MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 13:33:38 GMT -5
hoyas4life, you have a lot of faith in a guy like Lopez who shoots a lousy 45% despite not getting double-teamed.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 13:40:35 GMT -5
Am I missing something on Lopez? How can you take a 7'0 guy who can't shoot 50% over college kids not even close to his size AND playing with a literal twin tower? If he has upside doing that, what does Kevin Love or Roy have? I'll never understand the draft. He's a soph. Po-ten-tial. He scowls and shows emotion when he dunks. He's kinda athletic....which is good enough. He dominated Marquette in the NCAA tourney. Of course he took 30 shots. |
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DudeSlade
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Post by DudeSlade on May 21, 2008 13:53:23 GMT -5
Beasley, then Rose will be the obvious choices to start the draft. The Bulls will trade one of their gluttony of overrated, underproducing bigs and take Beasley because despite all the bigs they have, Beasley can be a dominant scorer and rebounder in the NBA, which is something they don't have. Rose is an upgrade over Hinrich, but he would not catapult them to the top of the East. Beasley would. Also, they can package Nocioni and Thomas and a draft pick and send them somewhere to get a PG.
The pairing of Rose with Wade and Marion is too good. They will not trade that pick to anyone unless an exceptional big man becomes available.
The Sonics will take Jerryd Bayless, I think, to put at PG with Durant, Jeff, Wilcox, and properly Wilkins, but they'll probably blow it and keep Durant at SG and run Johan Petro out there. They need to emulate Golden State or Denver and run with that team, especially if they add the ultra-athletic Bayless.
Roy will be great on a slower-paced squad. I believe he can play 40 mins and will be fine in the NBA conditioning-wise and athletically, but he will be maximized on a half-court team, not a Golden State, Denver, or Atlanta. The best teams for him now and in the long range, imo, are Utah, Houston (behind Yao during his rookie contract would let him develop big time!), Spurs (imagine the big man skill of Duncan & Roy!), and Detroit. The Mavs would have been with Avery Johnson at the helm, but I'm looking for them to pick up the pace now.
That said, I agree that Roy will make it into the top 20. I could even see him as high as the Kings at 12, which he was often predicted to last year (great long-term replacement for Brad Miller), but that's only if D'Andre Jordan is gone. Jordan is the one guy amongst all the ones mentioned that has so much "potential" I could see him taken over Roy. Ultimately, I think there's a good chance that a team takes him higher than Koufos, McGee, and Speights. They have no more potential than Roy and haven't performed against top competition like Roy has. Teams will look back at his performance against Oden and Gray last year and realize that he has what it takes at this level and just had a couple bad match-ups with real small teams late in the year that he probably wouldn't have in the NBA (at least no more than any other true centers).
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Post by HoyaOnBothSides on May 21, 2008 14:21:36 GMT -5
I've yet to see a mock draft that DOESN'T have Roy going to Utah.
I think it's crazy to pass on Beasley, and I don't think the Bulls will.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 14:30:13 GMT -5
Lopez is more athletic than Roy and much more athletic than Love, and thus more likely to translate his skills to the pros.
Now, personally, I think everyone sells Roy short on athleticism because he's a bit gawky, but he's quicker than people think. Lopez is going to be a pretty good player. He's not Dwight Howard or anything but he's not Jason Collins, either.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 14:36:46 GMT -5
If you believe Rose is a Chris Paul-level player -- and a lot of NBA scouts do -- there's no reason to believe he can't make the Bulls an instant Eastern Conference contender/favorite.
There's a lot more Chris Bosh in Beasley than Dwight Howard. Would any NBA GM, in the current state of the league, take Bosh over Paul? Over Deron Williams?
I'm not saying it is cut and dry, but there's more than enough wiggle room in evaluations to put Rose over Beasley, especially for Chicago, which can drop Gordon, move Hinrich to a much more manageable two guard, and run with Deng, Sefolosha, Thomas, Noah, etc., almost all of whom would improve in an open court game.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 15:13:31 GMT -5
Lopez is more athletic than Roy and much more athletic than Love, and thus more likely to translate his skills to the pros. . No question about the athleticism. But he shot 46% from the field against college players. I'm trying to recall one guy with his size and his pedigree who was considered to be such a high pick with a relative low fg% like that. |
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FormerHoya
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Post by FormerHoya on May 21, 2008 15:27:41 GMT -5
Isn't Beasley too small to play PF in the pros? Every time I watched him, I was impressed, but thought that he'd be a tweener in the NBA. Am I wrong on this? He can't be 6-9.
The Bulls oughtta take Rose.
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GIGAFAN99
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Post by GIGAFAN99 on May 21, 2008 15:29:57 GMT -5
Lopez is more athletic than Roy and much more athletic than Love, and thus more likely to translate his skills to the pros. . No question about the athleticism. But he shot 46% from the field against college players. I'm trying to recall one guy with his size and his pedigree who was considered to be such a high pick with a relative low fg% like that. Not relatively low, that's outright terrible. It's pretty much an inexcusable black mark on his resume. If he's shooting 46% at the center position in college, what skills are translating here? And this isn't a blip, he's been terrible two straight years. He has so much "potential" that a player 15 months older (Roy) who is bigger and has shown far greater skill and scoring ability and a younger kid (Love) who has shown to be a fantastic all-around basketball player who needs conditioning work should be picked lower? How athletic is this guy? Does he have X-ray vision? |
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moe09
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Post by moe09 on May 21, 2008 15:33:40 GMT -5
Alonzo Mourning, Sophomore Year, Georgetown University 16.5 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 52.5% fg%
Brook Lopez, Sophomore Year, Stanford University, 19 ppg, 8 rpg, 46.8 fg%
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GIGAFAN99
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Post by GIGAFAN99 on May 21, 2008 15:51:59 GMT -5
Alonzo Mourning, Sophomore Year, Georgetown University 16.5 ppg, 8.5 rpg, 52.5% fg% Brook Lopez, Sophomore Year, Stanford University, 19 ppg, 8 rpg, 46.8 fg% No offense, but that's not even close. Put it this way, 52.5% is a top 20 shooting percentage in the NBA. 46.8% isn't top 50. |
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moe09
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Post by moe09 on May 21, 2008 15:57:50 GMT -5
I'm not saying it is. I just went looking for the closest I could find. Wasn't saying it was close, you asked, I put it up.
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Post by lamontmorgan on May 21, 2008 16:46:36 GMT -5
Roy will be a lottery pick. He is automatic when he gets the ball deep and it will be much easier to get him the ball in the NBA vs Big East zones. He stays healthy, stays out of trouble, is a hoya big man, can catch, can pass, understands the game and will be in the league for 15 years. Some team in the lottery will understand how high his "floor" is and grab him.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 17:52:37 GMT -5
Also, Zo's numbers all around went down halfway during his soph year because Mutombo started clicking more and began to get the most minutes at the center position (rather than getting the early hook as he did during the first phase of that season). Zo had to play further away from the basket (which he wasn't really skilled enough to thrive out there) and as a result his points, rebounds, fg% and blocks per game all went south a bit.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 17:57:11 GMT -5
No question about the athleticism. But he shot 46% from the field against college players. I'm trying to recall one guy with his size and his pedigree who was considered to be such a high pick with a relative low fg% like that. And this isn't a blip, he's been terrible two straight years. He has so much "potential" that a player 15 months older (Roy) who is bigger and has shown far greater skill and scoring ability and a younger kid (Love) who has shown to be a fantastic all-around basketball player who needs conditioning work should be picked lower? How athletic is this guy? Does he have X-ray vision? The problem with Love is just wait until the NBA finds out for certainty that his 6'10 and 6'9 listings are a joke. This kid doesn't reach 6'8 without shoes. I love mostly everything about his game but he will fall a few spots because of his height IMO. He and his dad managed to avoid him getting measured for nearly every high school All-star game and bball camp. He can't avoid it anymore. And, yes, Beasley is shorter than his listing too and is a huge question mark when it comes to maturity issues. Its gonna be an interesting draft. |
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Post by AustinHoya03 on May 21, 2008 18:16:17 GMT -5
I hate to pile on Lopez further, because I think he's a good player, but from what I saw last season Roy is much more efficient in the paint. I've seen Lopez step and turn before deciding what to do with the basketball. I guess his "athleticism" allows him to get away with that. When Roy turns with the basketball, he's usually making a move that he has practiced thousands of times and is very efficient.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 18:25:48 GMT -5
Roy will be a lottery pick. He is automatic when he gets the ball deep and it will be much easier to get him the ball in the NBA vs Big East zones. He stays healthy, stays out of trouble, is a hoya big man, can catch, can pass, understands the game and will be in the league for 15 years. Some team in the lottery will understand how high his "floor" is and grab him. Don't see it happening. Roy can have great workouts but there is too much negativity in the minds of scouts, fans, Basketball "experts" in general for him to overcome his undeserved rep. I don't see anyone taking that "risk" when there's always a 6'2 shooting guard with a year of college expereince and a 7 foot jumping jack who could not get off the bench enough and got progressively worse as the season progressed out there to pick instead. Those guys scream "potential" because they only played one year and fans will give GMs a bit of a pass even if those players don't pan out. They will ask for the GMs' heads though if they pick Roy and he doesn't provide much. |
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The Stig
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Post by The Stig on May 21, 2008 19:36:29 GMT -5
If Roy does go late in the 1st round, he'll be a steal for whoever gets him. I think he'll surprise a lot of people in the NBA.
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thornski
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Post by thornski on May 21, 2008 20:57:56 GMT -5
I've yet to see a mock draft that DOESN'T have Roy going to Utah. I think it's crazy to pass on Beasley, and I don't think the Bulls will. Definitely vast majority of the mocks I see have Hibbert going to the Jazz... For what it's worth (which may be extremely little), nbadraft.net has him going to the Wizards and mynbadraft.com has him going to the Spurs. |
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on May 22, 2008 9:08:15 GMT -5
So, since this topic is kind of everywhere, if you're the T-Wolves, who do you take? Lopez, in an attempt to find a center and allow Al Jefferson to play his natural position of PF? OJ Mayo and hope his upside is as high as some think? Bayless? What about Roy (so I have a reason to buy a TWolves jersey again)?
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