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Post by hobokenhoya on Mar 6, 2010 18:08:59 GMT -5
I'm sorry but ND has a horseshoe up their asses. They don't beat us with a healthy Free, I give them credit for their home blowout of Pitt, but they weren't overly impressive i their win vs. a UCONN team that is even more of a mystery than we are, and today, they catch MU on the one day where they can't shoot the 3. They obviously deserve to be in the tourney and this 4 game run they've been on is extremely impressive, but they've had a lot of breaks in the process, the first being their black hole getting injured.
I just hate the way they play. Its maddening.
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superan
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Post by superan on Mar 6, 2010 18:28:14 GMT -5
Was Harangody back for this game?
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Post by hobokenhoya on Mar 6, 2010 18:46:34 GMT -5
He didn't start but did play sparingly. I think he had like 5 points. He didn't play any of crunch time at end of regulation or OT.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Mar 6, 2010 18:49:02 GMT -5
Yeah i really don't like playing USF especially with gilchrist back. You folks don't like the prospect of playing any of the BE teams based upon coments all season long. Then again the way the Hoyas have played as of late.... I don't think that's fair seeing as i'm one of the most optimistic people on these boards. I think we'll crush any team we play in the first round and I think we have a legitimate shot to knock of cuse in the second round( it's very hard to beat a team 3 times in one season). The team just never seems to get up for south florida( despite how bad they've been over the years we've never blown them out) and South Florida will be plenty motivated. I don't think we'll lose, but there are certainly teams i'd much rather face: Depaul, providence, rutgers, seton hall, cinci.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Mar 6, 2010 19:06:30 GMT -5
By the way, Freedom Hall is officially closed.
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Big Dog
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 6, 2010 19:08:45 GMT -5
Where does this "its very hard to beat a team 3 times in one season" myth actually come from? Do we have any empirical proof that this is the case? I recall seeing an NFL statistic prior to their playoffs basically disproving this claim, or at least making clear that more often than not, the winner in Round 3 is the team that won the first two games.
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Mar 6, 2010 19:37:52 GMT -5
I'm not sure but it's fairly common so it has to have some basis in past results. one incidence i can think off of the top of my head unfortunately is the 1985 championship quickly scrolled through but couldn't find any examples where we've played a team 3 times recently. But it makes some sense having seen a team multiple times it's easier to dissect the team that's swept you weaknesses while they're over confident having beaten you twice already.
I think it only works if you were close in at least one of the first 2 games, which we were in the second cuse game. We have a great shot at beating Cuse. We figured out a way to beat them in the last game. This time we pull it off.
* ah did find one in recent history lost 3 times to cuse in '03 in 81 beat seton hall 3 times in 82 went 2-1 against providence that year,beat st. johns and nova 3 time in 83 won first two meetings agaisnt cuse but lost int he BET in 84 won 3 times against providence, went 2-1 against st. johns, and went 3-0 agianst cuse in 85 went 3-1 against st. johns, 2-1 agianst nova, 2-1 against cuse, 3-0 agianst uconn in 86 went 2-1 against pitt, 1-2 against cuse in 87 went 2-2 against providence, 3-0 agianst cuse, and BC in 88 went 2-1 against seton hall, in 89went 2-1 against cuse and pitt and 3-0 against BC in 90 went 1-2 against uconn and 2-1 against providence
not all of these are the one team wins the first two and loses the 3rd, but still.
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Buckets
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Post by Buckets on Mar 6, 2010 21:51:04 GMT -5
Where does this "its very hard to beat a team 3 times in one season" myth actually come from? Do we have any empirical proof that this is the case? I recall seeing an NFL statistic prior to their playoffs basically disproving this claim, or at least making clear that more often than not, the winner in Round 3 is the team that won the first two games. This is one of those things that announcers and coaches love to repeat because it sounds nice. I went all the way back to the beginning of the Big East tournament, and here's what Georgetown has done when one team had won two meetings in a row and they met again that season: 04-05: Lost to UConn three times 02-03: Lost to Syracuse three times 00-01: Beat Seton Hall twice, lost in BET 98-99: Lost to Miami three times 96-97: Lost to Miami twice, won in BET 94-95: Lost to UConn three times 93-94: Beat Seton Hall three times 91-92: Beat Miami three times 88-89: Beat Boston College three times 87-88: Beat Seton Hall twice, lost in BET 86-87: Beat Boston College three times 86-87: Beat Syracuse three times 84-85: Beat UConn three times 84-85: Lost to St. John's first meeting, won next three 84-85: Beat Villanova twice, lost in NCAA 83-84: Beat Providence three times 83-84: Beat Syracuse three times 82-83: Beat Syracuse twice, lost in BET So, when one team had a two-game in-season win streak against the opponent, they're 13-5 in the next game. Astonishingly, when one team wins at home and then wins on the road, they're probably going to win the third game.
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Post by HometownHoya on Mar 6, 2010 21:55:24 GMT -5
Well Duke is destroying UNC in the "nations best rivalry" 53-26 at half
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richfame
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Post by richfame on Mar 7, 2010 9:04:31 GMT -5
I hope the committee does NOT put UCONN in the ncaa tournament. There are so many more deserving teams that should go. Losing there last game of the season when it was a must win is beyond atrociuos. I hope there a quick out in the BET and thats THAT!
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Post by pfhoya86 on Mar 7, 2010 9:21:41 GMT -5
Losers of 3 straight and 7-11 in the BE, there's no way UCONN makes tournament unless it makes the finals of the BET. Nothing would make me happier than seeing UCONN left off the board next Sunday during the selection show. Plus an earlier exit from BET will make getting tickets much easier.
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vcjack
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Post by vcjack on Mar 7, 2010 9:34:07 GMT -5
Losers of 3 straight and 7-11 in the BE, there's no way UCONN makes tournament unless it makes the finals of the BET. Nothing would make me happier than seeing UCONN left off the board next Sunday during the selection show. Plus an earlier exit from BET will make getting tickets much easier. They do have a remarkably similar resume to the 08-09 Hoyas at the same point in the season, right down to having to play St. John's in the 12-13 game on Tuesday afternoon
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GUJook97
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Post by GUJook97 on Mar 7, 2010 13:20:25 GMT -5
I dont know, I think UConn is right there. Bilas has made this point a lot, but the bubble is so weak this year, it's crazy. I dont think UConn gets in because I honestly think they will lose to Saint Johns, but if they win 2 games, it would be interesting to see how the committee looks at them with 8 BE locks already.
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GIGAFAN99
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Post by GIGAFAN99 on Mar 7, 2010 13:38:31 GMT -5
Losers of 3 straight and 7-11 in the BE, there's no way UCONN makes tournament unless it makes the finals of the BET. Nothing would make me happier than seeing UCONN left off the board next Sunday during the selection show. Plus an earlier exit from BET will make getting tickets much easier. The teams that should be ticked off are USF and Seton Hall. Unbalanced schedule, sure, but these teams have big wins and should both be in a better spot than UConn. I agree they need the finals.
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KHoyaNYC
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Mar 7, 2010 14:11:59 GMT -5
Losers of 3 straight and 7-11 in the BE, there's no way UCONN makes tournament unless it makes the finals of the BET. Nothing would make me happier than seeing UCONN left off the board next Sunday during the selection show. Plus an earlier exit from BET will make getting tickets much easier. The teams that should be ticked off are USF and Seton Hall. Unbalanced schedule, sure, but these teams have big wins and should both be in a better spot than UConn. I agree they need the finals. Out of those 3 teams, UCONN has the edge because of the SOS and best quality wins. All 3 have sub .500 records against the RPI Top 50. USF's RPI is 65 and SOS is 54 which is not going to cut it, even with 9-9 in conference. Right now, none of them get in and it would take probably 3 wins to get on the right side of the bubble.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Mar 7, 2010 14:20:54 GMT -5
I guess the conundrum is that, if you look at the RPI's of ND and MU, then how can you bash SHU and USF? The only thing saving ND and MU is the unbalanced league schedule.
ND home and homes are USF, UCONN, and Cincy. They went 4-2 there. MU home and homes are VU, DePaul, and Providence. They went 3-3, which is not exactly great IMO. They didn't get RU, Pitt, ND, or Louisville on the road. That seems like room service compared to our schedule.
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KHoyaNYC
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Post by KHoyaNYC on Mar 7, 2010 14:38:40 GMT -5
I guess the conundrum is that, if you look at the RPI's of ND and MU, then how can you bash SHU and USF? The only thing saving ND and MU is the unbalanced league schedule. ND home and homes are USF, UCONN, and Cincy. They went 4-2 there. MU home and homes are VU, DePaul, and Providence. They went 3-3, which is not exactly great IMO. They didn't get RU, Pitt, ND, or Louisville on the road. That seems like room service compared to our schedule. I'm with you. ND will get some benefit from its late season run sans-Harangody but at best I think they are one of the final four in. MU is probably a 10 seed right now, so it's not like they are that far from SHU, USF, etc. From a pure numbers perspective, MU probably should be closer to the bubble than they are but they get a pass because they have had so many close losses against quality opponents on the road. Sounds weird right? But take a look: FSU - lost by 1 neutral @ Wisc - lost by 9 @ WVU - lost by 1 @ Nova - lost by 2 @ Syracuse - lost by 5 They also lost by home by 2 to Nova. Tack on a nice late season run (9-2), and they get in --- but not by much.
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Big Dog
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Post by Big Dog on Mar 7, 2010 15:03:05 GMT -5
Where does this "its very hard to beat a team 3 times in one season" myth actually come from? Do we have any empirical proof that this is the case? I recall seeing an NFL statistic prior to their playoffs basically disproving this claim, or at least making clear that more often than not, the winner in Round 3 is the team that won the first two games. This is one of those things that announcers and coaches love to repeat because it sounds nice. I went all the way back to the beginning of the Big East tournament, and here's what Georgetown has done when one team had won two meetings in a row and they met again that season: 04-05: Lost to UConn three times 02-03: Lost to Syracuse three times 00-01: Beat Seton Hall twice, lost in BET 98-99: Lost to Miami three times 96-97: Lost to Miami twice, won in BET 94-95: Lost to UConn three times 93-94: Beat Seton Hall three times 91-92: Beat Miami three times 88-89: Beat Boston College three times 87-88: Beat Seton Hall twice, lost in BET 86-87: Beat Boston College three times 86-87: Beat Syracuse three times 84-85: Beat UConn three times 84-85: Lost to St. John's first meeting, won next three 84-85: Beat Villanova twice, lost in NCAA 83-84: Beat Providence three times 83-84: Beat Syracuse three times 82-83: Beat Syracuse twice, lost in BET So, when one team had a two-game in-season win streak against the opponent, they're 13-5 in the next game. Astonishingly, when one team wins at home and then wins on the road, they're probably going to win the third game. So let's put that one to bed. Can we keep this post handy for use whenever somebody spouts the "its tough to beat a team 3 times" line?
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Mar 7, 2010 15:09:46 GMT -5
I guess the conundrum is that, if you look at the RPI's of ND and MU, then how can you bash SHU and USF? The only thing saving ND and MU is the unbalanced league schedule. ND home and homes are USF, UCONN, and Cincy. They went 4-2 there. MU home and homes are VU, DePaul, and Providence. They went 3-3, which is not exactly great IMO. They didn't get RU, Pitt, ND, or Louisville on the road. That seems like room service compared to our schedule. I'm with you. ND will get some benefit from its late season run sans-Harangody but at best I think they are one of the final four in. MU is probably a 10 seed right now, so it's not like they are that far from SHU, USF, etc. From a pure numbers perspective, MU probably should be closer to the bubble than they are but they get a pass because they have had so many close losses against quality opponents on the road. Sounds weird right? But take a look: FSU - lost by 1 neutral @ Wisc - lost by 9 @ WVU - lost by 1 @ Nova - lost by 2 @ Syracuse - lost by 5 They also lost by home by 2 to Nova. Tack on a nice late season run (9-2), and they get in --- but not by much. Exactly - I think some of those second round games will be loser goes to the NIT, even for the ND's of the world. (Or, they have no better than a 50-50 shot headed through the rest of the conference tourneys.) Look at the MVC today - a Shocker win would bump a bubble team off the bubble. That could be a ND or a MU if one of them loses its first game next week.
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kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Mar 7, 2010 15:23:39 GMT -5
It's nice to have the luxury to root for as many upsets as possible in these smaller conference tournaments.
It's awful to have to employ the opposite strategy.
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