RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,143
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Post by RBHoya on Jan 12, 2021 14:44:58 GMT -5
Since the first SJU game, Dante's numbers are: FG: 11-43 (25.6%) 2PT: 6-29 (20.7%) 3PT: 5-14 (35.7%) FT: 2-2 (100%) A/TO ratio: 15/17 (0.88) MPG: 32.6 The outside shooting is fine, but obviously learning to become more selective in attacking the rim and taking better care of the ball are a work in progress. Understand Jalen is out and Dante is going to get heavy minutes, but still would like to see him more in the 25-28 MPG range to keep him fresh. If opposing teams are not exerting pressure in the backcourt, we need to steal some minutes going with a bigger Blair/Carey/Clark or Blair/Berger/Carey lineup. All you need to see - shouldn’t be playing now, but we have no alternative. Won’t be playing next year as much and beyond won’t be playing at all IMO. Just doesn’t have size or skills to be a major college PG. I am bookmarking this one and filing it away with all the "Jon Wallace isn't good enough to play at this level and won't be seeing the floor anymore once Josh Thornton and Jessie Sapp get here" takes from this time in 2005 You could be right of course. So much will depend on Dante himself and how much learns, how hard he works and how well he is coached--not to mention who else we add to the roster. But I'm rooting hard for him. This is a guy who committed to Georgetown within a day of getting the offer. He didn't decide to weigh out his options or hope that with a good senior year he'd get an offer from Tennessee or some other SEC team. He wanted to be a Hoya and he jumped on it. From everything I've seen he's played hard, diving for loose balls, leaving it all on the floor and being an encouraging teammate. There's for sure a big jump in competition level from where he was--at a brand new high school at the lowest level somewhere near the Smoky Mountains--and the Big East. He's obviously struggling to adapt to that level in recent weeks. He's been thrust into a tough spot, but hopefully being thrown into the fire helps him to improve. We will see, but I hope it works out for him.
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mdtd
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,567
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Post by mdtd on Jan 12, 2021 16:41:52 GMT -5
Since the first SJU game, Dante's numbers are: FG: 11-43 (25.6%) 2PT: 6-29 (20.7%) 3PT: 5-14 (35.7%) FT: 2-2 (100%) A/TO ratio: 15/17 (0.88) MPG: 32.6 The outside shooting is fine, but obviously learning to become more selective in attacking the rim and taking better care of the ball are a work in progress. Understand Jalen is out and Dante is going to get heavy minutes, but still would like to see him more in the 25-28 MPG range to keep him fresh. If opposing teams are not exerting pressure in the backcourt, we need to steal some minutes going with a bigger Blair/Carey/Clark or Blair/Berger/Carey lineup. All you need to see - shouldn’t be playing now, but we have no alternative. Won’t be playing next year as much and beyond won’t be playing at all IMO. Just doesn’t have size or skills to be a major college PG. He is a freshman 3 star PG who wasn't expected to play major minutes at a major CBB program. You have to be patient with a freshman PG. Period. We've seen flashes, we need him to start putting them together. He has no alternative other than to play through mistakes and that can get to you physically and mentally. He needs someone who can spot him some minutes so he can progress naturally. Giving up on him this early is extreme. He has potential, we've seen his breakout game, we just need to develop his skillset and give him a good opportunity to succeed. And yes, our player development has been terrible. I absolutely won't dispute that and I believe it's a major problem with our current staff. That doesn't mean the staff should give up on it and not play the young guys. You let them play though their mistakes, especially this season. Just throwing Dante to the wolves, forcing him to play fatigued and through a slump without a break is harsh on anyone, let alone a freshman PG. Give him some time.
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Post by professorhoya on Jan 12, 2021 18:18:23 GMT -5
All you need to see - shouldn’t be playing now, but we have no alternative. Won’t be playing next year as much and beyond won’t be playing at all IMO. Just doesn’t have size or skills to be a major college PG. He is a freshman 3 star PG who wasn't expected to play major minutes at a major CBB program. You have to be patient with a freshman PG. Period. We've seen flashes, we need him to start putting them together. He has no alternative other than to play through mistakes and that can get to you physically and mentally. He needs someone who can spot him some minutes so he can progress naturally. Giving up on him this early is extreme. He has potential, we've seen his breakout game, we just need to develop his skillset and give him a good opportunity to succeed. And yes, our player development has been terrible. I absolutely won't dispute that and I believe it's a major problem with our current staff. That doesn't mean the staff should give up on it and not play the young guys. You let them play though their mistakes, especially this season. Just throwing Dante to the wolves, forcing him to play fatigued and through a slump without a break is harsh on anyone, let alone a freshman PG. Give him some time. I think we know what we have with Dante now. We should cut his minutes in half and give Berger and Sibley his minutes in order to get them experience and develop them.
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smokeyjack
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,301
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Post by smokeyjack on Jan 12, 2021 18:57:40 GMT -5
He is a freshman 3 star PG who wasn't expected to play major minutes at a major CBB program. You have to be patient with a freshman PG. Period. We've seen flashes, we need him to start putting them together. He has no alternative other than to play through mistakes and that can get to you physically and mentally. He needs someone who can spot him some minutes so he can progress naturally. Giving up on him this early is extreme. He has potential, we've seen his breakout game, we just need to develop his skillset and give him a good opportunity to succeed. And yes, our player development has been terrible. I absolutely won't dispute that and I believe it's a major problem with our current staff. That doesn't mean the staff should give up on it and not play the young guys. You let them play though their mistakes, especially this season. Just throwing Dante to the wolves, forcing him to play fatigued and through a slump without a break is harsh on anyone, let alone a freshman PG. Give him some time. I think we know what we have with Dante now. We should cut his minutes in half and give Berger and Sibley his minutes in order to get them experience and develop them. You can’t do that unless you really want to embarrass these kids in the process. Why? Because if you cut Dante’s minutes in half, who takes them? Certainly not Berger? He has zero PG skills. He’s a spot up shooter with no handles and a very marginal passer. Blair already plays basically 40 mpg. While I have questioned Dante’s skills, I’m absolutely not blaming him for our results this season. Without Jalen, who was more polished and slightly less gifted, we have NO other option at PG. None. Tough to have to play a frosh this much for sure, but the last thing Pat can do is give his minutes to someone else. PG contributions are by far the biggest issue this team has on the offensive end. Reducing time for the only true pg on the roster might slightly improve his efficiency while he is on the floor, but it sends the rest of the group to zero when he’s off it. Who passes to Blair for open looks when Blair is forced to play out of position at PG? Are you suggesting one of our equally inexperienced wings (Kobe, Holloway, Sibs) give it a shot? Were you just being facetious?
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,650
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 12, 2021 19:02:31 GMT -5
Probably makes sense to rest Dante a bit. What’s the plan if Dante gets injured?
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,219
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Post by hoya9797 on Jan 12, 2021 19:03:13 GMT -5
If there is a plan, it would be the first one in four years.
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Post by professorhoya on Jan 12, 2021 19:22:33 GMT -5
I think we know what we have with Dante now. We should cut his minutes in half and give Berger and Sibley his minutes in order to get them experience and develop them. You can’t do that unless you really want to embarrass these kids in the process. Why? Because if you cut Dante’s minutes in half, who takes them? Certainly not Berger? He has zero PG skills. He’s a spot up shooter with no handles and a very marginal passer. Blair already plays basically 40 mpg. While I have questioned Dante’s skills, I’m absolutely not blaming him for our results this season. Without Jalen, who was more polished and slightly less gifted, we have NO other option at PG. None. Tough to have to play a frosh this much for sure, but the last thing Pat can do is give his minutes to someone else. PG contributions are by far the biggest issue this team has on the offensive end. Reducing time for the only true pg on the roster might slightly improve his efficiency while he is on the floor, but it sends the rest of the group to zero when he’s off it. Who passes to Blair for open looks when Blair is forced to play out of position at PG? Are you suggesting one of our equally inexperienced wings (Kobe, Holloway, Sibs) give it a shot? Were you just being facetious? Shouldn't we see if Berger can play point? Only way to do that is to play him in the games right? Isn't this what people were clamoring for. If all he can do is play shooting guard then he'll be stuck behind Aminu and others.
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OldHoyafan
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,387
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Post by OldHoyafan on Jan 12, 2021 21:39:57 GMT -5
Did not Berger play pg for his dad in high school?
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smokeyjack
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,301
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Post by smokeyjack on Jan 12, 2021 21:41:47 GMT -5
You can’t do that unless you really want to embarrass these kids in the process. Why? Because if you cut Dante’s minutes in half, who takes them? Certainly not Berger? He has zero PG skills. He’s a spot up shooter with no handles and a very marginal passer. Blair already plays basically 40 mpg. While I have questioned Dante’s skills, I’m absolutely not blaming him for our results this season. Without Jalen, who was more polished and slightly less gifted, we have NO other option at PG. None. Tough to have to play a frosh this much for sure, but the last thing Pat can do is give his minutes to someone else. PG contributions are by far the biggest issue this team has on the offensive end. Reducing time for the only true pg on the roster might slightly improve his efficiency while he is on the floor, but it sends the rest of the group to zero when he’s off it. Who passes to Blair for open looks when Blair is forced to play out of position at PG? Are you suggesting one of our equally inexperienced wings (Kobe, Holloway, Sibs) give it a shot? Were you just being facetious? Shouldn't we see if Berger can play point? Only way to do that is to play him in the games right? Isn't this what people were clamoring for. If all he can do is play shooting guard then he'll be stuck behind Aminu and others. Come on man. Even Berger would tell you he’s not a PG. He literally does not have a single PG skill. He’s a spot-up catch and shoot guy. Period. But carry on dreaming.
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Post by BeantownHoya on Jan 12, 2021 21:59:38 GMT -5
Shouldn't we see if Berger can play point? Only way to do that is to play him in the games right? Isn't this what people were clamoring for. If all he can do is play shooting guard then he'll be stuck behind Aminu and others. Come on man. Even Berger would tell you he’s not a PG. He literally does not have a single PG skill. He’s a spot-up catch and shoot guy. Period. But carry on dreaming. This is correct...why...because smokeyjack says so...ignore that he seems to actually have pretty good vision and a good handle...he can be nothing more because smokey says so...everyone move on
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Post by bornhoya on Jan 12, 2021 22:09:28 GMT -5
Come on man. Even Berger would tell you he’s not a PG. He literally does not have a single PG skill. He’s a spot-up catch and shoot guy. Period. But carry on dreaming. This is correct...why...because smokeyjack says so...ignore that he seems to actually have pretty good vision and a good handle...he can be nothing more because smokey says so...everyone move on I agree with Smokey Berger isn’t a point guard and trying to make him one his freshman year would take him from the thing he does the best
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,527
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Post by prhoya on Jan 12, 2021 23:15:56 GMT -5
This is correct...why...because smokeyjack says so...ignore that he seems to actually have pretty good vision and a good handle...he can be nothing more because smokey says so...everyone move on I agree with Smokey Berger isn’t a point guard and trying to make him one his freshman year would take him from the thing he does the best That’s not right. Berger is a combo and played PG and SG for a very talented hs team. Here’s a thread with reviews and videos: hoyatalk2.proboards.com/thread/32046/tj-berger-verbal-commit-georgetownFor those here who complain about lack of height at PG, Berger is a godsend. Rivals and 247Sports have him listed as a PG, but what do they know.
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bostonfan
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,531
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Post by bostonfan on Jan 13, 2021 8:49:32 GMT -5
I really don't understand the mindset of ripping Dante, or Berger, for the growing pains they are showing as freshman. They have both shown enough upside to make you think they can be important contributors to the Georgetown program for years to come. They have both also made their fair share of freshman mistakes, just like pretty much every other freshman coming into D1 college basketball. Neither guy was a 5 star, top 20 national recruit and I think that some people are evaluating them like they were expected to come in and be major contributors with a fully developed game this year.
Dante has had to play a lot more minutes than I think he expected, or the staff had planned, with Jalen's family issues. He has had some bright moments and he has also had some plays that he needs to learn from and improve on. If these two guys are still making the same mistakes next year, then it becomes more reasonable to discuss if they have what it takes to be successful at this level, but at this point I think everyone would be better served to enjoy the good plays and hope the playing time this year accelerates their growth as players.
I don't know if these guys will ever be stars for Georgetown, or if they will even develop into consistent role players, but I do know that it is too early in their careers to make a final determination on either of them.
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,422
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Post by the_way on Jan 13, 2021 9:54:22 GMT -5
Recruiting services can do more harm than good for fanbases. Everyone is an expert because they see stars next to kid's name.
Not saying they are totally inaccurate, but it leads to crazy expectations or none at all for certain players.
Just to let the guys play. There are great players, there are busts and everywhere in between.
We know that this team is not the best. Dante is playing one of the most important positions....PG. Guards in general are very important, especially in the college game. With Jalen out and Berger still green, we are very thin in the backcourt. Ewing is bringing Berger along gradually because he is green. When you are developing guys, each player is different. Some fans don't understand this and just see stars and youtube highlights. Ewing sees them in practice everyday against their peers. Berger gets more of benefit of the doubt from fans and they want more playing time for him. Dante doesn't have that luxury, so his inexperience shows more because he plays more minutes. People want his minutes scaled back. See how it works?
Dante is doing fine. He is going to make mistakes. He is a freshmen. It comes with the territory. Same goes with the other freshmen. They are all at different stages of development.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,527
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Post by prhoya on Jan 13, 2021 10:17:00 GMT -5
Recruiting services can do more harm than good for fanbases. Everyone is an expert because they see stars next to kid's name. Not saying they are totally inaccurate, but it leads to crazy expectations or none at all for certain players. Just to let the guys play. There are great players, there are busts and everywhere in between. We know that this team is not the best. Dante is playing one of the most important positions....PG. Guards in general are very important, especially in the college game. With Jalen out and Berger still green, we are very thin in the backcourt. Ewing is bringing Berger along gradually because he is green. When you are developing guys, each player is different. Some fans don't understand this and just see stars and youtube highlights. Ewing sees them in practice everyday against their peers. Berger gets more of benefit of the doubt from fans and they want more playing time for him. Dante doesn't have that luxury, so his inexperience shows more because he plays more minutes. People want his minutes scaled back. See how it works? Dante is doing fine. He is going to make mistakes. He is a freshmen. It comes with the territory. Same goes with the other freshmen. They are all at different stages of development. You cannot have a project playing 35 minutes and a shooter 37.5 playing 37.5 minutes and expect progress. Give Dante and Blair some relief minutes each half or settle them down if needed. Berger can provide 10-15 minutes. I would even try bringing the ball up by committee. We don’t have a dominant ball handler or dominant player. Let’s work around that and include players like Robinson, who provided relief minutes last year and didn’t look out of place. For better or for worse, the roster’s talent level is very similar. Let’s at least have fresh players with game experience by February.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Jan 13, 2021 10:18:15 GMT -5
Keep your head up Dante! Most fans are VERY glad to have you and look forward to continued contributions for the duration of your career.
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Post by pioneeer on Jan 13, 2021 10:41:37 GMT -5
Mr. Dante Harris:
As a proud fan/person that believes in Georgetown Hoyas basketball, I also believe in your ability to lead the Hoyas basketball team!!
One great author once said, “don’t let no one take your manhood!”
I live by that quote! This is my personal feelings!
Stay confident! 🙏🏽 Keep your head high! Success is imminent for the team in your leadership!!
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,899
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Post by SFHoya99 on Jan 13, 2021 12:11:51 GMT -5
Dante is a better prospect than Akinjo ever was.
He's quicker off the dribble and is beating guys with pure speed. Akinjo had a nice change of pace and a great handle, but you'd prefer to simply be faster. You can learn the other stuff.
He elevates better than Akinjo. He's missing his layups, but he's not getting repeatedly stuffed. That's important. That's a far more important sign -- if he can convert at the rim where he is largely missing lightly contested shots, he becomes a threat we haven't had in years.
His shot is fine. It's not as good as Akinjo's, but there's nothing broken about it, and we're still in the small enough sample that we don't know where he's going to end up.
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
Posts: 19,143
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 13, 2021 12:18:50 GMT -5
Dante is a better prospect than Akinjo ever was. He's quicker off the dribble and is beating guys with pure speed. Akinjo had a nice change of pace and a great handle, but you'd prefer to simply be faster. You can learn the other stuff. He elevates better than Akinjo. He's missing his layups, but he's not getting repeatedly stuffed. That's important. That's a far more important sign -- if he can convert at the rim where he is largely missing lightly contested shots, he becomes a threat we haven't had in years. His shot is fine. It's not as good as Akinjo's, but there's nothing broken about it, and we're still in the small enough sample that we don't know where he's going to end up. Needs to work on his floater like Blair has done. I think Dante has tried it a couple of times with mixed success.
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Jan 13, 2021 12:32:31 GMT -5
Dante is a better prospect than Akinjo ever was. He's quicker off the dribble and is beating guys with pure speed. Akinjo had a nice change of pace and a great handle, but you'd prefer to simply be faster. You can learn the other stuff. He elevates better than Akinjo. He's missing his layups, but he's not getting repeatedly stuffed. That's important. That's a far more important sign -- if he can convert at the rim where he is largely missing lightly contested shots, he becomes a threat we haven't had in years. His shot is fine. It's not as good as Akinjo's, but there's nothing broken about it, and we're still in the small enough sample that we don't know where he's going to end up. Dante has lots of potential. To say that he will be a star OR to say that he will never amount to much in the Big East is way premature at best. Akinjo had a more polished game from the outset, but he also had a better surrounding cast and less pressure on his shoulders. Dante has a chance to be pretty good down the road. I agree with SF's assessment of his speed and elevation. He can learn how to finish, develop his shot, make better decisions, and become a force. I look forward to watching that happen.
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