TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Apr 1, 2015 9:51:24 GMT -5
We. Have. No. One. That. Shoots. The. Three-Ball. Consistently. Yes, in limited usage some/all of our sophomores showed flashes, but seriously this is a major problem. We need a guard that can shoot the 3 or else it doesn't work. Picking up a spring signee '15 won't help immediately and seems like there are limited options in the transfer market. What about JUCO? I love our sophomores and think some/all of them will be special, but losing DSR hurts the most from behind the arc. I agree completely. Adding another solid shooter when we had DSR in the fold was my main goal given the loss of Trawick. That said, Cope shot it at a higher percentage than did DSR this year, White was awfully close (and that's including his lengthy slump), and so was Tre. Yes, much lower usage, but it's not like everyone remaining on the roster is Bowen. It's far from inconceivable that those three guys (all playing much more significant minutes and using more possessions) all shoot it at roughly the percentage DSR did. It'd just be spread around more, but the cumulative effect might be better. That's a lot of maybes, but it's not crazy-think. Now....I was hoping all those things would happen AND we'd have DSR, but oh well..... Peak shot less than 25% from behind the arc and averaged 2 three point attempts a game.
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nychoya3
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Post by nychoya3 on Apr 1, 2015 9:53:46 GMT -5
True but Peak hit a bunch of threes against Utah, so I choose to believe he is now a lights out shooter.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Apr 1, 2015 9:54:38 GMT -5
If you don't see Tre, at the very least, knocking down the three consistently next year then I don't know what to tell you... Heck, I said the same thing about Reggie last year and I bet you don't know what to tell me. In other words, as brasky said, we don't have the proven high-frequency shooter(s) and it doesn't hurt to get one now if available. As noted, I think we need another good perimeter shooter too. But let's not compare Reggie to what any of the three freshmen did last year. Reggie was at 32% in 13-14. I'm not saying you shouldn't have reasonably hoped for improvement from him (or at least something similar, which would have been nice), but all three of our freshmen this year (39, 38, and 36) shot at a notably better percentage than did Reggie. If you just get that again from them with higher usage (i.e., we take and make roughly the same number of total threes we did this year), it's far from a disaster.
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canissaxa
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Post by canissaxa on Apr 1, 2015 9:55:49 GMT -5
I think he has the capacity to become (holds back urge to vomit) a shooter of JJ Reddick's caliber, and to project for the NBA in similar fashion. He needs to get a quicker release and become more comfortable with guys right in his face to get near that level. JJ Redick comparison is spot on for this reason: Wingspan. DSR is half an inch shorter in wingspan than his listed height (6'3.5"). Per this article (http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2014/05/nba_wingspans_forget_height_basketball_players_wingspans_are_absurd_and.html), Redick was the ONLY player in the NBA with a shorter wingspan than height in 2012 (I believe the current count is 2). He's also a top 5 shooter in the league (behind Curry and Korver for sure, but I can't think of anyone else definitively). In any case, I absolutely wish DSR the best and thank him for all he's given to the program, but "declaring for the draft" means playing in Europe--where he will probably be very successful and make a fair bit of cash. I could even be persuaded his decision makes sense even with 0% chance to be drafted and stick in the league: - His physical attributes aren't going to change in a year of college ball.
- He's already been pre-season player of the year, and his senior year would likely feel like a retread (although, one could hope for a Final Four appearance and/or BET win to polish the resume).
- Playing careers and developmental windows for high-level basketball are short. If he makes $500k / year in Europe, leaving now gives him another year at that salary. It also gives him the full-time professional approach to developing his game while he's a year younger--which will probably increase his per-year earnings over his playing career.
I suppose there is a non-zero chance that he uses the development time in Europe to develop his shot and he may even get to come home to the NBA in a rotation role, but I think it's a very long shot. But even without the NBA, he's a great Hoya and I wish him the absolute best of luck next year and in the future.
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Post by aleutianhoya on Apr 1, 2015 9:56:08 GMT -5
I agree completely. Adding another solid shooter when we had DSR in the fold was my main goal given the loss of Trawick. That said, Cope shot it at a higher percentage than did DSR this year, White was awfully close (and that's including his lengthy slump), and so was Tre. Yes, much lower usage, but it's not like everyone remaining on the roster is Bowen. It's far from inconceivable that those three guys (all playing much more significant minutes and using more possessions) all shoot it at roughly the percentage DSR did. It'd just be spread around more, but the cumulative effect might be better. That's a lot of maybes, but it's not crazy-think. Now....I was hoping all those things would happen AND we'd have DSR, but oh well..... Peak shot less than 25% from behind the arc and averaged 2 three point attempts a game. I never mentioned Peak. Tre, Paul, and Ike all shot at a decent percentage last year -- better than DSR in Ike's case.
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Apr 1, 2015 10:03:17 GMT -5
Heck, I said the same thing about Reggie last year and I bet you don't know what to tell me. In other words, as brasky said, we don't have the proven high-frequency shooter(s) and it doesn't hurt to get one now if available. As noted, I think we need another good perimeter shooter too. But let's not compare Reggie to what any of the three freshmen did last year. Reggie was at 32% in 13-14. I'm not saying you shouldn't have reasonably hoped for improvement from him (or at least something similar, which would have been nice), but all three of our freshmen this year (39, 38, and 36) shot at a notably better percentage than did Reggie. If you just get that again from them with higher usage (i.e., we take and make roughly the same number of total threes we did this year), it's far from a disaster. I want to believe Reggie can be a 42%+ 3-pt shooter. Glass half-full!
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beenaround
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Post by beenaround on Apr 1, 2015 10:06:52 GMT -5
I think losing DSR hurts more than "just behind the arc" as some are saying. While hardly a typical, quick point guard like Campbell or even Markel before him, DSR was the most sure handed ball handler on the team. He handled the presses extremely well, AND when he was fouled, he made his free throws. When teams press next year, other than Tre (who will still need to tighten his handle a bit), who do we trust getting it up the court? I know LJ and PW have solid ball handling skills, but it is yet another thing trying to beat the press. Will be interesting to see who, if anyone, steps up in that role next year...other than obviously Tre C.
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This Just In
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Post by This Just In on Apr 1, 2015 10:08:56 GMT -5
DSR becomes the first guard drafted under III, you heard it here first. Bracey and Fultz committ right after. What round do you think DSR gets drafted in?
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Apr 1, 2015 10:22:47 GMT -5
I think losing DSR hurts more than "just behind the arc" as some are saying. While hardly a typical, quick point guard like Campbell or even Markel before him, DSR was the most sure handed ball handler on the team. He handled the presses extremely well, AND when he was fouled, he made his free throws. When teams press next year, other than Tre (who will still need to tighten his handle a bit), who do we trust getting it up the court? I know LJ and PW have solid ball handling skills, but it is yet another thing trying to beat the press. Will be interesting to see who, if anyone, steps up in that role next year...other than obviously Tre C. I am not overly concerned about the press - the main reason being that most teams do not press. I realize that it can be a problem at times (and if we play VCU at all in the 2K Classic, it would definitely be a problem) but overall I think people tend to over emphasize the need to break a press. Yes, it is extremely important, but most of the time your guards aren't breaking a press, and I think Campbell is more than capable of doing that along with the other guys we have. DSR was a good ball handler, but he also wasn't super speedy (like Campbell) either. I am more concerned with depth. We are one Campbell injury away from truly being in an awful situation.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Apr 1, 2015 10:25:03 GMT -5
I think losing DSR hurts more than "just behind the arc" as some are saying. While hardly a typical, quick point guard like Campbell or even Markel before him, DSR was the most sure handed ball handler on the team. He handled the presses extremely well, AND when he was fouled, he made his free throws. When teams press next year, other than Tre (who will still need to tighten his handle a bit), who do we trust getting it up the court? I know LJ and PW have solid ball handling skills, but it is yet another thing trying to beat the press. Will be interesting to see who, if anyone, steps up in that role next year...other than obviously Tre C. I am not overly concerned about the press - the main reason being that most teams do not press. I realize that it can be a problem at times (and if we play VCU at all in the 2K Classic, it would definitely be a problem) but overall I think people tend to over emphasize the need to break a press. Yes, it is extremely important, but most of the time your guards aren't breaking a press, and I think Campbell is more than capable of doing that along with the other guys we have. DSR was a good ball handler, but he also wasn't super speedy (like Campbell) either. I am more concerned with depth. We are one Campbell injury away from truly being in an awful situation. When every one of your players 1-4 can handle the ball reasonably well in the open court, like our current roster, it's a lot easier to break a press. If anything, we should welcome the press b/c we should be able to go over the top of it and get easy transition baskets (similar to what Kentucky was able to do against WVU).
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Apr 1, 2015 10:33:12 GMT -5
So I'm the only one that thinks this is a well constructed April Fools joke?
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Apr 1, 2015 10:38:11 GMT -5
To paraphrase Billy Conn, "what's the point of being 21 if you can't be stupid?"
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2015 11:05:04 GMT -5
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 1, 2015 11:06:55 GMT -5
Some hot sports opinions to follow, but I remain loyal to John Thompson's stand from 40+ years ago: he wasn't interested in recruits who weren't interested in a degree. Nor should we. Unless a player is a lottery pick, out of eligibility, or flunking out, he should always be back for his senior year. DSR did not hold up his end of the bargain, plain & simple. Where to even begin.... I guess on the "your opinion is wildly internally inconsistent" part. If he's flunking out, how has he upheld his end of the bargain? And even if he's a lottery pick, if the expectation is that players graduate, what difference should it make if they're a high draft pick or undrafted? Either way, they didn't complete their degree in the normal four-year window you seem to require. It's just a question of degree: DSR is going "pro"; it's just that he won't get 8 figures guaranteed to do it. But that has nothing to do with any graduation/bargain. Aside from that, the "bargain," as I see it, is to get someone's best effort on the court in exchange for an education. Georgetown got his best effort for three years on the court, and gave him an education for three years. Quid. Pro. Quo. And who's to say he wasn't interested in a degree? Or isn't still now? Why is there magic to "four years" of basketball play in exchange for an education, if the education can be completed in 3.5 years. Or, if it can be completed after the fact? If he flunks out because he simply wasn't able to handle the academics -- despite his best efforts -- then that's all that can be asked of the student.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 1, 2015 11:08:38 GMT -5
Some hot sports opinions to follow, but I remain loyal to John Thompson's stand from 40+ years ago: he wasn't interested in recruits who weren't interested in a degree. Nor should we. Unless a player is a lottery pick, out of eligibility, or flunking out, he should always be back for his senior year. DSR did not hold up his end of the bargain, plain & simple. Where does this "lottery pick" standard come from? Why are you loyal if you leave as the 10th pick in the draft but you're a traitor if you leave as the 20th pick? Seems like an artificial standard to avoid having to call out the Jeff Greens and Otto Porters of the world. Also, you may not like it, but DSR didn't have a bargain with us, let alone you. He had a bargain with JT3 and his teammates. And I would bet a lot of money that his teammates and his coach, even if they're disappointed in his decision, will support his right to make it for himself. If you're a lottery pick, you're a lottery pick. There aren't players that are "he could go #3 or he could slip to the end of the first round." However, once you get out of the lottery, then the range of where you might be drafted increases materially, and that risk counsels against coming out early.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 1, 2015 11:12:16 GMT -5
Some hot sports opinions to follow, but I remain loyal to John Thompson's stand from 40+ years ago: he wasn't interested in recruits who weren't interested in a degree. Nor should we. Unless a player is a lottery pick, out of eligibility, or flunking out, he should always be back for his senior year. DSR did not hold up his end of the bargain, plain & simple. He didn't "hold up his end of the bargain"? What does he owe you? How is he any different than any other student? Because he plays basketball for the team you root for? Did Paul Allen, Michael Dell, Mark Zuckerberg & Bill Gates hold up their end of the bargain when they left college? DSR isn't allowed to make a living so you can have pleasure watching basketball? Neanderthal viewpoint. Either you have the IQ of a neanderthal, or your can't read. The bargain wasn't with DFW or the fanbase - it was with JT3 and the school. In exchange for a scholarship and education at GU, a player is expected to stay and get his degree if he can handle the academics, or unless he is assured of being a top pick. Were Paul Allen, Michael Dell, Mark Zuckerberg or Bill Gates recruited to play sports at their schools? No. No one has ever prevented DSR from making a living. However, there are multiple paths one can take in life. Choosing a specific one, such as playing at GU, comes with certain expectations.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 1, 2015 11:15:40 GMT -5
Wait, I have a blueprint? No, Georgetown has a blueprint. It's no secret, and no bait-and-switch. If you, as a recruit, are not interested in earning a degree, don't take the offer. If you do, give it your full commitment. It's clearly not Georgetown's blueprint, or else we wouldn't have taken Greg Monroe. We wouldn't have tried like heck to recruit Nerlens Noel (among others). So, I think that's simply not true. More broadly, if we said to a recruit the following, we would never be good enough to meet anyone's expectations on this board: "Son, I really want you at Georgetown. But I only want you to come here if you commit to me right now that you intend to get your degree on time so that you play four years of basketball, and I'm going to hold you to that commitment even if you've developed as much as you're going to develop and you can make significant money playing basketball." You may not like it, and that's perfectly fine, but I don't see how you can fully reconcile what I know are your high aspirations for success with the reality of today's era. Can you not read, or are you intentionally being obtuse?
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 1, 2015 11:19:39 GMT -5
Apparently, many of you missed the above thread, or you just didn't read it. Repeating: I have no issues with someone who has a unique NBA opportunity (Monroe, Green, Porter), nor someone who cannot hack it academically and must go elsewhere. DSR is neither. DFW, I respect you and your efforts with this site but couldn't disagree with you any more. Your standard is both arbitrary and unrealistic. It fails to reflect that things and circumstances change over time. Kids leave college or transfer to another college all the time. Moreover, DSR held up his end of the bargain by playing basketball here (and quite well) for 3 years in return for 3 years of education. Should a kid not be allowed to transfer unless it's for some unique opportunity (as determined by DFW, me or someone else) once he has made a commitment to play basketball at Georgetown? Do "student-athletes" not have the right to re-evaluate the decisions that they have made in the past and decide to choose another path in their best interests (which may have changed over time due to changes in circumstances)? Or should student-athletes always act in the best interests of their universities instead of themselves? Should student-athletes even be allowed to determine what is in their best interests or should you or me or anyone else here make that determination for them? I don't think you know what the meaning of "arbitrary" is.
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Apr 1, 2015 11:20:00 GMT -5
To paraphrase Billy Conn, "what's the point of being 21 if you can't be stupid?" Can anyone really blame DSR for jumping early? Selfishly, we'd all love to have him back....but let's look at this from his perspective. If DSR were to come back and put up 20 a game, would that change the NBA's perception of him? Seriously doubt it. The kid has a 10 or so year window to make a couple hundred grand a year, he wants it to start now. In the end, who are we to call him stupid!
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 1, 2015 11:24:33 GMT -5
To paraphrase Billy Conn, "what's the point of being 21 if you can't be stupid?" You mean 23.
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