iowa80
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Post by iowa80 on Dec 28, 2017 18:26:29 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation.
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SDHoya
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Post by SDHoya on Dec 28, 2017 18:44:52 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation. Are we building him up too much based on limited info and clip of windmill jams against middle school teams? Probably. But I'm also not sure we need a 5 star PG to bring this team together next year. If we simply had a decent PG this year we would be at a different level. If McClung can just be a solid ball-handler who occasionally makes a high-light reel dunk, I'd certainly take it.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 28, 2017 19:18:03 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation. It's not uncommon at all. There's tons of kids who aren't Top 100 that end up being as talented or more talented than many of their Top 100 brethren. The mid-major upsets every year speak to that. In order to pre-empt the inevitable discussion, it's not that recruiting rankings are meaningless. But when you have more information, they are hardly ironclad.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2017 19:29:46 GMT -5
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iowa80
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Post by iowa80 on Dec 28, 2017 19:39:02 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation. It's not uncommon at all. There's tons of kids who aren't Top 100 that end up being as talented or more talented than many of their Top 100 brethren. The mid-major upsets every year speak to that. In order to pre-empt the inevitable discussion, it's not that recruiting rankings are meaningless. But when you have more information, they are hardly ironclad. Sure, but we don't have much reliable information. Because, as you point out, these rankings aren't ironclad, I was somewhat hesitant to go there, but, thanks to the publicity his style has created, Mac isn't exactly an unknown despite the low profile of the region in which he plays. He had a certain level of D1 offers, but none interested him over Rutgers initially. And I somewhat understated the recruiting services by only referencing "top 100" when he's not even on the fringe of that. I get that there are "finds" all over the country, but we recognize those finds based on D1 success. Given the vast differences in levels of competition, the eye test doesn't always work, and I tend to look at other schools' recruitment efforts supplemented by the (admittedly flawed) rating services.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Dec 28, 2017 19:53:15 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation. Charles Smith. Even the coach told him he would never play, but he turned out all right.
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iowa80
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by iowa80 on Dec 28, 2017 20:54:53 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation. Charles Smith. Even the coach told him he would never play, but he turned out all right. And that's a good Syracuse memory!
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Dec 28, 2017 21:37:58 GMT -5
Just like Waters, Bracey and Lykes couldn't run the show at a high division one program. McClung will be just fine.
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hoyainla
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by hoyainla on Dec 28, 2017 22:49:26 GMT -5
Sorry to be the glass half empty guy, but I've been running through this thread in an effort to see why we should be so enthusiastic about the kid. Mix tapes against a certain level of competition only take you so far. And if he's a combo guard as opposed to a PG, that's OK too provided he contributes. But how often do the recruiting evaluators really miss by this much (top 100 nowhere)? At the high major level, you can win with well-coached three-stars, but you generally don't build around them or rely on them for essential roles. Virtually all of the impressions of Mac (the most recent tournament notwithstanding) are based on a certain (low?)level of competition, combined with his (non-starring) role with Loaded. I'll welcome him to the team, but I'm wondering if we're not getting ahead of ourselves in talent evaluation. It's not uncommon at all. There's tons of kids who aren't Top 100 that end up being as talented or more talented than many of their Top 100 brethren. The mid-major upsets every year speak to that. In order to pre-empt the inevitable discussion, it's not that recruiting rankings are meaningless. But when you have more information, they are hardly ironclad. The recruiting rankings was all discussed in this thread hoyatalk2.proboards.com/thread/30579/recruiting-rankings-pretty-good-indicatorsAs for McClung as long as they are still recruiting a true PG and don't think he fills that role then all will be fine. If they are not they are making a mistake.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Dec 29, 2017 8:31:01 GMT -5
Just like Waters, Bracey and Lykes couldn't run the show at a high division one program. McClung will be just fine. Bracey, and Waters were true point guards. Lykes, not so much even. Two guard in a point guard's body. Waters a true point guard. McClung will and I think be unselfish and turn into a nice distributor. Hope he makes great decisions on the ball. I hear u.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Dec 29, 2017 8:33:51 GMT -5
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Dec 29, 2017 8:36:54 GMT -5
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Dec 29, 2017 9:14:14 GMT -5
Don't let up GC!
Go McClung. WAKE UP HOYNATION!!!
SICK!!!
SICKER!!!
GAMETIME!!!
108 points in 3 games at the Arby's Classic Tourney in Bristol, TN. WHOA!
HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!
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calhoya
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Post by calhoya on Dec 29, 2017 9:32:32 GMT -5
I just want to see if he can create a shot from the perimeter, as opposed to highlight dunks that will be much harder to come by in the BE. Agree with SFHoya that recruiting rankings are often not a good measure of success. However as of now Ewing is rolling with two "lower" ranked players out of his 3 person class and that is somewhat of a risk, even though I tend to trust his ability to coach up Carter, the big kid.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Dec 29, 2017 10:29:46 GMT -5
I just want to see if he can create a shot from the perimeter, as opposed to highlight dunks that will be much harder to come by in the BE. Agree with SFHoya that recruiting rankings are often not a good measure of success. However as of now Ewing is rolling with two "lower" ranked players out of his 3 person class and that is somewhat of a risk, even though I tend to trust his ability to coach up Carter, the big kid. He can do this. He see's these guys in AAU is why he's gotten so much better....
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Dec 29, 2017 10:31:09 GMT -5
Stick any one of Mulmore-Dickerson-Mosely in a high school tournament and can you honestly say they could put up 44 points? No way!
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Post by hoyalove4ever on Dec 29, 2017 10:58:03 GMT -5
Disagree- at their current level I believe each would dominate. But Mac likely is ahead of all of them, especially as a scorer, as to their senior years in high school.
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mfk24
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Post by mfk24 on Dec 29, 2017 11:25:27 GMT -5
Kamar Baldwin who torched us for what 30 points on Weds was a 3 star sub 100 guy out of high school, same with Creighton's Khyri Thomas, and Marquette's Rowsey was ranked even lower. Not to say that McClung will be the type of player for us that those guys have been for their respective schools, but clearly their rankings didn't preclude them from significant contributions to their teams.
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Post by glidehoyas (Inactive) on Dec 29, 2017 11:26:50 GMT -5
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on Dec 29, 2017 11:58:04 GMT -5
Disagree- at their current level I believe each would dominate. But Mac likely is ahead of all of them, especially as a scorer, as to their senior years in high school. Yeah considering Mulmore averaged 26/game (IIRC) in JUCO I think he could score 40 easy against low level HS competition. That being said I can't imagine Mac being any worse than Mulmore at this point but it's not like Mulmore was considered a decent HS recruit.
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