MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 10, 2014 21:20:36 GMT -5
"Bird in hand." This board loves to trot out that phrase in these situations.
Sure you take Crawford. But you take Dozier as well. III didn't make some trip down to South Carolina to have an in-home meeting with that kid just to give up on him if Crawford commits first. You think III doesn't realize the scenario in front of him? He realizes Dozier's visit won't happen until a month after Crawford trip this weekend. Thus he realizes Crawford's commitment (to Gtown or another school) may happen first too. I'm sure he's prepared for that possibility (if Crawford picks the Hoyas). Heck, he may have even discussed some of this with Dozier and his family tonight. He's probably counting on Dozier not being scared off. He's definitely aware that Dozier can play multiple positions. So if Crawford does pull the trigger for GU I expect the Hoyas to give Dozier the same sell regardless. If the Hoyas get both to go along with Tre then the Hoyas' point guard situation will be resolved for the next few seasons, even if Dozier is good enough to leave early for the pros.
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Post by hoyasaxa18 on Sept 10, 2014 21:30:21 GMT -5
"Bird in hand." This board loves to trot out that phrase in these situations. Sure you take Crawford. But you take Dozier as well. III didn't make some trip down to South Carolina to have an in-home meeting with that kid just to give up on him if Crawford commits first. You think III doesn't realize the scenario in front of him? He realizes Dozier's visit won't happen until a month after Crawford trip this weekend. Thus he realizes Crawford's commitment (to Gtown or another school) may happen first too. I'm sure he's prepared for that possibility (if Crawford picks the Hoyas). Heck, he may have even discussed some of this with Dozier and his family tonight. He's probably counting on Dozier not being scared off. He's definitely aware that Dozier can play multiple positions. So if Crawford does pull the trigger for GU I expect the Hoyas to give Dozier the same sell regardless. If the Hoyas get both to go along with Tre then the Hoyas' point guard situation will be resolved for the next few seasons, even if Dozier is good enough to leave early for the pros. I agree wholeheartedly with this. The point I was trying to make was just that if Crawford wants to commit, we should absolutely take him, instead of worrying about how his decision might affect Dozier's. Obviously getting both of them is the dream scenario.
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Post by cosmopolitanhoya on Sept 10, 2014 21:53:02 GMT -5
Lol @ tons of freshman starters Off the top of my head, Wallace, Green, Hibbert, Summers, Freeman, Monroe, Mescheriakov (as a RS freshman), Thompson (RS freshman), Lubick... I think Cameron and maybe Whittington started a few games due to injuries though weren't regular starters... Maybe not a ton, but certainly not an insignificant number. Highly doubt Wallace and Hibbert would start if they were freshmen this upcoming season. He had no choice back then - and they turned out to be good. Summers/Freeman/Monroe/Green are legit and they would have started on any of our teams that we have had. Include Porter there as well. But other guys that have started that you have mentioned simply started because he had no other options at that time and had to simply thrust someone in... I just don't see Crawford getting any significant playing time even if he comes here : and also the fact that Campbell and Crawford can only play the 1 position. Guys like DSR and Peak can definitely play both 1 and 2 positions - same thing with the players we were targetting on, such as Bacon/Mitchell, and add Dozier who should be our primary target. Adding depth is good as SF mentioned, but that depends on how you add them - adding players like Dozier who brings something that we don't have currently with the group is good. IMO though, Crawford does not bring much on the table besides a better athleticism on the 1 position and that has not even been that important for us in terms of success of this program (Wallace vs. Wright).
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Sept 10, 2014 22:45:04 GMT -5
Off the top of my head, Wallace, Green, Hibbert, Summers, Freeman, Monroe, Mescheriakov (as a RS freshman), Thompson (RS freshman), Lubick... I think Cameron and maybe Whittington started a few games due to injuries though weren't regular starters... Maybe not a ton, but certainly not an insignificant number. Highly doubt Wallace and Hibbert would start if they were freshmen this upcoming season. He had no choice back then - and they turned out to be good. Summers/Freeman/Monroe/Green are legit and they would have started on any of our teams that we have had. Include Porter there as well. But other guys that have started that you have mentioned simply started because he had no other options at that time and had to simply thrust someone in... I just don't see Crawford getting any significant playing time even if he comes here : and also the fact that Campbell and Crawford can only play the 1 position. Guys like DSR and Peak can definitely play both 1 and 2 positions - same thing with the players we were targetting on, such as Bacon/Mitchell, and add Dozier who should be our primary target. Adding depth is good as SF mentioned, but that depends on how you add them - adding players like Dozier who brings something that we don't have currently with the group is good. IMO though, Crawford does not bring much on the table besides a better athleticism on the 1 position and that has not even been that important for us in terms of success of this program (Wallace vs. Wright). What happens 2 seasons from now when DSR is gone Cosmo? I think you spend too much time worrying about how a kid will fit in his freshman year as opposed to looking at the larger picture of a 4 year career.. I'd be shocked if a kid like Crawford wasn't a net positive for G'town throughout his career.. As much as the staff has increased the talent level on the team, there's plenty of room for a consensus top 80 kid in the country.. A ranking btw that's very similar to Derrickson's and also very similar to Markel Starks coming out of HS.. G'town was never a favorite to land Mitchell or Bacon so there's really no point bringing them up anymore..
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 10, 2014 22:48:27 GMT -5
Campbell and Crawford can both play the one and two if III decides to play small or if he wants two point guards on the court at the same time. This is college basketball. You can get away with playing two 6'1 to 6'2 guys in your backcourt at the same time. Villanova does it all the time. UConn just won a national championship playing guys who are collectively shorter than Campbell and Crawford. III's dad had very successful teams which started guards roughly the size of Campbell and Crawford. I don't see an issue.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Sept 10, 2014 23:06:57 GMT -5
"Bird in hand." This board loves to trot out that phrase in these situations. Sure you take Crawford. But you take Dozier as well. III didn't make some trip down to South Carolina to have an in-home meeting with that kid just to give up on him if Crawford commits first. You think III doesn't realize the scenario in front of him? He realizes Dozier's visit won't happen until a month after Crawford trip this weekend. Thus he realizes Crawford's commitment (to Gtown or another school) may happen first too. I'm sure he's prepared for that possibility (if Crawford picks the Hoyas). Heck, he may have even discussed some of this with Dozier and his family tonight. He's probably counting on Dozier not being scared off. He's definitely aware that Dozier can play multiple positions. So if Crawford does pull the trigger for GU I expect the Hoyas to give Dozier the same sell regardless. If the Hoyas get both to go along with Tre then the Hoyas' point guard situation will be resolved for the next few seasons, even if Dozier is good enough to leave early for the pros. I agree wholeheartedly with this. The point I was trying to make was just that if Crawford wants to commit, we should absolutely take him, instead of worrying about how his decision might affect Dozier's. Obviously getting both of them is the dream scenario. Dreams CAN come true, if you believe hard enough.
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Post by cosmopolitanhoya on Sept 11, 2014 0:22:26 GMT -5
Highly doubt Wallace and Hibbert would start if they were freshmen this upcoming season. He had no choice back then - and they turned out to be good. Summers/Freeman/Monroe/Green are legit and they would have started on any of our teams that we have had. Include Porter there as well. But other guys that have started that you have mentioned simply started because he had no other options at that time and had to simply thrust someone in... I just don't see Crawford getting any significant playing time even if he comes here : and also the fact that Campbell and Crawford can only play the 1 position. Guys like DSR and Peak can definitely play both 1 and 2 positions - same thing with the players we were targetting on, such as Bacon/Mitchell, and add Dozier who should be our primary target. Adding depth is good as SF mentioned, but that depends on how you add them - adding players like Dozier who brings something that we don't have currently with the group is good. IMO though, Crawford does not bring much on the table besides a better athleticism on the 1 position and that has not even been that important for us in terms of success of this program (Wallace vs. Wright). What happens 2 seasons from now when DSR is gone Cosmo? I think you spend too much time worrying about how a kid will fit in his freshman year as opposed to looking at the larger picture of a 4 year career.. I'd be shocked if a kid like Crawford wasn't a net positive for G'town throughout his career.. As much as the staff has increased the talent level on the team, there's plenty of room for a consensus top 80 kid in the country.. A ranking btw that's very similar to Derrickson's and also very similar to Markel Starks coming out of HS.. G'town was never a favorite to land Mitchell or Bacon so there's really no point bringing them up anymore.. And we are not recruiting any PGs in class of '16 and '17? Recruiting over Campbell immediately from next class is fine if it's actually going to be recruiting over him. Recruiting a similar talented kid who has similarly regressed in the higher level of competition and lacks of versatility and size right next class just does not make sense to me. What I am saying is we don't have to necessarily go all out and bank on crawford. Shoot for stars that would actually upgrade the roster and bring something we don't have in the current roster. Class of '16 PG talents like Dennis Smith, Derryk Thornton, Kobi Simmons - if you going to recruit backcourt addition to what we have, recruit those that will upgrade the backcourt. Freshman Crawford will not necessarily be an upgrade over Sophomore Campbell. In terms of adding depth? you add depth by adding players that can compete with the players for playing time that are already in the system. Crawford isn't..
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on Sept 11, 2014 2:28:51 GMT -5
What happens 2 seasons from now when DSR is gone Cosmo? I think you spend too much time worrying about how a kid will fit in his freshman year as opposed to looking at the larger picture of a 4 year career.. I'd be shocked if a kid like Crawford wasn't a net positive for G'town throughout his career.. As much as the staff has increased the talent level on the team, there's plenty of room for a consensus top 80 kid in the country.. A ranking btw that's very similar to Derrickson's and also very similar to Markel Starks coming out of HS.. G'town was never a favorite to land Mitchell or Bacon so there's really no point bringing them up anymore.. And we are not recruiting any PGs in class of '16 and '17? Recruiting over Campbell immediately from next class is fine if it's actually going to be recruiting over him. Recruiting a similar talented kid who has similarly regressed in the higher level of competition and lacks of versatility and size right next class just does not make sense to me. What I am saying is we don't have to necessarily go all out and bank on crawford. Shoot for stars that would actually upgrade the roster and bring something we don't have in the current roster. Class of '16 PG talents like Dennis Smith, Derryk Thornton, Kobi Simmons - if you going to recruit backcourt addition to what we have, recruit those that will upgrade the backcourt. Freshman Crawford will not necessarily be an upgrade over Sophomore Campbell. In terms of adding depth? you add depth by adding players that can compete with the players for playing time that are already in the system. Crawford isn't.. You can't say for sure that Crawford can't compete with those guys. Recruiting isn't a perfect science anyway. The guys that the Hoyas missed on or the guys that you want the Hoyas to target in '16 may turn out to be "busts" themselves. Go look at any year of the RSCI rankings and you will see a bunch of names of those who turned out better than expected and those that never lived up to expectations. But besides all that the reality is that next season, despite the fact that Paul White looks to have a handle, Gtown will only have three guys that can be viewed as guards (DSR, Peak, Campbell). That's not enough. I have my issues with Crawford too. He comes across as one of those locals who thinks he can do better than Gtown but is only waiting for that special offer. From a cynical perspective with perhaps his dreams schools looking elsewhere and Indiana losing some luster, it just may turn out he needs Gtown about as much as Gtown may need him. Because the Hoyas do need depth at the guard spot. If Dozier was to commit first this ma be a moot point. But if Crawford takes the plunge first by choosing Georgetown, the Hoyas have to accept (and would be happy to do so in the process).
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2014 3:34:13 GMT -5
Idk the Takeover games I saw this Summer he was their best guard. 12.7 ppg 47%, 29 from 3, 4assts 3 Boards 2stls… Not bad
Would like to see us land him, and think no matter where he goes he gets there with a giant chip on his shoulder as well.
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Post by jld54 on Sept 11, 2014 4:01:12 GMT -5
You folks who suggest that GU consider passing on Crawford sound like the fan base at a Kentucky, UNC, or Kansas -- teams that pick from the cream of the crop one and done types. This is GU, a real, non-football school which deals with facilities and league visibility issues. Our post season record has also not been a draw.
We should be very happy to land a top 100 player, especially a guard. We have been more of a draw for forwards than guards under JT3 as the system does not let guards showcase for big stats but rather integrates them into an overall offense. A good guard will develop but not in the "drive and dish" mode which attracts one and done type guards.
College is a guard's game and depth is key. We should welcome a Crawford commitment and not give up on a Dozier but a class with Crawford, Govan and Derrickson compliments the 2014 class nicely.
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sleepy
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Post by sleepy on Sept 11, 2014 7:56:12 GMT -5
What happens 2 seasons from now when DSR is gone Cosmo? I think you spend too much time worrying about how a kid will fit in his freshman year as opposed to looking at the larger picture of a 4 year career.. I'd be shocked if a kid like Crawford wasn't a net positive for G'town throughout his career.. As much as the staff has increased the talent level on the team, there's plenty of room for a consensus top 80 kid in the country.. A ranking btw that's very similar to Derrickson's and also very similar to Markel Starks coming out of HS.. G'town was never a favorite to land Mitchell or Bacon so there's really no point bringing them up anymore.. And we are not recruiting any PGs in class of '16 and '17? Recruiting over Campbell immediately from next class is fine if it's actually going to be recruiting over him. Recruiting a similar talented kid who has similarly regressed in the higher level of competition and lacks of versatility and size right next class just does not make sense to me. What I am saying is we don't have to necessarily go all out and bank on crawford. Shoot for stars that would actually upgrade the roster and bring something we don't have in the current roster. Class of '16 PG talents like Dennis Smith, Derryk Thornton, Kobi Simmons - if you going to recruit backcourt addition to what we have, recruit those that will upgrade the backcourt. Freshman Crawford will not necessarily be an upgrade over Sophomore Campbell. In terms of adding depth? you add depth by adding players that can compete with the players for playing time that are already in the system. Crawford isn't.. Big assumptions that that DSR can play the 1 at a high level and Peak can play at the 1 or 2 at the college level. As of today our backcourt is weaker than it was a year ago. It's even weaker after Jabril leaves. At this point we are not really adding depth if we get Crawford to commit we a simply replacing what we will lose. So i guess your willing to wait until 16 and waste another year of what appears to be a talented front court and hope and pray we can find a relacement for DSR and add the high level talent you say will provide an upgrade. At this point the only upgrade would be the over the walkons that may have available next year.
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Post by ColumbiaHeightsHoya on Sept 11, 2014 8:03:37 GMT -5
jld54, I agree on most counts but last year and this year will be guards as the lead on our O. Markel & DSR led in scoring last year and DSR will likely lead this year. The system is flexible enough, it is just that our talent has typically been skewed to the frontcourt. We need both crawford and dozier in my opinion to add depth in the backcourt as there will be plenty of minutes to go around. Even if guys like White & Peak can play some guard, they have to be able to play D on guards and that could be the bigger issue with the roster constructed as it is.
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Sept 11, 2014 8:20:04 GMT -5
I respectfully disagree with you Cosmo. I remember when people had similar complaints when we got a commitment from DSR. People said that he was not good enough to compete at the highest levels and that we were settling. I personally think that crawford's ceiling is at least that of Markel's. What did markel do his freshman year? Not much. By his senior year, he was one of the top 10 point guards in the country.
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Post by daymondmyles on Sept 11, 2014 8:54:55 GMT -5
I'd pretty much ignore Cosmo on this. He's vastly underselling Crawford. The fact that he thinks Campbell's and his passing ability are even is laughable.
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Sept 11, 2014 10:08:31 GMT -5
I'd pretty much ignore Cosmo on this. He's vastly underselling Crawford. The fact that he thinks Campbell's and his passing ability are even is laughable. Right.
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Post by cosmopolitanhoya on Sept 11, 2014 11:26:59 GMT -5
I respectfully disagree with you Cosmo. I remember when people had similar complaints when we got a commitment from DSR. People said that he was not good enough to compete at the highest levels and that we were settling. I personally think that crawford's ceiling is at least that of Markel's. What did markel do his freshman year? Not much. By his senior year, he was one of the top 10 point guards in the country. no, think u should compare him to hopkins. coming out of same area, and struggling at high level of competition, deferring other people to step it up, while regressing when the time is up to step up. sure one is 6'9 and other is 6'1. but same thing written all over him. As RB mentioned earlier, our recent struggle has been due to the lack of talent in front court. well our front court is stacked now, and we are shooting for stars (rabb). no need to settle at this point for backcourt.
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Post by cosmopolitanhoya on Sept 11, 2014 11:28:00 GMT -5
I'd pretty much ignore Cosmo on this. He's vastly underselling Crawford. The fact that he thinks Campbell's and his passing ability are even is laughable. campbell actually has more assists and better shooting ability. think ur vastly overselling crawford like some of you guys on this board because you guys are pushing the panic button on guards. calm down.
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Post by Ranch Dressing on Sept 11, 2014 11:39:13 GMT -5
We have plenty of scholarships remaining, and could use a couple guards. You take Crawford if he wants us, and continue to go all out for Dozier.
Tack Govan Derrickson Dozier Crawford
That is a nice haul to balance Mourning, Copeland, White, Peak, and Campbell.
Sprinkle in a senior DSR to the mix and you've got yourself a very nice team in 2015-16. Can't see that being less than Top 15-20 squad with Sweet 16 expectations.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2014 12:30:10 GMT -5
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blueandgray
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Post by blueandgray on Sept 11, 2014 14:21:48 GMT -5
Red square tmrw ...gotta love the students!
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