seaweed
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Post by seaweed on Oct 4, 2014 10:06:43 GMT -5
I live in SC now (just south of Charlotte) and I regret not taking the time to go see LJ play in high school. Even if he doesn't start right away he will be sooner or later. You can't keep talent like that off the floor. If the Rothstein/MCI starting 5 happens it's because our freshmen are as good as advertised and that should scare the hell out of the rest of the BE country. Jabril Josh Smith DSR Copleland LJ Fixed that for you. Starting five? While we all agree that finishing minutes are more meaningful, nobody is denying that starting means something too, right? Especially if you are a freshman in a program that tends to favor proven talent who understand the defensive schemes, which are far more complex than the intricate offense. Problem with speculating about starting frosh is that we have at least three who are allegedly (legal disclaimer) good enough to lace up day one. And based on position needs, we could use a 4th at the point if he is serviceable, let DSR stay at the 2. As far as returning players...gees, there is more of an issue since two or three guys have real question marks next to their names, there is only one guy who is certain, two probables and like 4 guys could be the ones who earn it. Who pushes his way through and who never quiet gels? Add to that the need for the first off the bench factor and III's typically cryptic preseason communications and your guess is as good as mine DSR is really the 100% given. Everything hinges on the D and dynamic because the talent to start is there for at least 5 returners and 3 frosh, so bare minimum you are choosing your 5 from 8. If Reggie, Hayes or Campbell is shining it just gets harder. It comes down to which group plays the best style of ball together. Some random observations: Jabril is over-qualified to be sixth man, but he would win 6th of the Year if. Same with Josh Smith if he could do it but something tells me his head wouldn't wrap itself around the concept. Also, that would mean Hayes, Hops or Cameron was more suited to start, which I can't wrap my head around. Peak or Copeland will be the first of the frosh to start. White is the toughest call because of what almost looks like a reserved style, but at his size I don't see him starting up front and the competition for the first three is two intense. DSR, Jabril, White/Copeland/Hop Smith and Hayes would be the tallest starting five in the country. Look it up. It's all about the defense. So, drum roll please... 43 days to go DSR Trawick Peak Hop Smith
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Oct 4, 2014 11:12:41 GMT -5
It's DSR-Trawick-Peak-Copeland-Smith.
If it isn't Game 1, and I think it will be, it won't be long.
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Post by michaelgrahmstylie on Oct 4, 2014 13:01:41 GMT -5
Did I really just heard someone else make the MJ comparison in reference to LJ. When I first said it I was taken to task. I am not going to let this board forget it either. Let's roll, Hoyas!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 4, 2014 13:31:54 GMT -5
Not sure on starting, it will be interesting. I remember Hopkins looking his best playing with Josh last year, especially defensively and rebounding the basketball. On the offensive side White and Copeland’s ability to stretch the floor looks like a better fit, at least on paper. I think the minutes breakdown looks something like this..
DSR 35 Trawick 31 Peak 25 Josh 20 Copeland 20 Hopkins 18 Bowen 15 Hayes 15 White 10 Cameron 7 Campbell 4
One things for sure is that’s a lot of guys that can contribute and also bring various skill sets to the table.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Oct 4, 2014 19:50:28 GMT -5
It's DSR-Trawick-Peak-Copeland-Smith. If it isn't Game 1, and I think it will be, it won't be long. This is the lineup I really want to see. I think we are very likely to get this unless JT3 goes with Hopkins, which would probably be a mistake. DSR, Trawick, and Smith are definite starters. The other two slots will be Peak, Copeland, or Hopkins. Even if Hopkins gets the start initially I'm pretty confident that someone else will supplant him before long.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Oct 4, 2014 20:16:33 GMT -5
It's DSR-Trawick-Peak-Copeland-Smith. If it isn't Game 1, and I think it will be, it won't be long. This is the lineup I really want to see. I think we are very likely to get this unless JT3 goes with Hopkins, which would probably be a mistake. DSR, Trawick, and Smith are definite starters. The other two slots will be Peak, Copeland, or Hopkins. Even if Hopkins gets the start initially I'm pretty confident that someone else will supplant him before long. Really? I'm not going to get in the way of the Peak Bandwagon around here again, but JTIII routinely avoids starting freshmen unless there is a material reason to do so. So how many games did Otto Porter start as a freshman? Eight. Greg Whitington? Zero. DSR? Zero. I don't see a reason why Hopkins and Cameron aren't starting for much of the season, because JTIII's lineups have never been a popularity contest.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Oct 4, 2014 20:36:53 GMT -5
This is the lineup I really want to see. I think we are very likely to get this unless JT3 goes with Hopkins, which would probably be a mistake. DSR, Trawick, and Smith are definite starters. The other two slots will be Peak, Copeland, or Hopkins. Even if Hopkins gets the start initially I'm pretty confident that someone else will supplant him before long. Really? I'm not going to get in the way of the Peak Bandwagon around here again, but JTIII routinely avoids starting freshmen unless there is a material reason to do so. So how many games did Otto Porter start as a freshman? Eight. Greg Whitington? Zero. DSR? Zero. I don't see a reason why Hopkins and Cameron aren't starting for much of the season, because JTIII's lineups have never been a popularity contest. They won't, because they've been a talent contest. The best players will play.
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Post by HometownHoya on Oct 4, 2014 20:49:38 GMT -5
It's DSR-Trawick-Peak-Copeland-Smith. If it isn't Game 1, and I think it will be, it won't be long. This is the lineup I really want to see. I think we are very likely to get this unless JT3 goes with Hopkins, which would probably be a mistake. DSR, Trawick, and Smith are definite starters. The other two slots will be Peak, Copeland, or Hopkins. Even if Hopkins gets the start initially I'm pretty confident that someone else will supplant him before long. I could see Hopkins starting for a while. He can play the 4 effectively along with Josh and then slide to the 5 for when Copeland comes in. Give Josh a breather then take out Hopkins for a Copeland-Smith frontcourt.
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Post by dungeon ball on Oct 4, 2014 21:01:57 GMT -5
This is the lineup I really want to see. I think we are very likely to get this unless JT3 goes with Hopkins, which would probably be a mistake. DSR, Trawick, and Smith are definite starters. The other two slots will be Peak, Copeland, or Hopkins. Even if Hopkins gets the start initially I'm pretty confident that someone else will supplant him before long. Really? I'm not going to get in the way of the Peak Bandwagon around here again, but JTIII routinely avoids starting freshmen unless there is a material reason to do so. So how many games did Otto Porter start as a freshman? Eight. Greg Whitington? Zero. DSR? Zero. I don't see a reason why Hopkins and Cameron aren't starting for much of the season, because JTIII's lineups have never been a popularity contest. If Otto was a freshman on this team, he'd start
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Oct 4, 2014 21:53:58 GMT -5
Even Jesse Sapp lost his spot. This iteration of Hoyas needs scoring and D. Unless Reggie has made big strides on both fronts, his minutes are there for the taking. Heck, he sat a lot last year with a huge need for offense and a bad defensive group overall. I wouldn't put him ahead of Peak and Copeland due to his experience or what he's shown. Hop is a bigger question mark though, at least initially, I think he starts. He's still a more likely option to share the load at the 5 than is Hayes so he may still be caught in a positional pickle.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Oct 4, 2014 21:55:00 GMT -5
Out of curiosity, how many games did Greg, Jeff, and DaJuan start as freshmen?
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hoyazeke
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Post by hoyazeke on Oct 4, 2014 22:33:09 GMT -5
DaJuan probably didn't start too often but Greg and Jeff probably started a lot of games. I would bet that Jeff started 20+ and I don't remember Greg not starting.
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ksf42001
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Post by ksf42001 on Oct 4, 2014 22:46:06 GMT -5
DaJuan probably didn't start too often but Greg and Jeff probably started a lot of games. I would bet that Jeff started 20+ and I don't remember Greg not starting. I remember Summers starting every game after Egerson left the team in January. Austin took over for PE Jr around the same time his Freshman year.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Oct 4, 2014 23:30:05 GMT -5
I remember it the same as you two with regard to Greg and Jeff and similar to ks with regard to DaJuan. I wasn't able to confirm it but I know DFW can. Freshmen don't often start from day 1 unless there's a gaping hole or if their game forces JT3's hand. It's a new year with a team with some holes that, hopefully, the freshmen can fill. Should be fun. My biggest contention was with regard to Reggie. He didn't do enough to separate himself from any of the freshmen in terms of having earned a spot. He had a couple of solid offensive games but his defensive performance guarantees him nothing. I don't mean to disparage the kid. It's only what I saw. And Hayes getting 15-20 a game? Is that any more likely than a freshman starting?
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Oct 4, 2014 23:51:51 GMT -5
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Oct 4, 2014 23:56:52 GMT -5
Greg started every game as a freshman, Austin started 23/34 games as a freshman and Summers started 34/37. Heck, Nikita started 9 games as a freshman. JT3is willing to start freshman.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Oct 5, 2014 0:09:20 GMT -5
? I'm not going to get in the way of the Peak Bandwagon around here again Why stop now? The material reason this time being returning players from a squad that disappointed the previous season. How many did Austin Freeman start? How many did Greg Monroe start? How many did DaJuan Summers start? Please stop with the phony argument that III doesn't start freshmen when the situation calls for it. If the frosh are talented enough, smart enough and if there is a void to be filled then III will go ahead and put them in the starting lineup. When Otto arrived at GTown ahead of him were seniors Henry Sims and Jason Clark. Henry raised his game and was the best big man available and Jason was already a two-year starter going in and was being counted to be the Hoyas' best player and leading scorer (as well as contender for BE Player of the Year). In the backcourt as well was Markel Starks who was a year ahead of Otto, highly regarded himself when he came out of high school and the only point guard the team had. A fourth position was to be taken by Hollis Thompson who was more highly regarded coming out of high school than arguably any other player on that Hoya team. He was a junior, the best shooter on the team, on the verge of becoming Gtown's all-time best 3-point shooter and an NBA prospect. Of course he would be in the starting lineup. The last opening spot therefore was left for Nate Lubick, a sophomore who had made his way into the starting lineup of the team during the previous season. He too was a highly ranked recruit coming out of high school, was demonstrating growth in his game at that time at least and had a body more ready to bang at the four position in BE play than Otto Porter. So, tell me who would you have displaced in the starting lineup in favor of Otto at the beginning of that season? If it weren't for III getting into some disagreement with Starks its doubtful Otto would have ever made one start. The lineup was set, all the choices seemed obvious which meant Otto (and Greg) would have to come off the bench. The people ahead of Otto that season ended up being two guards who are both probably two of the top 20 guards the program has ever had and among the programs' all-time leading scorers (Clark, who ended up being First Team BE, and Starks); a big man who would eventually start in the NBA (Sims who ended up being Second Team All BE); the program's all-time three-point shooter who would eventually start in the NBA (Thompson, who ended up being Honorable Mention All BE); and, well, Lubick. But Lubick's body was better suited than Otto's for battles in the the paint and he had just about as high an IQ as Otto. Now...please tell me how that scenario is similar to the one facing the Hoyas this upcoming season. There are three guys who not only seem like locks but seem like obvious choices based upon what they've done and what they can bring to the team. DSR's status doesn't need explanation. Josh Smith is the best choice at center and even if he wasn't it isn't as if Copeland would be battling for the starting center position anyway. Jabril brings experience, toughness and defense. III said late last season that the Hoyas are a much better team when Jabril is on the court. So who you got left? Hopkins? Maybe III will go with him but that doesn't affect Peak. Reggie Cameron? I like Cameron but he only starts if III feels that his three-point shooting (which Reggie struggled with last season) is THAT important because Reggie doesn't do anything else better than Peak. Aaron Bowen? I'm a huge fan of Bowen and part of me want him to be rewarded for his loyalty to the program. Yet even though I'm sure he is on the verge of having his best season ever there was no reporting from this summer KL's play that his skillset, despite being four years older, was better than Peak's. In the interview with CBS Sports III listed Peak as one of the guys who ballhandling and understanding of how to play will help the team make up for the loss of Starks. He listed Jabril, DSR and Tre Campbell too. You know whom he did not list? Aaron Bowen. Not to mention that all things considered regarding injuries and suspensions, last season's Hoyas failed to put up a winning conference record in a much weaker Big East which suggests the talent level wasn't all that great last season. Porter and Whittington arrived at the program a yea after it had a very successful regular season. DSR did as well the following year. The records of those previous teams suggested the talent level was pretty good and therefore not in desperate need of infusion of talent of freshmen in the starting lineup. Look, if Markel Starks was returning this season and he and DSR had the backcourt on lockdown again, then I admit I would predict Jabril to take that last perimeter spot in the starting five over Peak despite my certainty that Peak is more talented. But since this isn't the scenario we are faced with, I'm betting Peak becomes a starter sooner or later this upcoming season. Copeland too.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Oct 5, 2014 7:05:51 GMT -5
Please stop with the phony argument that III doesn't start freshmen when the situation calls for it. If the frosh are talented enough, smart enough and if there is a void to be filled then III will go ahead and put them in the starting lineup. Thanks for making my point. Absent a major void (and there isn't right now, unless you're writing off Cameron), the freshmen will wait their turn.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Oct 5, 2014 9:10:34 GMT -5
Please stop with the phony argument that III doesn't start freshmen when the situation calls for it. If the frosh are talented enough, smart enough and if there is a void to be filled then III will go ahead and put them in the starting lineup. Thanks for making my point. Absent a major void (and there isn't right now, unless you're writing off Cameron), the freshmen will wait their turn. Well, I guess we'll know the answer soon enough.
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seaweed
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Post by seaweed on Oct 5, 2014 9:28:44 GMT -5
Thanks for the reminder that Nakita Messyrakov got 8 starts for this team...
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