hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Nov 8, 2009 21:42:40 GMT -5
And in other news, the sun rose in the East today.
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RusskyHoya
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Post by RusskyHoya on Nov 15, 2009 12:51:57 GMT -5
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PhillyHoya
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Post by PhillyHoya on Nov 15, 2009 23:46:37 GMT -5
It's still easier to stop Peyton from 70 yards out than 30.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Nov 16, 2009 0:01:45 GMT -5
It will certainly be interesting to hear Belichick's explanation of his shockingly bad end game decision.
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RusskyHoya
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Post by RusskyHoya on Nov 16, 2009 0:36:20 GMT -5
ADHASDKJH#(@*90*HAKHDkjHADKJhaDKJHK COLTS!!!!!!!1!!!1!!!! EOASDIOJAOI#)*@#()&$@()@*&$@(*@&$
Ahem...sorry for that lic moment...that was definitely the regular season game of the decade. Brady and Manning are the football equivalents of Larry Bird and Magic Johnson, as several sports writers have suggested. Belichick is Pat Riley, only with more cheating. Roger Goodell just fell to the ground in ecstacy.
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Post by bosoxfan3 on Nov 16, 2009 3:39:36 GMT -5
It will certainly be interesting to hear Belichick's explanation of his shockingly bad end game decision. Something along the lines of "Kevin Faulk caught the ball past the first down marker" should suffice.
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HoyaFanNY
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Post by HoyaFanNY on Nov 16, 2009 6:43:56 GMT -5
It will certainly be interesting to hear Belichick's explanation of his shockingly bad end game decision. Something along the lines of "Kevin Faulk caught the ball past the first down marker" should suffice. hate the colts, hate nbc with that fraud dungy, don't agree with the decision, even though i thought he had the first down.
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on Nov 16, 2009 7:13:06 GMT -5
Redskins have a one game winning streak.
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kghoya
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Post by kghoya on Nov 16, 2009 8:55:35 GMT -5
It will certainly be interesting to hear Belichick's explanation of his shockingly bad end game decision. Something along the lines of "Kevin Faulk caught the ball past the first down marker" should suffice. he made first contact with the ball before the first down marker...he just hadnt caught it yet...that was the problem
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thebin
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Post by thebin on Nov 16, 2009 9:01:19 GMT -5
I think 9 times out of 10 in the NFL Faulk is spotted the first down there.
I've gone back and forth on the decision all morning. The decision to go for it wasn't nearly as indefnsible as everyone is saying in retrospect. BB knew, and he was proven correct, that his defense was exausted and playing on rollerskates. He gambled that the chances of the Pats O (which had been having it's way with Indy most of the game) had a better chance of picking up two yards than the D had of stopping Peyton Manning.
I'm not sure it was the right call to make, I don't think I would have made it. But it wasn't indefensible. It was just very risky. That's BB's style. You win some you lose some.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Nov 16, 2009 9:22:54 GMT -5
I think 9 times out of 10 in the NFL Faulk is spotted the first down there. I think you're right, but they did make the correct call. He did not catch the ball past the first down marker. He made contact with that ball past the first down marker. You can say the refs don't make the correct call consistently, and I would agree with that. They don't, and far too much "forward progress" is always given to offensive players. If the argument is that the refs need to be consistent, then you give him the first down. If the argument is the refs need to be correct, then you don't. I think the Patriots get away with that against almost any other team. Much like against the Yankees, many teams have a tendency to wet their pants against the Patriots in crunch time (don't they, Mark Clayton?). But the Colts just have their number right now. Even when they were up by a lot, I think everyone knew that it was not enough points against Peyton Manning. As for the "game of the decade," well I think that's a bit much.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Nov 16, 2009 9:49:48 GMT -5
The problem was that the wrong official made the call. The sideline official (don't know the official name) immediately came in making the juggling motion. However, he was blocked from seeing when Faulk actually caught the ball because Faulk was between the ball and the official. On replay, it actually looks like he gained control right on the 30. I don't know if it would've been a first down, but it should have been closer than it was based on the spot.
Of course, if Belichick had a timeout left, he could've challenged that.
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SirSaxa
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Post by SirSaxa on Nov 16, 2009 9:50:21 GMT -5
1. Faulk juggled the ball when he was beyond the line, and did not "control it" until he was behind the line. Right call by the Refs.
2. Belichick's call to go for it on 4th and 2 from his own 28? Stupid. Highly risky. Colts needed a TD, not a FG.
3. Expecting to get an actual response from Belichick re: his call?? Don't hold your breath. More likely to be a non-response like a mumbled: "We didn't make the first down so we lost the game".
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Nov 16, 2009 10:18:37 GMT -5
Actually the first down/no first down play was not the key play: Moroney fumbling a sure TD at the goal line was.
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thebin
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Post by thebin on Nov 16, 2009 10:26:54 GMT -5
The Pats' defense was tired and Manning and the Colt's offense had all of the momentum in the world at that point. What are the chances the Pats pick up 2 yards there? Well, we know the patriots earned 7 yards per play in that game. So what odds would you take on making that first down if you had to bet against it? Almost 70% according to the stats on the Pats going for it on 4th and 2 in the Brady era. What are the odds if you punt on Manning scoring from 70 yards? Are they more than 30%? It sure as hell felt to me like the odds would have been well more than 30% of the Colts scoring a TD there...and the Pats defense pretty much proved as much when they rolled over for Manning on the short field.
A lot of people just flat dislike BB and this is coloring the perception of this call big time. I don't care about any of that stuff. It was a risky play. It didn't pan out this time, but the Pats have won many games because BB doesn't revert to the standard textbook.
Let me ask you this...you are a Colts fan. What do you want the Pats to do there? Go for it with a better than 50/50 shot of winning the game, or punt and give Manning a couple of minutes and the 2 minute warning to win it? BB chose to leave the game in the hands of his best unit that day and not hand the ball back to one of the best qbs in NFL history. I can live with that.
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RusskyHoya
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Post by RusskyHoya on Nov 16, 2009 11:15:50 GMT -5
Actually the first down/no first down play was not the key play: Moroney fumbling a sure TD at the goal line was. *shrug* The Colts couldn't do anything with the ball, punted, Welker took it back to the 7, and the Pats scored their only TD of the second half anyway, so in some ways it wasn't as critical. Can't really know what would've happened if the Pats had scored the first time and then kicked off to the Colts. And thebin is totally right. As a Colts fan, I want NE punting the ball back to Manning, not having a pretty good chance to ice the game right there. The pretty knowledgeable Colts fans at 18to88 agree, and they have the stats to prove it: www.18to88.com/2009-archives/november/bb-made-the-right-call.htmlwww.18to88.com/2009-archives/november/i-cant-believe-im-defending-bill-belichick.htmlThey're also right that his mistake wasn't going for it, it was not power running the ball twice.
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Nov 16, 2009 12:29:55 GMT -5
I pretty much agree with what you have said. I don't think the call was as bad as some make it. I also think that most of the time, the refs spot that ball beyond the 30. I also can't say for sure whether he fully controlled the ball beyond the 30 or not, but it was definitely closer than where they spotted it. Lastly, I had zero doubt that the Colts were going to score whenever and wherever they got the ball, if they got it. So I'm not criticizing the call to go for it. I think that maybe play calling could have been a bit better. Also, I think they could have milked a little more time earlier, resulting in one less play before the 2 minute warning, in which case maybe the point would be moot, because of booth review. But there's no way of knowing for sure. Lastly, I hate the Colts so even though the game was exciting, it still but a damper on an otherwise enjoyable weekend.
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Buckets
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Post by Buckets on Nov 16, 2009 12:32:55 GMT -5
Yeah, definitely not a first down. img402.imageshack.us/img402/6053/firstdown.jpgRiiight. He knocks the ball down into his own hands almost instantly. The juggle only looks like it may significantly affect the spot from the view of the out-of-position official (which also happened to be where the main TV camera is). It was the wrong call. I disagreed with the call only because of how much trouble the Patriots had on the three plays before. A timeout trying to get the offense on the field on first down, then you need to call a timeout to make a decision on fourth? When you're calling a third down pass play, you HAVE to know what your plan is for fourth down in the event of an incompletion. That being said, as a coach, your job is to put your players in a position to win, which Belichick did.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Nov 16, 2009 12:35:46 GMT -5
Yeah, definitely not a first down. img402.imageshack.us/img402/6053/firstdown.jpgRiiight. He knocks the ball down into his own hands almost instantly. The juggle only looks like it may significantly affect the spot from the view of the out-of-position official (which also happened to be where the main TV camera is). It was the wrong call. I disagreed with the call only because of how much trouble the Patriots had on the three plays before. A timeout trying to get the offense on the field on first down, then you need to call a timeout to make a decision on fourth? When you're calling a third down pass play, you HAVE to know what your plan is for fourth down in the event of an incompletion. That being said, as a coach, your job is to put your players in a position to win, which Belichick did. I think it might have been a first down, but those photos don't prove a thing.
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Boz
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Post by Boz on Nov 16, 2009 13:19:06 GMT -5
Yeah, definitely not a first down. img402.imageshack.us/img402/6053/firstdown.jpgRiiight. He knocks the ball down into his own hands almost instantly. The juggle only looks like it may significantly affect the spot from the view of the out-of-position official (which also happened to be where the main TV camera is). It was the wrong call. I disagreed with the call only because of how much trouble the Patriots had on the three plays before. A timeout trying to get the offense on the field on first down, then you need to call a timeout to make a decision on fourth? When you're calling a third down pass play, you HAVE to know what your plan is for fourth down in the event of an incompletion. That being said, as a coach, your job is to put your players in a position to win, which Belichick did. I think it might have been a first down, but those photos don't prove a thing. Did Greg Brady take those pictures?
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