer dunks this year... obviously a flawed overall player, but in a year like this, you take whatever highlights you can get. Not sure if Jesse or MD will ever get over the hump and become big time players as many of us hoped.
Such a glaring need for a point guard , especially in today's game. Went to Verizon as guest of a client ( wouldn't have gone voluntarily!) and was force fed the Penn State/ Nebraska game this afternoon. Surprisingly, both Big 10 bottom feeders have creative point guards that would have helped the Hoyas..don't ask me their names.
Oh well. For the record, I feel the guys gave everything they had today..don't buy the narrative they have given up. But unfortunately, do not see any way JT3 will be able to right this ship.
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NCHoya
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Post by NCHoya on Mar 8, 2017 22:17:16 GMT -5
What I saw on offense is almost impossible to watch. Raf was calling us out quite a bit - no dribble penetration, passing around the perimeter, lazy/casual passes, etc. I am so sick of seeing sad, tired back door action with no alternate plan when it does not work 9 out of every 10 times. Our version of dribble penetration is head down, bull rush into the paint and throw something off the backboard.
The players effort was definitely there, and usually is, but the scheme on both sides is a joke. For me, it is all on the coach. You coach to your talent and strengths, you do not simply keep doing the same thing regardless of personnel and expect a new outcome! If III was a pro coach I would fire him, the fact he is the GM as well, just makes this all the more frustrating.
These players deserve better. There are plenty of coaches out there that could 1) force these players to play fundamentally sound basketball and 2) find an effective defensive strategy. That alone, would have this team several games above .500.
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the_way
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Post by the_way on Mar 8, 2017 22:18:18 GMT -5
Good to see AI in the crowd, supporting the program.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Mar 8, 2017 22:20:34 GMT -5
Not pining at all. Just stating that when the core of your forward rotation disappears, it is hard to recover. Read their threads especially Copes, many posters said the team was better off without him.. JT3 basically said it as well, to me you can't use that as any type of excuse now.. A similar line of thinking was posted about PW too when he left..
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Mar 8, 2017 22:24:49 GMT -5
My fear has been that we become like Army football. If it beats Navy during the season, it's a success! If we beat Syracuse, it's a success! Sad state of affairs and it's hard to have hope since I'm assuming III is returning next season. But how long had it been since Army beat Navy before this season? Haven't looked this up, but wasn't it something like 18 years? Beating Syracuse is great, but it's not worth a 5-13 conference trade-off. I'd take 13-5 and a loss to Syracuse any day. "Navy won 14 Army-Navy games in a row from 2002 to 2015, the longest winning streak in the history of the series. On December 10, 2016, Army snapped its 14-game losing streak against Navy with a 21–17 victory." I'd also take a great conference record v. win against non-conference foe Syracuse (if that series even continues).
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Mar 8, 2017 22:27:42 GMT -5
Did you see the inbounds plays ran in crunch time? nad when you have the far superior talented players and lose you got outcoached. Yea. He told Peak to fall. Yep. Thats JTII fault. Peak always fall. Last week he ll fell 3 times in the last 2 mins One coach got a wide open dunk. The other said just run LJ try to beat 4 guys at the basket and pray. Don't get me wrong I don't hate the play because quite frankly its better than anything he would've actually drawn up. Just don't act like that was some masterpiece that JT3 drew up.
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This Just In
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Bold Prediction: The Hoyas will win at least 1 BE game in 2023.
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Post by This Just In on Mar 8, 2017 22:27:42 GMT -5
Final Thoughts:
359 people on the board, good for HoyaTalk
LJ Peak carried this team in the 2nd half, at one point scoring 12 straight points when the team needed it the most
Leading scorers: Peak 24 pts (22 in the 2nd half) Pryor 17pts Derrickson 11pts
Hoyas 12 assts vs 13 to's, better than the 22 to's the last time these 2 teams faced it each other, but still not good
Pryor & Derrickson literally left blood, sweat, and tears on the court tonight as each player got to taste their own blood thanks to the physical play of the Red Storm This was an old school Big East matchup and our players left it all on the court, nothing to hang their heads about JTIII showed some fire tonight in his verbal confrontation with Chris Mullins, that was a glimpse of the Hoyas that I remember Even the last play out of the time out was a good play call by JTIII, a curl to Peak who had a lane to the rim, but slipped at the basket Derrickson got the rebound and missed the put back; the Hoyas season in a nut shell "So close, but yet so far"
LJ Peak had the best half of basketball I have seen in a big game for the Hoyas in 2 years. From the 11:32 mark left in the 2nd half, it became the LJ Peak show and what a show it was When Peak is focused he can literally get to the rim at will of the bounce
I am going to leave one stat to remember: JTIII New Big East Record in "close games" (5-points or less, or OT): 10-18 (.357) Which includes a current 4 game losing streak
The players did not quit and played hard to the final buzzer. This game was in doubt to the horn sounded and JTIII deserves credit for keeping the players engaged thru the 6 game losing streak and through the media circus that surrounds the program Tonight was physical and emotional, and showed how the Big East used to be played by 2 teams who once dominated the conference
Final Grade: B
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eagle54
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Post by eagle54 on Mar 8, 2017 22:28:35 GMT -5
But how long had it been since Army beat Navy before this season? Haven't looked this up, but wasn't it something like 18 years? Beating Syracuse is great, but it's not worth a 5-13 conference trade-off. I'd take 13-5 and a loss to Syracuse any day. "Navy won 14 Army-Navy games in a row from 2002 to 2015, the longest winning streak in the history of the series. On December 10, 2016, Army snapped its 14-game losing streak against Navy with a 21–17 victory." I'd also take a great conference record v. win against non-conference foe Syracuse (if that series even continues). It might start hurting Syracuse's SOS too much. KenPom won't be kind.
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Mar 8, 2017 22:32:10 GMT -5
Good news we may be a >100 RPI bad loss for Cuse now and that keeps them out. Ole sneaky JT3 going next level with that one
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This Just In
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Post by This Just In on Mar 8, 2017 22:34:48 GMT -5
I'd be interviewing people tomorrow. How do you lose to these guys twice. These players certainly don't want to show up for this coach and this coach can't get out of his own way. It was a tough loss tonight, but I dont think the players quit The team could not get over the hump. There will be some soul searching in the off-season.
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eagle54
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Post by eagle54 on Mar 8, 2017 22:38:09 GMT -5
I'd be interviewing people tomorrow. How do you lose to these guys twice. These players certainly don't want to show up for this coach and this coach can't get out of his own way. It was a tough loss tonight, but I dont think the players quit The team could not get over the hump. There will be some soul searching in the off-season. I get it appeared the players played hard but against an opponent like that where you play the way they did then there is something else wrong. You can say it's coaching 100% which points to the broader problem however for them not to come out and handle that game with their backs against the wall is also on the players. Just because you play a close game doesn't mean you played hard when you are a more talented team. Can't give a pass for that. If it is was a Nova game I'd give them that but not a second loss to this team.
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This Just In
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Post by This Just In on Mar 8, 2017 22:49:20 GMT -5
Speaking of repeating imaginary raps over and over again. This act is past old. But you like it... Are you going to Nantucket this Season? Dan is upset and frustrated like everyone else. It will probably take a couple of days to get the bad taste of this season out of our mouths
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Mar 8, 2017 22:50:13 GMT -5
We are just a deeply flawed team. Too many players who can't contribute at one end or the other. Add in the 4 or 5 ridiculously lazy or sloppy turnovers each game, the bad defensive fundamentals and you get a losing team.
And although Waters should help next year, we still lose our leading scorer and our backup center. We have at least 2 scholarships left, but I have not seen any strong recruiting possibilities, certainly none that will help from day 1. We were 1 for 2 with our juco/grad transfers this season, need to hit at least one homer this summer if we hope to avoid a threepeat of despair (I am presuming JTIII returns, but a change at the top might shuffle the deck a little for next year).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2017 23:01:15 GMT -5
Mullin cleaned house when he took over the St John's program. His roster is all first/second year players. With Hayes being a 5th year senior, JT3 started assembling this roster 6-7 years ago.
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eagle54
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Post by eagle54 on Mar 8, 2017 23:04:05 GMT -5
Mullin cleaned house when he took over the St John's program. His roster is all first/second year players. With Hayes being a 5th year senior, JT3 started assembling this roster 6-7 years ago. Can't think that way as he may be running a dirty program by all accounts from our fanbase and we are not.
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hoya95
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Post by hoya95 on Mar 8, 2017 23:05:23 GMT -5
Well, that was the wildest atmosphere for an opening round game between two teams going nowhere that I've ever seen. Since things seemed cursed from the start, I'd much rather go down after emptying the tank. Can't fault the effort. The lack of ball handlers, the insane turnovers, and the brutal free throws did us in.
That said, Chris Mullin turned a small pushing and shoving issue into something much bigger by screaming "F you" to every Georgetown person he could find. It almost got real ugly on the court, and it was starting to get ugly in the stands. I long for the old days too, but all those coaches knew when they needed to calm things down, not throw gas on the fire. Fights are one thing, but brawls are something much worse. Mullin didn't seem to know or care what his responsibilities were at that point.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Mar 8, 2017 23:09:15 GMT -5
Rafferty commented on Govan "lollygagging " on D. Rarely do announcers call out crappy effort like that.
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