rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Feb 8, 2016 16:23:24 GMT -5
This year's GU basketball program says Tre was first team WCAC all star and was the 31st ranked point guard coming out of high school. That makes him a top guard recruit in my book. To our Dr from Chelsea he may have had one or two recruiting listing in the top 100 his combined rcsi may have been at 132 not that i take much creedence in any of them he was border line top 40-50 guard. To say turn LJ into a lead guard vs Tre is even more questionable. Both are 2 guards under any kind of system you run. How nyone evaluated him as a lead guard who could make a major contributuion here or in most high major programs is the question I would ask the staff. From The beginning last year he was lacking in any basic skills to handle the position unless he was viewed as a 2 to 3 year project. Last year he could shoot a little from outside may have shot close to 40% from 3 but may have been at under 30% inside arc. His passing, handle change of direction are seriously subpar and as ive said before his offense is the best part of his game. How you can play in the WCAC for 4 years and you play defense the way he does tells me the DMV is not what it use to be at the high scholl level If thats how defense is taught why did we need a rules change to promote more offense. Last point and I really don't mean to go off on Tre but This was all evident last december in limited minutes, the only skill he showed was hitting an open 3 from about 2 spots on the floor. Still for the life of me I do not understand why we didn't find another true lead guard for this year. We did try.
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Post by HometownHoya on Feb 8, 2016 17:05:55 GMT -5
To our Dr from Chelsea he may have had one or two recruiting listing in the top 100 his combined rcsi may have been at 132 not that i take much creedence in any of them he was border line top 40-50 guard. To say turn LJ into a lead guard vs Tre is even more questionable. Both are 2 guards under any kind of system you run. How nyone evaluated him as a lead guard who could make a major contributuion here or in most high major programs is the question I would ask the staff. From The beginning last year he was lacking in any basic skills to handle the position unless he was viewed as a 2 to 3 year project. Last year he could shoot a little from outside may have shot close to 40% from 3 but may have been at under 30% inside arc. His passing, handle change of direction are seriously subpar and as ive said before his offense is the best part of his game. How you can play in the WCAC for 4 years and you play defense the way he does tells me the DMV is not what it use to be at the high scholl level If thats how defense is taught why did we need a rules change to promote more offense. Last point and I really don't mean to go off on Tre but This was all evident last december in limited minutes, the only skill he showed was hitting an open 3 from about 2 spots on the floor. Still for the life of me I do not understand why we didn't find another true lead guard for this year. Of all the criticisms of JT3 and his coaches, if Tre turns out to be a real bust then this would be the one criticism that should stick, namely that they either can't evaluate talent or are unable to get the most out of it. Obviously they thought they were getting a top tier point guard in Tre. He isn't from Indiana, they had to have seen him play a bunch of times in high school and had lots of input from locals who also saw him. After watching him play - and practice - for a whole year they still must feel the same way since they didn't go for one this year (is Kaleb a legit pg?). So either he is a sleeper waiting to come alive as an upperclassman or JT3 and his staff need to reconsider how they judge talent and also talk to their friends in the WCAC and ask them what gives. BTW Marcus is also a WCAC all star and hasn't impressed very much. Tre was the third FOURTH most heralded recruit in his Hoya class. There were definite hopes that he would be making an impact his 2nd year but most people, at the time of his commitment, saw him as a 4 year player would would be ready in his 3rd year for big minutes. Surprisingly we're still on track, guess we should fire JT3. It was not like Markel who was leading his HS team as a PG for 4 years. A lot of people knew Tre as a scorer and had concerns about the ability to turn him into a PG; that is JT3's MO for guards though so it shouldn't be a surprise we went after him. Kaleb is not a PG, he was an afterthought SG/SF depth signing. Any contribution we have from him is a plus. What more do you expect from Marcus? He's only a freshman and not consistent. He's given us good minutes and even earned a starting role at times. He makes dumb mistakes that all freshman do but has an outside/in game that we haven't seen at Georgetown (Jeff Green is close but he was more inside/out). Some people on this forum need a dose of reality (not even just about Tre). It's not easy to win every game (hell look at Duke, Vandy and UK this year). Every player doesn't become a star once they step foot on campus. Not everyone plays to 100% all the time. Not everyone listens and does what the Coaches say all the time. It's fine to look for perfection in your own work but entirely unreasonable to expect perfection from others. Take a breath and appreciate G-town basketball for what it is: a clean program that is competitive (most of the time).
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Feb 8, 2016 17:16:08 GMT -5
Of all the criticisms of JT3 and his coaches, if Tre turns out to be a real bust then this would be the one criticism that should stick, namely that they either can't evaluate talent or are unable to get the most out of it. Obviously they thought they were getting a top tier point guard in Tre. He isn't from Indiana, they had to have seen him play a bunch of times in high school and had lots of input from locals who also saw him. After watching him play - and practice - for a whole year they still must feel the same way since they didn't go for one this year (is Kaleb a legit pg?). So either he is a sleeper waiting to come alive as an upperclassman or JT3 and his staff need to reconsider how they judge talent and also talk to their friends in the WCAC and ask them what gives. BTW Marcus is also a WCAC all star and hasn't impressed very much. Tre was the third most heralded recruit in his Hoya class. There were definite hopes that he would be making an impact his 2nd year but most people, at the time of his commitment, saw him as a 4 year player would would be ready in his 3rd year for big minutes. Surprisingly we're still on track, guess we should fire JT3. It was not like Markel who was leading his HS team as a PG for 4 years. A lot of people knew Tre as a scorer and had concerns about the ability to turn him into a PG; that is JT3's MO for guards though so it shouldn't be a surprise we went after him. I figured Campbell was on the Markel Starks' timeline (which he's not really living up to, tbh, but obviously he still has two more years), but that doesn't change the fact that there was a clear gap between him (unranked) and Ike (#28 RSCI), Paul (#51 RSCI) and Peak (#62 RSCI).
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chep3
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Post by chep3 on Feb 8, 2016 17:30:07 GMT -5
Can Mosley play the PG? Or are we putting our eggs for next year in the Tre developing into a PG basket? Maybe being asked to do more of that will result in him stepping up.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 8, 2016 18:21:54 GMT -5
So is the consensus that Tre was the best pg we could get or that our Coach overestimated Tre's skills? Curious to see if Tre shows us anything tonight.
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Feb 8, 2016 21:18:51 GMT -5
Not giving up on Tre yet. One part of the problem I believe is that too much time has been spent trying to make DSR a pg. Although that may be good for his future development at the next level, it has not helped the team. Too much has been demanded of DSR, who is also not a strong defender and lacks Tre's quickness. DSR is playing too long and his pg duties have hurt his offense. What has worried me most about Tre is his failure to develop his shot to the extent I expected after the summer. Is my sarcasm detector broken? You do realize that the only reason DSR has spent time converting to PG is because Tre sucks at it right? If Markel was still on the team you think DSR would still need to carry PG duties (which he's actually done a pretty good job of, especially lately)?? DSR is a better defender, ball handler, shooter, and competitor than Tre, despite not having the "quickness" Tre has so I don't really get your point. Tre has too many lazy habits on offense and defense and that's why he hasn't improved. My point is that DSR is not a pg and not that he is not better than Tre. Ideally, Peak handles the ball and DSR is the off-guard. Unfortunately that option has not been there with the foul issues for Peak. Tre has clearly struggled and has not developed as expected. Yet having DSR run into the ground by playing long minutes with additional responsibilities against aggressive defenses has not helped either. So maybe there is no answer with this collection of talent, but I do believe that the team has not seen the best of DSR because he is trying to do too much.
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 8, 2016 21:26:38 GMT -5
Tre again looked terrible tonight. He actually had a fast break but stopped at 3 point line and passed it off to DSR(?). I will say that he seemed more aggressive when DSR was on the bench and he was playing with Ike. For some reason he seems intimidated when he is paired with DSR. Anyone else agree?
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Post by HometownHoya on Feb 9, 2016 0:10:27 GMT -5
Definitely defers a bit to DSR on O but my main gripe was defense. I like that he pressures (even token) the full court but in the half court he'll stick with his man then give up for a second. I don't know if its because he thinks his guy is taking a break, he's tired, or he just thinks he can and catch back up but too often he loses his man in motion. Additionally when he encounters a solid screen, I'm not sure what happens, he gives up the fight around easily, but we never get a good switch...is it because it isn't called out well enough, or everyone just follows the ball? I really don't know what is going on with Tre but I hope he finds his groove...who knows, maybe he'll light up X again.
Either way though, if DSR and LJ are both playing well, I think we are able to limit Tre's minutes (especially if Kaleb is solid) and really hold him for times when he is unstoppable.
I definitely have hope for him next year, I'm just not sure if he'll find an expanded role if everyone continues to play like they did tonight.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Feb 9, 2016 8:50:30 GMT -5
Tre Campbell needs to play the point behind Peak, he's better at this. He needs to attack a hella lot more that's for sure. Other than this I love him on the ball especially pressuring his opponent up the floor...
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Feb 9, 2016 8:51:26 GMT -5
L. J. Peak will carry us the rest of the way on the ball!!! This will take pressure off of DSR ..when he gets tired he starts jacking up ill advised 3's.
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bostonfan
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Post by bostonfan on Feb 9, 2016 8:52:34 GMT -5
Tre seems to play trying to not make mistakes instead of trying to make plays. For a player with his quickness he need to be aggressive. Sometimes that will end up in forced plays but that is part of the learning curve of playing D1 basketball in the Big East, knowing when to attack and when to just move the ball. At this point he almost always just looks to move the ball. St John's is a bad defensive team and Tre had some clear opportunities to attack the rim and get into the middle of the defense and he just seemed hesitant to do that. On the one time he did penetrate he got to the rim but seemed tentative finishing the play and missed an easy layup.
It really does look to be a confidence issue, where he is a afraid to make mistakes so always just makes the simple play and hopes his teammates can pick him up. It does seem he is more aggressive when he is not on the floor with DSR and that may just be that he feels he should always defer to DSR, but if he attacked more often and caused the defenses to respect him it would not only help his game but also open up DSR and his other teammates more often. Hopefully he can get past this mental issue, they need him to be much better this year and especially next year.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Feb 9, 2016 9:18:31 GMT -5
Tre again looked terrible tonight. He actually had a fast break but stopped at 3 point line and passed it off to DSR(?). I will say that he seemed more aggressive when DSR was on the bench and he was playing with Ike. For some reason he seems intimidated when he is paired with DSR. Anyone else agree? I think Tre does defer to DSR at times. The main job of a PG is, of course, to get the other guys the ball and get them going, but you do have to at least be enough of a threat to keep the D honest. I did not have a problem with Tre on that fast break. It is becoming a more common strategy to have a guy (or even two) run to a 3-point spot, since the defense is retreating into the paint. He made a deft little back pass and got a wide open 3 for DSR. If it goes in it looks like a great play
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drquigley
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Post by drquigley on Feb 9, 2016 9:54:14 GMT -5
Would love to see that play again but I was sure Tre had the defenders backing up and could have taken it to the hoop. I agree though that this is a confidence thing. He has to be more assertive with the ball.
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Post by trillesthoya on Feb 9, 2016 10:28:31 GMT -5
Tre looked good in some ways last night in my opinion. From what I can tell it looks like his ball handling has improved moderately since the start of the year. He got to the hoop very well on one play but for whatever the reason the ball didn't go in. Someone else mentioned it might have been hesitation but to me it just looked like one of those unlucky shots. His defense remains the biggest overall issue for him, but even there I would say compared to where he was at this point last year there has been SOME development. Unfortunately not much else to praise at this point.
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rockhoya
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Post by rockhoya on Feb 9, 2016 10:44:08 GMT -5
Tre looked good in some ways last night in my opinion. From what I can tell it looks like his ball handling has improved moderately since the start of the year. He got to the hoop very well on one play but for whatever the reason the ball didn't go in. Someone else mentioned it might have been hesitation but to me it just looked like one of those unlucky shots. His defense remains the biggest overall issue for him, but even there I would say compared to where he was at this point last year there has been SOME development. Unfortunately not much else to praise at this point. He hesitated and pulled up before getting to the rim.... He actually botched an open driving lane, one that he was already set on too smh
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Feb 9, 2016 10:53:49 GMT -5
Of all the criticisms of JT3 and his coaches, if Tre turns out to be a real bust then this would be the one criticism that should stick, namely that they either can't evaluate talent or are unable to get the most out of it. Yes, by all means, despite the fact that the staff has evaluated thousands of recruits and gotten close to fifty to come to Georgetown, let's evaluate JTIII and the staff on the performance of a single recruit, because that makes sense.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Feb 9, 2016 12:42:28 GMT -5
Of all the criticisms of JT3 and his coaches, if Tre turns out to be a real bust then this would be the one criticism that should stick, namely that they either can't evaluate talent or are unable to get the most out of it. Yes, by all means, despite the fact that the staff has evaluated thousands of recruits and gotten close to fifty to come to Georgetown, let's evaluate JTIII and the staff on the performance of a single recruit, because that makes sense. My sentiments, exactly. I started to respond to that post, but I just let it go as yet another over the top comment.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Feb 9, 2016 13:30:27 GMT -5
Of all the criticisms of JT3 and his coaches, if Tre turns out to be a real bust then this would be the one criticism that should stick, namely that they either can't evaluate talent or are unable to get the most out of it. Yes, by all means, despite the fact that the staff has evaluated thousands of recruits and gotten close to fifty to come to Georgetown, let's evaluate JTIII and the staff on the performance of a single recruit, because that makes sense. Your right SF,but for me Tre has become the whipping boy for what in my mind is not evaluating or developing talent but a recruiting philosophy that doesn't seem to value real solid guard play. Ive been down on him since last year primarily because he played defense like a .. no just doesn't play it. i have no animus towards him I absolutely hope he turns into much more. When you have DSR playing 38 min game after game in a position he is still learning on the flysomethings wrong. In a game that has become much more guard oriented we are at a disadvatage on both sides of the ball. we never prepared to replace Starks clearly didn't have a defensive presence to fill the roll of Trawick nor his penetration ability and high 3pt % and we look forward to replacing DSRs 38 mins and maybe even Peak if he continues at his current rate. It just appears that the backcourt in the staffs eyes is almost an afterthought heck DSR pickup could almost be construed that way. I'm not nor was i ever looking for one of those 5 star guard recruits just get a couple of kids who can play on both sides of the ball and can contribute from day one in a meanigfull way. unfortunately we have but two spots open barring early exits and we will most likely give one to a semi-athletic wing. The future is not bright unless the Staff makes some radical changes. To be clear i'm not advocating radical changes to the staff.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2016 14:26:51 GMT -5
Tre again looked terrible tonight. He actually had a fast break but stopped at 3 point line and passed it off to DSR(?). I will say that he seemed more aggressive when DSR was on the bench and he was playing with Ike. For some reason he seems intimidated when he is paired with DSR. Anyone else agree? I think Tre does defer to DSR at times. The main job of a PG is, of course, to get the other guys the ball and get them going, but you do have to at least be enough of a threat to keep the D honest. I did not have a problem with Tre on that fast break. It is becoming a more common strategy to have a guy (or even two) run to a 3-point spot, since the defense is retreating into the paint. He made a deft little back pass and got a wide open 3 for DSR. If it goes in it looks like a great play Copeland was coming down the lane, 2-on-1 with Tre. Two guys playing with a ton of confidence would have made eye contact and connected for the alley-oop. It was available.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Feb 9, 2016 14:43:20 GMT -5
I think Tre does defer to DSR at times. The main job of a PG is, of course, to get the other guys the ball and get them going, but you do have to at least be enough of a threat to keep the D honest. I did not have a problem with Tre on that fast break. It is becoming a more common strategy to have a guy (or even two) run to a 3-point spot, since the defense is retreating into the paint. He made a deft little back pass and got a wide open 3 for DSR. If it goes in it looks like a great play Copeland was coming down the lane, 2-on-1 with Tre. Two guys playing with a ton of confidence would have made eye contact and connected for the alley-oop. It was available. Tre plays better behind Peak. Tre is not an attack point guard. This hurts because while we're playing perimeter hoops we are turning the ball over instead of attacking the basket. I just need to see mental and physical toughness with Campbell. Especially on the ball...
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