Big Dog
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,912
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 1, 2013 14:08:12 GMT -5
Not sure how an American with zero experience in soccer is going to ever get the knowledge or experience that a British announcer has had for an entire lifetime. Yet, Gus is really into trying to go after the next hot thing. He was really trying to insert himself into the MMA scene with his announcing on CBS and Showtime although he had zero experience in that field. Gus had been announcing San Jose games, apparently to much acclaim by their fanbase, before Fox offered him this gig. No, I don't think that's correct. I think he started experimenting with the San Jose games after Fox agreed a while back to make this happen. I can see that many in this thread probably didn't catch this story. Read at least the first two paragraphs: sportsillustrated.cnn.com/soccer/news/20130205/gus-johnson-world-cup-fox/
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:08:56 GMT -5
Is it completely absurd to wonder if somehow Jay Bilas could be involved on a limited basis? Raftery works for two networks. Why not Bilas? Probably unrealistic, but I can dream... Bob Wenzel is an atrocity. Hopefully he stays with the new Conference USA. Sead raises an interesting point about Cohen. He's really good for the Mets and I had no idea he does radio for Seton Hall (who the hell is listening to them on the radio?) Given his familiarity with the BE already, I think it's an interesting option. Could we pluck Laphonso Ellis somehow? He's growing on me. I kind of like him. I don't like that Dooky Bilas. He never has an opinion of his own. He just kind of looks around and sees what everyone else is saying and then parrots what the crowd is saying. Like his garbage on how VCU absolutely did not belong in the tournament and that it was an abomination.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:12:15 GMT -5
This whole experiment was Fox's idea, not Gus Johnson's. They needed to find something for him to do--sixth-tier NFL games and Iowa-Northwestern games on BTN weren't really helping them get their money's worth. There's no reason to attack him for attempting to take on an enormous task for which he will be ridiculed for some time (and in some corners forever) for doing what his bosses asked him to do. The initial reviews of his debut put him in the B-/C+ range, which I think is pretty good given that he knew nothing about soccer 3 months ago. Given that Fox's World Cup isn't for five more years, he'll have lots of time to improve, and won't be so insecure about showing that he'd prepared hard for the gig. Now maybe from here the feedback will be so negative that they'll switch gears and bring him back to do their new signature hoops league, or maybe after this initial soccer run they can adjust his soccer schedule enough to allow him to do hoops next fall. But right now, Fox is devoted to going all in with him on soccer (and he was good enough the other day to justify continuing the experiment) so I think we're looking at other options. I just don't like it. It ruins the game for me to hear him speak. As a soccer fan you want the authentic thing. Not some guy who just picked up the game 2 years ago and knows less about the game than the viewer does. It would be like having a British guy who just started watching basketball a couple years ago announcing NBA or Hoyas games. It just wouldn't fly with the basketball fanbase. (In British accent) "That's a foul!" "Hoop and the Harm!" It would just be silly.
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Big Dog
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,912
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 1, 2013 14:14:19 GMT -5
This whole experiment was Fox's idea, not Gus Johnson's. They needed to find something for him to do--sixth-tier NFL games and Iowa-Northwestern games on BTN weren't really helping them get their money's worth. There's no reason to attack him for attempting to take on an enormous task for which he will be ridiculed for some time (and in some corners forever) for doing what his bosses asked him to do. The initial reviews of his debut put him in the B-/C+ range, which I think is pretty good given that he knew nothing about soccer 3 months ago. Given that Fox's World Cup isn't for five more years, he'll have lots of time to improve, and won't be so insecure about showing that he'd prepared hard for the gig. Now maybe from here the feedback will be so negative that they'll switch gears and bring him back to do their new signature hoops league, or maybe after this initial soccer run they can adjust his soccer schedule enough to allow him to do hoops next fall. But right now, Fox is devoted to going all in with him on soccer (and he was good enough the other day to justify continuing the experiment) so I think we're looking at other options. I just don't like it. It ruins the game for me to hear him speak. As a soccer fan you want the authentic thing. Not some guy who just picked up the game 2 years ago and knows less about the game than the viewer does. It would be like having a British guy who just started watching basketball a couple years ago announcing NBA or Hoyas games. It just wouldn't fly with the basketball fanbase. (In British accent) "That's a foul!" "Hoop and the Harm!" It would just be silly. Yes, but everybody, including Fox and Johnson, realize that. The plan is that by five years from now, you're no longer saying this. In the meantime, you're going to have to live with it.
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Madgesdiq
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,434
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Post by Madgesdiq on Mar 1, 2013 14:14:41 GMT -5
Is it completely absurd to wonder if somehow Jay Bilas could be involved on a limited basis? Raftery works for two networks. Why not Bilas? Probably unrealistic, but I can dream... Bob Wenzel is an atrocity. Hopefully he stays with the new Conference USA. Sead raises an interesting point about Cohen. He's really good for the Mets and I had no idea he does radio for Seton Hall (who the hell is listening to them on the radio?) Given his familiarity with the BE already, I think it's an interesting option. Could we pluck Laphonso Ellis somehow? He's growing on me. I kind of like him. I don't like that Dooky Bilas. He never has an opinion of his own. He just kind of looks around and sees what everyone else is saying and then parrots what the crowd is saying. Like his garbage on how VCU absolutely did not belong in the tournament and that it was an abomination. That is interesting. Bilas loves Georgetown, specifically JT3 and the way he runs the program. He is pretty clear about it on the air, and I have heard him talk about it off the air.
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rosslynhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,595
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Post by rosslynhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:15:00 GMT -5
Gus had been announcing San Jose games, apparently to much acclaim by their fanbase, before Fox offered him this gig. No, I don't think that's correct. I think he started experimenting with the San Jose games after Fox agreed a while back to make this happen. Okay, I guess I just bought the Fox (Soccer) spin without any suspicion.
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,783
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 1, 2013 14:17:43 GMT -5
Is it completely absurd to wonder if somehow Jay Bilas could be involved on a limited basis? Raftery works for two networks. Why not Bilas? Probably unrealistic, but I can dream... Bob Wenzel is an atrocity. Hopefully he stays with the new Conference USA. Sead raises an interesting point about Cohen. He's really good for the Mets and I had no idea he does radio for Seton Hall (who the hell is listening to them on the radio?) Given his familiarity with the BE already, I think it's an interesting option. Could we pluck Laphonso Ellis somehow? He's growing on me. I kind of like him. I don't like that Dooky Bilas. He never has an opinion of his own. He just kind of looks around and sees what everyone else is saying and then parrots what the crowd is saying. Like his garbage on how VCU absolutely did not belong in the tournament and that it was an abomination. Bilas is by far the best color analyst out there.
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boxout05
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 573
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Post by boxout05 on Mar 1, 2013 14:18:48 GMT -5
Really like Bilas. Think he's one of the best on ESPN.
As for people to call some Big East games, give John Minko some time. Already does play by play for SJU, some Nets game, is a Butler alum.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:19:07 GMT -5
I don't like that Dooky Bilas. He never has an opinion of his own. He just kind of looks around and sees what everyone else is saying and then parrots what the crowd is saying. Like his garbage on how VCU absolutely did not belong in the tournament and that it was an abomination. Bilas is by far the best color analyst out there. That's your opinion, not fact. I dislike him and alot of people also don't care for him.
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Big Dog
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,912
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 1, 2013 14:19:45 GMT -5
I don't like that Dooky Bilas. He never has an opinion of his own. He just kind of looks around and sees what everyone else is saying and then parrots what the crowd is saying. Like his garbage on how VCU absolutely did not belong in the tournament and that it was an abomination. Bilas is by far the best color analyst out there. He is the most independent voice out there. I have literally never heard him parrot conventional wisdom. Usually he is debunking it.
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Jack
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,411
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Post by Jack on Mar 1, 2013 14:22:51 GMT -5
I don't think soccer commentary should be dumbed down for American audiences, and I do think a strong knowledge of the players and the tactics are required, but I see no reason why the play by play announcer is required to have a certain accent.
This is getting way off course, and I have not actually caught any of his soccer work, but I did hear GJ talk about his philosophy with respect to calling soccer on the Men in Blazers podcast, and he seemed well aware of how foolish he would sound trying to use certain British-isms, he seemed prepared to study hard, and he was excited about the opportunity. He also said he is not planning on using any of his basketball catch phrases in his soccer work, so he definitely has some work to do in terms of developing his own style. He will undoubtedly be better than Dave O'Brien (who I wouldn't mind for the new Big East) or Jack Edwards (who should stick to hockey).
So to bring it back, let's get Bill Raftery - he only works one game a week for ESPN anyway. And let's rope in Ian Darke, too.
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MacHoya
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 149
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Post by MacHoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:29:12 GMT -5
Could we pluck Laphonso Ellis somehow? He's growing on me. I kind of like him. I try to keep my posts positive, but I can't resist here ... I thought Laphonso was absolutely horrible calling the UConn game. His insight was laughable and he clearly favored UConn to the point of being obnoxious. Sorry, but my two cents.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:30:28 GMT -5
I don't think soccer commentary should be dumbed down for American audiences, and I do think a strong knowledge of the players and the tactics are required, but I see no reason why the play by play announcer is required to have a certain accent. This is getting way off course, and I have not actually caught any of his soccer work, but I did hear GJ talk about his philosophy with respect to calling soccer on the Men in Blazers podcast, and he seemed well aware of how foolish he would sound trying to use certain British-isms, he seemed prepared to study hard, and he was excited about the opportunity. He also said he is not planning on using any of his basketball catch phrases in his soccer work, so he definitely has some work to do in terms of developing his own style. He will undoubtedly be better than Dave O'Brien (who I wouldn't mind for the new Big East) or Jack Edwards (who should stick to hockey). So to bring it back, let's get Bill Raftery - he only works one game a week for ESPN anyway. And let's rope in Ian Darke, too. I saw Gus try his hand at MMA and he was quite awful and out of place. He really didn't know what he was talking about although he tried hard to do his homework. He just needs to stick to the sports he's good at.
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MacHoya
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 149
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Post by MacHoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:30:45 GMT -5
Bilas is by far the best color analyst out there. That's your opinion, not fact. I dislike him and alot of people also don't care for him. Count me in the camp that holds the opinion that Bilas is one of the best!
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:31:50 GMT -5
Bilas is by far the best color analyst out there. He is the most independent voice out there. I have literally never heard him parrot conventional wisdom. Usually he is debunking it. I would disagree. His trashing of VCU before the tournament was awful and unprofessional.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:34:42 GMT -5
Jay Bilas:
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Big Dog
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,912
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 1, 2013 14:36:41 GMT -5
Everybody agreed VCU didn't deserve to be there.
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Post by professorhoya on Mar 1, 2013 14:49:11 GMT -5
Everybody agreed VCU didn't deserve to be there. Exactly. Bilas looks around, sees what everyone else is saying then takes a strong stance on what the sheep are saying. This is contrary to what you were saying about him going against the grain. And honestly he was wrong on this. The bigger problem though is how he went to absolutes and said there was no possible way that VCU deserved to be in the tournament. A good analyst can recognize on his own if something is wrong or right without relying on looking for what everybody else is saying.
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CTHoya08
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Bring back Izzo!
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Post by CTHoya08 on Mar 1, 2013 14:54:31 GMT -5
Maybe, just maybe, he independently reached the same conclusion as everybody else. Everybody makes mistakes. Bilas seems to make a lot fewer of them than the others in his profession.
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Jack
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,411
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Post by Jack on Mar 1, 2013 14:55:22 GMT -5
Bilas is bright, funny, analytical, and speaks truth to power. He makes great points about how games are called off the ball, he rails on the NCAA hierarchy for hypocrisy, he actually watches all kinds of games he is not broadcasting, so he is knowledgeable beyond his game notes. Just follow his twitter and tell me he is anyone's parrot (ignore the ridiculous hip-hop quotes every morning). He is the best analyst doing college basketball on any major network, and it is not even close. ESPN would be fools to let him go, although he does work for CBS during the tournament, so he does not appear to be bound to them.
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