jgalt
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,380
|
Post by jgalt on Dec 13, 2012 16:01:54 GMT -5
where the heck is Wichita State coming from? New Mexico? Really? Would be in favor of UNLV and SDSU but let's not get crazy here. Seriously keeping Temple and Memphis are big keys I think Adding Zags seem like a good move as well but we really shouldn't be pushing more than 14 teams in the league Yeah, I dont get how the dialogue went from "I dont want a conference with random teams!" to "Oh lets just throw all these random teams together for this great conference" Having west coast schools doesnt make sense and is stupid.
|
|
IDenj
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,528
|
Post by IDenj on Dec 13, 2012 16:03:36 GMT -5
Can the BE basketball schools vote to remove the football schools out of the conference??
|
|
nathanhm
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,041
|
Post by nathanhm on Dec 13, 2012 16:04:43 GMT -5
I always thought the conversation was we don't want to be with schools who care about football over basketball. If we expand some of these schools are going to be "random."
|
|
|
Post by westendhoya on Dec 13, 2012 16:07:55 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by fsohoya on Dec 13, 2012 16:14:01 GMT -5
How is Wichita State any different from adding Creighton? And if were talking UNLV and SDSU, why not New Mexico? All im saying is if were creating a national basketball conference league, why not reach out to any school that runs a top notch basketball program. Wichita because it has decent cache, isn't too far west, and doesn't have football. I wish it weren't the case, but I think it is going to be tough to keep schools with 1-A football teams attached to a conference that doesn't offer FBS football.
|
|
|
Post by fsohoya on Dec 13, 2012 16:17:06 GMT -5
I always thought the conversation was we don't want to be with schools who care about football over basketball. If we expand some of these schools are going to be "random." I think the Zags, because of their strong identity as a very good hoops-only school, is the only west coast member we should consider (and St. Mary's if they insist on being a pair). And that's only if they don't pressure to add other western programs that don't help.
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,607
|
Post by DanMcQ on Dec 13, 2012 16:31:21 GMT -5
"A Jersey Guy" (Mark Blaudschun) again...
|
|
|
Post by aleutianhoya on Dec 13, 2012 16:35:59 GMT -5
The bottom line is that including any FBS schools to the league is playing with fire. First, you just never know who is going to get good in football and therefore become attractive to another league. Second, even if you're right about, say, Temple and they never become all that good in football or are never a good fit for another league for any number of reasons -- there's still the chance that whatever league they park football into will at some point insist that they join for all sports. Or that the league they park into will itself collapse due to other teams leaving and they have to look to join another league.
I don't mind adding teams (like a UConn or a Cinci) for now, with the eyes wide open realization that they're looking to leave and probably will, so long as there's no compelling need to replace them once they do leave. You use their cache to get a bit more TV money and secure your ability to thrive, and hopefully when they leave, you have enough of your own cache built that you don't need to make a move to even replace them. I'm fine with that risk; it's not really a risk. The key is that you don't want to have any schools in your league that would think about leaving if UConn (or Cinci or whomever left).
That's the problem with adding west coast teams that play football. To the extent you've done it as a central part of your TV strategy (securing late time-zone games) or you've done it in order to secure Gonzaga or St. Mary's or whomever's involvement in the league, you've opened yourself up to more problems when they look to do something else.
I don't have any problem with a Gonzaga or any other basketball-only school anywhere in the country, so long as the travel doesn't outweigh the financial and competitive benefit (and it may well not make sense on that basis). And I don't mind a football school on the very limited basis that I described above.
The bottom line is that I want everyone on the same page. If everyone knows a school will leave for another conference -- and everyone is OK with that -- and it still makes sense, then so be it.
|
|
thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,848
|
Post by thebin on Dec 13, 2012 16:39:24 GMT -5
How is Wichita State any different from adding Creighton? And if were talking UNLV and SDSU, why not New Mexico? All im saying is if were creating a national basketball conference league, why not reach out to any school that runs a top notch basketball program. Absolutely no big football schools and no pacific or Mountain time zone. The only reason to be excited today is to never see the letters SDSU again.
|
|
thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,848
|
Post by thebin on Dec 13, 2012 16:40:36 GMT -5
where the heck is Wichita State coming from? New Mexico? Really? Would be in favor of UNLV and SDSU but let's not get crazy here. Seriously keeping Temple and Memphis are big keys I think Adding Zags seem like a good move as well but we really shouldn't be pushing more than 14 teams in the league Yeah, I dont get how the dialogue went from "I dont want a conference with random teams!" to "Oh lets just throw all these random teams together for this great conference" Having west coast schools doesnt make sense and is stupid. Totally agree. It is amazing that people have not learned any lessons from this disaster. I can't believe there are people talking about adding west coast football-first schools still. The only IA football school Id be open to keeping is Memphis...because it is essentially a IAA program and is known to be a basketball school and sits right in the heart of the geographic conference.
|
|
swhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,137
|
Post by swhoya on Dec 13, 2012 16:42:21 GMT -5
Yeah, I dont get how the dialogue went from "I dont want a conference with random teams!" to "Oh lets just throw all these random teams together for this great conference" Having west coast schools doesnt make sense and is stupid. Totally agree. It is amazing that people have not learned any lessons from this disaster. I can't believe there are people talking about adding west coast football-first schools still. Yeah, as much as I'd love to have the Hoyas come to me in Albuquerque...UNM makes zero sense. None whatsoever.
|
|
Cambridge
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Canes Pugnaces
Posts: 5,304
|
Post by Cambridge on Dec 13, 2012 16:45:18 GMT -5
Thought Rosslyn was mentioning Richmond on grounds it was public, like VCU. And, BTW, public does have something to do with it. Publics tend to be bigger and have more fans. And don't forget how Virginia politics got involved when the ACC first raided the Big East. Plus if we don't want the new league pigeonholed as religious or small-time, having a public school or two as members would help. I mentioned UofR because people keep tossing out the names of 10 schools they want invited and one of them is peculiarly a second-tier state school. UofR would be a substitute if people wanted a team in the Hampton Roads market without adding a public school to an otherwise all-private/mostly-Catholic league. (I didn't realize until looking it up just now that UofR has fewer than 3k undergrads). As a Richmonder, I can tell you that VCU carries that market. It is a monster that occupies nearly all of downtown. It is now one of the largest universities in the region with a very nice on-campus arena and pretty rabid local following. Richmond, by contrast, is an adorable also ran whose campus features boys and girls dorms separated by a lake.
|
|
|
Post by NoBoumtjeInTheYaYaRoom on Dec 13, 2012 16:47:36 GMT -5
I think many of you are missing the mark a bit. While Football schools are being discussed. It is only schools who have ZERO. I repeat ZERO chance of joining the future 4 conference, 16 team Super Conference allignment. These arent teams with potential of being poached in the distant future. At this point, to avoid becoming a media-hyped "slightly" better version of the Atlantic 10, the 7 realize that they have to consider making a splash. In the end, would a 12 team conference with Butler, Xavier, St Louis, VCU and Dayton be decent...sure. But there has to be thought of doing their own shake up to the conference realignment realm. Making a coast-to-coast basketball conference with 10-12 formidable programs with NCAA tourney aspirations on a year in year out basis gives them a new recruiting stronghold. Gives them a "we have something no one else does pitch to both media and recruits. Is there risk involved? Of Course. But to get the reward we all want so bad, Georgetown remaining more than relevant, but prominent, these are the kinds of moves we must consider.
|
|
thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,848
|
Post by thebin on Dec 13, 2012 16:47:58 GMT -5
I'm OK with Memphis and Temple but basically no other FBS schools. Those just really are not culturally speaking FBS schools and as stated have the same shot of going to the Big10 as we do. But I want no part of any other FBS schools that will always look after football first. SDSU might be better at hoops than football, but it is certainly a football school- as evidenced by the move of fb only to the Big East at the expense of every other sport there. I just don't think you can say the same about Memphis....and possibly Temple. Smack some golden handcuffs on them and don't add anymore FBS schools and I think that's a no brainer.
|
|
gunny
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 559
|
Post by gunny on Dec 13, 2012 16:50:24 GMT -5
I agree with bin. Temple and Memphis with huge "handcuffs." Add Xavier, Butler, and VCU and that is a nice 12 team conference with room to grow.
|
|
|
Post by daytonahoya31 on Dec 13, 2012 16:50:31 GMT -5
San Diego State is a basketball school first....They sell out ALL of their hoops games...They get about 8,000 in Qualcomm Stadium for their football games...Trust, they are a hoops school
|
|
DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,607
|
Post by DanMcQ on Dec 13, 2012 16:51:20 GMT -5
|
|