Talos
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by Talos on Apr 4, 2015 16:03:09 GMT -5
Yes we need another 6'5" - 6'9" forward. Agua, White, Cameron, Derrickson, Copeland, Mourning, Peak & K. Johnson isn't enough. We need more!!! It's amazing how this coaching staff doesn't value guards. They need guards desperately the next two years. They need to add 3-4 guards and a center in 2015/2016. Yet they are looking to add a 9th forward. 1) Peak is a two guard. Not a small forward 2) Johnson and White both handle the ball well enough to play guard But it's cool. continue to lump them all together like they have the same skillset and do the same things. The agenda gets pushed better that way I think Peak has the potential to be a 2, but watching him this past year he was definitely a 3 in my eyes. Poor jumper, mediocre handle for a guard, and had trouble with on-ball defense on quick/athletic guards. I think Peak has the athleticism and potential to certainly develop into a shooting guard, but he's not there yet. His knuckleball jumper needs work, and I also think he needs to improve his conditioning. Look at his HS videos, and then compare to this year and he looks heavier (and not in a good way). He also looked gassed quite frequently in games he played a lot of minutes. Don't get me wrong, I love his potential but think he has to make some significant improvements to be called a shooting guard. Personally, I'm hoping he puts a lot of effort into improving over the summer. I'm really interested to see how he looks in November. I like White and Johnson a lot, but I think we're asking a lot for them to be primary ballhandlers if Tre gets hurt or is simply in foul trouble. After watching White in HS, I was also convinced he could fill in at the point. However, this past year he didn't look as comfortable as I had hoped. I also think it's a big IF to assume a freshman Johnson can fill in at guard as well. I could be wrong, but from the games/videos I've seen of Johnson I don't remember him playing either guard position very much. I think it's a stretch to think he could fill in at guard as a freshman at the college level when he didn't have much experience doing that in HS. All this to say that the current roster is relying on a lot of IFs, maybes, and luck at the guard position for next year. Yes, the staff could still bring in 1-2 guards from transfers/HS recruits, but it's a lot of pressure to scramble this late in the spring and compete against everyone for just a few guys. It's dangerous to construct rosters with such thin depth at one position and then just hope for no attrition. Yes, no one could have predicted DSR leaving early, but attrition happens every year in some form and successful programs find a way to prepare for it.
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birdman
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
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Post by birdman on Apr 4, 2015 16:52:18 GMT -5
Yes we need another 6'5" - 6'9" forward. Agua, White, Cameron, Derrickson, Copeland, Mourning, Peak & K. Johnson isn't enough. We need more!!! It's amazing how this coaching staff doesn't value guards. They need guards desperately the next two years. They need to add 3-4 guards and a center in 2015/2016. Yet they are looking to add a 9th forward. This is a really good and interesting point. You should dedicate a thread to your good and interesting thoughts.
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mfk24
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by mfk24 on Apr 4, 2015 16:59:22 GMT -5
1) Peak is a two guard. Not a small forward 2) Johnson and White both handle the ball well enough to play guard But it's cool. continue to lump them all together like they have the same skillset and do the same things. The agenda gets pushed better that way I think Peak has the potential to be a 2, but watching him this past year he was definitely a 3 in my eyes. Poor jumper, mediocre handle for a guard, and had trouble with on-ball defense on quick/athletic guards. I think Peak has the athleticism and potential to certainly develop into a shooting guard, but he's not there yet. His knuckleball jumper needs work, and I also think he needs to improve his conditioning. Look at his HS videos, and then compare to this year and he looks heavier (and not in a good way). He also looked gassed quite frequently in games he played a lot of minutes. Don't get me wrong, I love his potential but think he has to make some significant improvements to be called a shooting guard. Personally, I'm hoping he puts a lot of effort into improving over the summer. I'm really interested to see how he looks in November. I like White and Johnson a lot, but I think we're asking a lot for them to be primary ballhandlers if Tre gets hurt or is simply in foul trouble. After watching White in HS, I was also convinced he could fill in at the point. However, this past year he didn't look as comfortable as I had hoped. I also think it's a big IF to assume a freshman Johnson can fill in at guard as well. I could be wrong, but from the games/videos I've seen of Johnson I don't remember him playing either guard position very much. I think it's a stretch to think he could fill in at guard as a freshman at the college level when he didn't have much experience doing that in HS. All this to say that the current roster is relying on a lot of IFs, maybes, and luck at the guard position for next year. Yes, the staff could still bring in 1-2 guards from transfers/HS recruits, but it's a lot of pressure to scramble this late in the spring and compete against everyone for just a few guys. It's dangerous to construct rosters with such thin depth at one position and then just hope for no attrition. Yes, no one could have predicted DSR leaving early, but attrition happens every year in some form and successful programs find a way to prepare for it. I'd really like to see these successful programs that are stacked at every position and prepared for attrition, cause I don't see them. Outside of Kentucky nearly every team has depth issues at one position or another.
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beenaround
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by beenaround on Apr 4, 2015 17:41:52 GMT -5
I'm confused. Are there folks saying that the team is not thin at guard for next year? LJ's future is definitely at the 2 guard, but to my eyes he is really a 2/3 at this point, far from a pure shooting guard, like say DSR was the year before. I've seen Kaleb Johnson videos and read the reports from the recruiting gurus on this board...he also seems to be a 2/3 type of guy, at this point, is he not?
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Buckets
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Post by Buckets on Apr 4, 2015 18:04:29 GMT -5
Peak is a slashing 3 with 2 height and athleticism. He's a guard because at 6'5" with his athleticism he could be an NBA 2 but right now he can't shoot and his assist numbers are terrible (and rebounds but I don't want to pile on the board golden boy). If a kid has the right size, skills and athleticism for his position he's in the NBA. Given the offense we want to run, I'd sacrifice at size first. If you can get a guy who's gonna be a 6'6" power forward who can pass and stretch the floor I wouldn't mind.
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SirSaxa
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SirSaxa on Apr 4, 2015 18:17:03 GMT -5
LJ is not the ideal 2G at this point in his development. Neither is anyone else on the current squad. So... Tre is the point - he is a point. He has the size of a point. He's already played the point for us. He looks like a point when he's on the floor. No problem. What IS the problem? or problems? #1. There is no one behind Tre to play the point. #2. There is no ideal 2G on the current squad, there are only guys who could play there because someone has to.
So who COULD possibly play the 2G and who COULD possibly back up the PG? Peak, Johnson, White. Who else? We are going to get guard minutes from someone, might as well be those guys.
Unless JT3 and staff manage to pull a rabbit out of the hat much as they did with Josh a couple years ago. Of course, that was only partially successful. Hoping things turn out better this time - and that we don't lose sight of bringing in a couple top guards in 2016 too.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2015 21:17:34 GMT -5
Peak is a 2...
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Post by daymondmyles on Apr 4, 2015 21:39:35 GMT -5
Agreed, YaBoy. The fact that some dispute this is mind boggling.
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jwp91
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Post by jwp91 on Apr 4, 2015 21:59:48 GMT -5
Agreed, YaBoy. The fact that some dispute this is mind boggling. Yes, because JT3 consistently fields players that clearly fit the classical definition of positions. {sarcasm}
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mfk24
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by mfk24 on Apr 4, 2015 22:14:34 GMT -5
I think Peak is as much a 2 as Trawick was when he got here. His handle is better than a lot of people give him credit for, his weak jumper is a concern but he's a streaky shooter who I think can become more consistent. We ran a 3 guard line-up this year.
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Post by Problem of Dog on Apr 4, 2015 22:18:46 GMT -5
Would we want Kris Jenkins if he offered to transfer right now? No? Okay, then you don't want Joe Hampton. Jenkins and Hampton aren't the same player. Not in the least. Just because two guys have the same body type doesn't mean they have the same skillset. And having said that, I'd love Kris Jenkins. He's a winner We have absolutely no need for Jenkins, he and Hampton have the exact same body type and are the same type of player. I've seen them both play many times. You don't seem to understand the concept of there being different positions on a basketball court. Yeah, sure, let's have a lineup full of Derrickson's, Jenkins', Hampton's, Paul White's, and Reggie Cameron's. We'd be great...
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hoyazeke
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hoyazeke on Apr 4, 2015 22:33:49 GMT -5
Peak is a 2. Didn't we have the same worries about DSR coming into this season?
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Post by daytonahoya31 on Apr 5, 2015 1:08:26 GMT -5
Jenkins and Hampton aren't the same player. Not in the least. Just because two guys have the same body type doesn't mean they have the same skillset. And having said that, I'd love Kris Jenkins. He's a winner We have absolutely no need for Jenkins, he and Hampton have the exact same body type and are the same type of player. I've seen them both play many times. You don't seem to understand the concept of there being different positions on a basketball court. Yeah, sure, let's have a lineup full of Derrickson's, Jenkins', Hampton's, Paul White's, and Reggie Cameron's. We'd be great... cool story
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MCIGuy
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Anyone here? What am I supposed to update?
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Post by MCIGuy on Apr 5, 2015 1:47:43 GMT -5
Agreed, YaBoy. The fact that some dispute this is mind boggling. Bunch of Hoya fans question his handle even though dude was able to drive past practically any defender all year. He may not have always finished when getting to the rack but he sure as hell was able to pat the ball and make his way to the hoop. Then again this is the same fanbase which often cites Jonathan Wallace as an example of the type of guard III needs to get again in order to have great success. Wallace could shoot the rock...when left open, but his handle was non-existent. Did that make him a forward too?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Apr 5, 2015 7:18:28 GMT -5
Agreed, YaBoy. The fact that some dispute this is mind boggling. Bunch of Hoya fans question his handle even though dude was able to drive past practically any defender all year. He may not have always finished when getting to the rack but he sure as hell was able to pat the ball and make his way to the hoop. Then again this is the same fanbase which often cites Jonathan Wallace as an example of the type of guard III needs to get again in order to have great success. Wallace could shoot the rock...when left open, but his handle was non-existent. Did that make him a forward too? You mean the J. Wallace who scored 1,258 points for GU? He's the type of guard who makes any team more successful.
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Post by HoyasAreHungry on Apr 5, 2015 7:46:34 GMT -5
I may be in the minority but I actually think peak was pretty good handling the ball this year. Very rarely panicked under pressure with the rock in his hand.
But by all means please carry on in a thread where none of this discussion should be happening.
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njhoya78
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Post by njhoya78 on Apr 5, 2015 12:03:27 GMT -5
Didn't you know? Thread titles are merely illustrative, and not obligatory.
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Post by Problem of Dog on Apr 5, 2015 13:19:42 GMT -5
We have absolutely no need for Jenkins, he and Hampton have the exact same body type and are the same type of player. I've seen them both play many times. You don't seem to understand the concept of there being different positions on a basketball court. Yeah, sure, let's have a lineup full of Derrickson's, Jenkins', Hampton's, Paul White's, and Reggie Cameron's. We'd be great... cool story Well that a succinct and juvenile acknowledgement that you didn't know what you were talking about and ran into someone who did.
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Post by daytonahoya31 on Apr 5, 2015 13:57:58 GMT -5
Well that a succinct and juvenile acknowledgement that you didn't know what you were talking about and ran into someone who did. I've forgotten more basketball than you will ever know. I just don't feel like going back and forth with you. But believe me dude, you're bball experience or knowledge couldn't begin to even come close to mine. I'm on a different planet than you in that regard.
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Talos
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 612
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Post by Talos on Apr 5, 2015 15:58:06 GMT -5
Well, back to Joe Hampton....I actually was pleasantly surprised at his skillset while watching that game. Had nice form and great touch on his jumper, and showed some nice post moves. But he is absolutely enormous, I'd guess he is easily 280+. However, he seemed to carry the weight well; very heavy but well distributed and not as jiggly/flabby as other heavy basketball players we've seen lately...
As for our 2016 needs, he's got some talent but I'm not sure he's a fit. I'd prefer a true 5 in that class, since we'll only have one other on the roster. Yes, he's a little redundant with Derrickson already on the roster, but he seems to fit the mold of bigs that JTIII likes.
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