SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 10:36:58 GMT -5
Why would Miami want Rose over Beasley? Marion is a free agent in a year, and much like Kobe or other dominant two guards, Wade controls the ball.
Beasley is a much better fit for Miami.
Chicago is kind of a toss up. They can let Gordon go and should -- he's Jimmy Jackson and JR Rider and everyone who only scores all in one without all that good of a shot. Hinrich is not a real point. While Beasley would obviously start for them they have Thomas, Noah, Sefolosha and Deng all as very young players at PF/SF. If you like Beasley better I can still see drafting him, but the bigger upgrade is at PG.
Plus, Rose is a Chicago boy.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 10:45:35 GMT -5
BTW, if Anthony Randolph drops past four, I think a lot of teams are going to be kicking themselves later.
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RDF
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Post by RDF on May 21, 2008 11:03:09 GMT -5
I'd take Rose--Kirk Hinrich is a marginal player--and it's a myth that he's a great defender-he's often in foul trouble, he throws up more bricks then a supposed "great shooter" should, and he is as good as he'll be. Rose instantly makes a team better--and the idea of a great guard is someone who can CREATE opportunities for players/make the game easier--which is exactly why you take him with Thomas, Noah, Deng, Gordon, etc.....he'd CREATE OFFENSE and let the Bulls get out and run. Rose is quick enough to stay with any guard--but bigger/stronger then the speedy guys--he's quicker then the bigger/stronger guys. He's a mismatch for opposing teams to have to deal with and he's one of the best players I've seen in last 5-10 years. Roy will be fine--and Utah would be a good fit--they are well coached and exploit mismatches--which the stupid teams who repeatedly are seen choosing in lottery do not. Roy will be a great fit wherever they understand what he does well--and not to expect a Zo/Mutombo type of defensive game changer. Ignore most of the "Gurus" write ups--I just saw one questioning whether Hibbert could play in NBA due to "bad hands and fact he struggles mightily against players near his size or taller"--Really--guess someone should tell Gray, Oden, and Thabeet that one.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 11:12:30 GMT -5
Agree on Rose and Chicago 100%, RDF.
As for Roy, I find it odd that he's dropping behind where a lot of players he's dominated went -- and behind guys like Javale McGee who have proven nothing. I'm not sure the mocks are going to get this one right.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 11:20:28 GMT -5
BTW, if Anthony Randolph drops past four, I think a lot of teams are going to be kicking themselves later. Wouldn't touch him with a ten foot pole if I had that high a draft pick. He reportedly has some attitude problems, has only played one year in college for a bad team in a bad conference (not much of an impact) and still doesn't have a true position. GMs blow it on these types of guys all the time.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 11:25:10 GMT -5
I don't know about the attitude problems, but in every game I saw he had a tremendous impact. He had a crap awful coach and no teammates. He shot well from the line and decently from the field. He is an excellent shot blocker and defender and has the athleticism to play in the NBA.
I suppose there are a few other players I would consider taking before him there, but some of the names listed before him...ugh. Dropping to 12-13 is a mistake.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 21, 2008 11:25:17 GMT -5
Agree on Rose and Chicago 100%, RDF. As for Roy, I find it odd that he's dropping behind where a lot of players he's dominated went -- and behind guys like Javale McGee who have proven nothing. I'm not sure the mocks are going to get this one right. I don't think it's odd at all - the draft is all about "potential." That's why DeAndre Jordan, Randolph, Greene, Speights, and JaVale McGee (!?!) get listed before Roy.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on May 21, 2008 11:32:58 GMT -5
They are just completely misreading Roy's potential. He hung with Greg Oden and dominated players like Aaron Gray (who have proven they can hang in the NBA). He's as younger or younger than half those guys you listed.
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Post by sleepyjackson21 on May 21, 2008 11:34:02 GMT -5
Never underestimate the Bulls when it comes to selling tickets. Heck, after they won the lottery they were already giving out the number for season tickets. Rose is the hometown hero and virtually everybody i've talked to wants Rose. Lots and lots of hometown support. Top notch points guards don't come around that often. Draft Rose and then trade either Hinrich or Gordon.
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Post by dajuan on May 21, 2008 11:58:34 GMT -5
Never underestimate the Bulls when it comes to selling tickets. Heck, after they won the lottery they were already giving out the number for season tickets. Rose is the hometown hero and virtually everybody i've talked to wants Rose. Lots and lots of hometown support. Top notch points guards don't come around that often. Draft Rose and then trade either Hinrich or Gordon. Everyone I talk to from Chicago wants Rose as well. One cannot discount the effect that a great point guard can have on an NBA team these days. It's amazing, really. I'm not convinced that Rose will automatically be a great NBA point guard, but I'm also not convinced that Beasely will be able to score at will in the pros.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 12:00:33 GMT -5
I don't know about the attitude problems, but in every game I saw he had a tremendous impact. He had a crap awful coach and no teammates. He shot well from the line and decently from the field. He is an excellent shot blocker and defender and has the athleticism to play in the NBA. I suppose there are a few other players I would consider taking before him there, but some of the names listed before him...ugh. Dropping to 12-13 is a mistake. I guess my problem is he doesn't have a position. And the athleticism thing is a tad overrated. So many guys have athleticism and can't do a bleeping thing when it counts in a halfcourt game. They may play some good d when inspired and use that wingspan to alter shots from time to time. But they are useless on offense unless they are finishing on a fastbreak. I am an NBA fan but the league is full of too many guys like this. Randolph is probably only slightly more skilled than T. Thomas of Chicago. I don't take him at 4. I could be wrong on this guy but that's my call. Still he's probably a better pick than these assorted combo guards who are all expected to go in the lottery.
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MCIGuy
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Post by MCIGuy on May 21, 2008 12:15:05 GMT -5
They are just completely misreading Roy's potential. He hung with Greg Oden and dominated players like Aaron Gray (who have proven they can hang in the NBA). He's as younger or younger than half those guys you listed. His going late, justified or not, will just be a warning to future players that unless you're Tim Duncan the pros will find a way to devalue you if you stick around for your senior season. I'm sure Shan Foster would be thought of more highly if he left as a junior. That guy seems like a player who could step in and help a roster immediately. But the scouts will be more interested in Bayless or Gordon who may have a more difficult adjustment because they only played one year in college and they don't have the desired height for a SG. But they must have more "potential" than Foster. As soon as you become a senior you no longer have potential anymore, you're now a finished product. What kid, realizing that, will want to stick around? As SF wrote, Roy is only 21. He's a year older than Mayo and Love. he's two more months older than Thabeet who, while not in the draft this year, gets all the hype in the world based on his "potential" despite still having hands of stone and still being light years away from having a go-to move. But if Thabeet, great athleticism or not, sticks around for his senior season he will be devalued by scouts unless he puts up David Robinson-like numbers. What wing player had a better season than Foster last season? I can't really think of anyone. If Foster had been as good as a soph or even a junior he'll be talked about as a consideration for the lottery even with his lack of great ball-handling skills. But he won't get a sniff because what? He's a four-year player? Its nuts.
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Post by sleepyjackson21 on May 21, 2008 12:20:15 GMT -5
I went out and got both Chicago papers. The Suntimes cover page has "Jackpot" with a picture of Rose. Page 1 has 3 articles headlined by 1) Bulls win draft lottery, earn right to select Chicagoan 2) Idea of playing for Bulls excites Rose and 3) A rose is a rose is a Bull. The Chicago Tribune's headline is Smellin' like a Rose with a full length picture of Rose. There is a small picture of Beasley which is about 1/6 the size of the Rose picture. The accompanying articles headline says "Only bloomin' idiot would pass on guard."
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HoyaFanNY
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Post by HoyaFanNY on May 21, 2008 12:35:08 GMT -5
the bulls should take rose. to me, it's a no brainer. i agree on foster. someone is going to steal him later in the draft.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 21, 2008 12:57:56 GMT -5
They are just completely misreading Roy's potential. He hung with Greg Oden and dominated players like Aaron Gray (who have proven they can hang in the NBA). He's as younger or younger than half those guys you listed. Sorry, "NBA potential" = crazy athleticism + little to no skills + no evidence from 1-2 years of college ball that the kid will improve in the League.
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moe09
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Post by moe09 on May 21, 2008 13:03:57 GMT -5
Here's the thing. If I'm the Bulls, hypothetically, I would take Rose. When you take into consideration the Bulls' overall situation, it just doesn't seem like it's going to work. The Hinrich contract and the fact that no one wants him 'cuz he's overpaid is killer. You can get rid of a Nocioni or Luol Deng...
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moe09
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Post by moe09 on May 21, 2008 13:07:40 GMT -5
Of course, the fact is, they should do it anyway. Will they? I don't know, they're an NBA Franchise. .. so it's tough to say.
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Post by hoyas4life on May 21, 2008 13:11:23 GMT -5
i like roy going to utah b/c i think it's one of the better fits for him to succeed. i'd like roy to go in the lottery to vindicate his decision and rep the program, but more than other players, he's a guy who needs to be in a place that emphasizes halfcourt offense so utah is great
the centers in this draft are: brook lopez
deandre jordan javale mcgee mareese speights roy koufos (prob a PF)
apart from brook lopez, who's a clear top 5, there's gonna be a lot of movement among the next 5 centers once workouts ramp up. decisions are gonna depend on how well they work out and team fit. i can only see deandre jordan's stock dropping over the next month as teams find out more about him.
the bulls have a variety of good-not great scorers and shooters from the wings (gordon, hinrich, nocioni, deng) but their most glaring need is low-post offense. if roy stayed in the draft last year, i def think bulls would have taken him over noah at ten. chicago media and community will kill them, but i'd recommend trading down to 4 to get brook lopez. it all depends on the new coach and where paxson wants to take the team
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on May 21, 2008 13:21:08 GMT -5
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GIGAFAN99
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Post by GIGAFAN99 on May 21, 2008 13:25:53 GMT -5
Am I missing something on Lopez?
How can you take a 7'0 guy who can't shoot 50% over college kids not even close to his size AND playing with a literal twin tower?
If he has upside doing that, what does Kevin Love or Roy have?
I'll never understand the draft.
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