Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 9:25:40 GMT -5
The difference is it's Pat's team, not 3's, so he gets to pick how to develop them...
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Post by professorhoya on Aug 8, 2017 9:37:09 GMT -5
...and beginning to branch out west... And playing in that nationally-televised tournament in Oregon is definitely going to bolster these efforts. . . . That nobody will be watching. It's on at the sametime as the Redskin-Giants game and NBA games.
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bostonfan
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Post by bostonfan on Aug 8, 2017 9:37:19 GMT -5
The difference is it's Pat's team, not 3's, so he gets to pick how to develop them... I really think that not playing in this tournament is getting way overblown. It is just not that big a deal. If the new coach wants to make sure his team understands his new system and his expectations before testing them against stronger competition, that is his call. Building confidence and trust in a new style of play and seeing some positive results is going to be important and they will have plenty of chances to play strong competition when the Big East schedule starts. Coach Ewing has never struck me as a guy who will duck a fight and I would think this a one year decision and they will be playing in one of the holiday tournaments against big name competition next year.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:02:56 GMT -5
It's absolutely coach's call - I just think he made a bad call.
I think that a lot of people (including some within the basketball program, apparently) are overplaying the "rebuilding" of our program. The reality is that almost every program in the country loses its best player (or players) every year. Almost every program in the country loses (or loses out on) recruits that it was expecting or hoping to have. So many kids transfer in and out of programs that significant roster turnover is becoming the rule rather than the exception. While our talent level isn't going to match up with Michigan State, we're not a bunch of stiffs. A coaching change is a huge transition, but it's also a transition that dozens of programs go through every year. Hell, you could argue that Butler's coaching transition should have been far more disruptive than ours. But we're acting like we have to tiptoe our way through a few years to get this right.
And I understand the "nobody is going to be watching this tournament" sentiment, but is that really the hill we want to die on? I don't want us to be the program that says "No one will notice that we're scared, so it's cool that we're scared."
We're going to take our lumps this year, no doubt. But we're not the only program out there that will. But we appear to be the only program that's going snowflake because of it.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Aug 8, 2017 10:13:19 GMT -5
Definitely this should be Coach Ewing's call. Articulate the reasons rather than have the AD put out a nebulous statement and relying on 'friends' of the staff to dribble it out there. It's not that hard to envision putting a simple, clear, positive rationale statement out there proactively for the fanbase.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:13:33 GMT -5
A coaching change is a huge transition, but it's also a transition that dozens of programs go through every year. Hell, you could argue that Butler's coaching transition should have been far more disruptive than ours. But we're acting like we have to tiptoe our way through a few years to get this right. How is Butlers coaching change more disruptive than ours?
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Aug 8, 2017 10:16:12 GMT -5
Ohio State doesn't have a brand new coach. They're coach was a head at Butler, another College program. Pat is a brand new coach, who has never coached at this level, it's totally different. You guys may not like it, but it's a coach being honest about where he thinks he and his team are... But he's new to Ohio State.. Very few if any of the kids on Ohio State's roster have played in Holtsmann's system, they're in a transition period also.. CBB and the NBA are very different in many ways but isn't coaching, coaching? Doesn't PE's coaching experience count for something on the college level?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:18:11 GMT -5
Definitely this should be Coach Ewing's call. Articulate the reasons rather than have the AD put out a nebulous statement and relying on 'friends' of the staff to dribble it out there. It's not that hard to envision putting a simple, clear, positive rationale statement out there proactively for the fanbase. Meh... That would have had 0 effect on the fan reaction since the main gripe is we're ducking comp. I read an article slamming the decision on the front page of this site, how much of it was dedicated to ripping the statement roll out?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:21:58 GMT -5
A coaching change is a huge transition, but it's also a transition that dozens of programs go through every year. Hell, you could argue that Butler's coaching transition should have been far more disruptive than ours. But we're acting like we have to tiptoe our way through a few years to get this right. How is Butlers coaching change more disruptive than ours? I said that you could argue that it SHOULD have been more disruptive: 1. Holtmann got poached. So it was a surprise, at least relative to a firing. 2. He got poached real late in the game, after most of the coaching musical chairs had stopped. Fewer candidates available to replace him. 3. He took his top recruit with him. In the end, it probably hasn't been more disruptive than ours. And maybe that says something, too.
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Aug 8, 2017 10:23:44 GMT -5
A lot of the fan reaction here was conjecture on the reasoning behind the decision, and the AD release did little to clarify that leading to a lot of speculation as to why and who made the call. Sure, there would be the negative reaction for the withdrawal regardless.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:26:21 GMT -5
Ohio State doesn't have a brand new coach. They're coach was a head at Butler, another College program. Pat is a brand new coach, who has never coached at this level, it's totally different. You guys may not like it, but it's a coach being honest about where he thinks he and his team are... But he's new to Ohio State.. Very few if any of the kids on Ohio State's roster have played in Holtsmann's system, they're in a transition period also.. CBB and the NBA are very different in many ways but isn't coaching, coaching? Doesn't PE's coaching experience count for something on the college level? You know the answers to these questions, don't know why you are asking me... No it's not the same. Holtman made a lateral move, Coach moved to a different level.. There's been many many articles written about the challenges of college coaches moving to the NBA and vice versa
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Aug 8, 2017 10:27:17 GMT -5
Definitely this should be Coach Ewing's call. Articulate the reasons rather than have the AD put out a nebulous statement and relying on 'friends' of the staff to dribble it out there. It's not that hard to envision putting a simple, clear, positive rationale statement out there proactively for the fanbase. That is my only thought in the end, the AD statement just helps foster the impression that we are simply ducking the competition. State that the work needed for a young team to put in entirely new offensive and defensive systems requires so much practice work that travelling cross country for a 3 day tourney in November would delay and hamper that development.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:34:27 GMT -5
How is Butlers coaching change more disruptive than ours? I said that you could argue that it SHOULD have been more disruptive: 1. Holtmann got poached. So it was a surprise, at least relative to a firing. 2. He got poached real late in the game, after most of the coaching musical chairs had stopped. Fewer candidates available to replace him. 3. He took his top recruit with him. In the end, it probably hasn't been more disruptive than ours. And maybe that says something, too. Idk I don't see it that way. Butler hired a guy who had coached at Butler, and he was/is a HC at current level. The only player they lost is Chrabascz
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Post by ewingitrust on Aug 8, 2017 10:42:10 GMT -5
We've got too much program/potential recruiting steam behind our backs to dwell about this Pk80 tournament. 2years from now fans will forget this. When JT3 scheduled tough and we started losing those games, "fans" complained...and "fans" now want to complain because we've done the unpopular, most shrewd move to exit the tournament. So far every negative roadblock "fans" have thrown at PE and the Staff they have met to fix. Wins and losses are another matter, but the Staff has planted alot of seeds that will be fruit. Support the program. Trust the Staff.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:47:53 GMT -5
I said that you could argue that it SHOULD have been more disruptive: 1. Holtmann got poached. So it was a surprise, at least relative to a firing. 2. He got poached real late in the game, after most of the coaching musical chairs had stopped. Fewer candidates available to replace him. 3. He took his top recruit with him. In the end, it probably hasn't been more disruptive than ours. And maybe that says something, too. Idk I don't see it that way. Butler hired a guy who had coached at Butler, and he was/is a HC at current level. The only player they lost is Chrabascz When a coach gets poached late in the game and takes his entire staff and his top recruit (Kyle Young) with him, that could be a recipe for disaster. But it wasn't for Butler.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 10:52:08 GMT -5
Idk I don't see it that way. Butler hired a guy who had coached at Butler, and he was/is a HC at current level. The only player they lost is Chrabascz When a coach gets poached late in the game and takes his entire staff and his top recruit (Kyle Young) with him, that could be a recipe for disaster. But it wasn't for Butler. They have a formula, it's called The Butler Way. This isn't the first time they've been through this, and they retained the majority of their roster from the previous season that made the tourney.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 11:11:01 GMT -5
When a coach gets poached late in the game and takes his entire staff and his top recruit (Kyle Young) with him, that could be a recipe for disaster. But it wasn't for Butler. They have a formula, it's called The Butler Way. So...what's The Georgetown Way? I understand where you're coming from, but if you're basically saying "They were prepared for something like this, but we weren't", that's not encouraging. Any coaching change is going to result in some level of upheaval - but ours seems to have surprised, flummoxed, and cowed our program. Not a good look.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 11:20:18 GMT -5
They have a formula, it's called The Butler Way. So...what's The Georgetown Way? I understand where you're coming from, but if you're basically saying "They were prepared for something like this, but we weren't", that's not encouraging. Any coaching change is going to result in some level of upheaval - but ours seems to have surprised, flummoxed, and cowed our program. Not a good look. They are unique imo. What's the Michigan way? Or the Syracuse way? What I'm saying is they are familiar with the process because as a former MM they have a lot of history dealing with it. They've had 4 different head coaches in 6 seasons... They use "The Butler Way" in order to maintain consistency in their program.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2017 11:22:30 GMT -5
So...what's The Georgetown Way? I understand where you're coming from, but if you're basically saying "They were prepared for something like this, but we weren't", that's not encouraging. Any coaching change is going to result in some level of upheaval - but ours seems to have surprised, flummoxed, and cowed our program. Not a good look. What the Michigan way? Or the Syracuse way? What I'm saying is they are familiar with the process because as a former MM they have a lot of history dealing with it. They've had 4 different head coaches in 6 seasons... They use The Butler Way in order to maintain consistency in their program. The Syracuse Way: Lie, Cheat, Pick Your Nose
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Aug 8, 2017 11:26:15 GMT -5
In less than 6 months PE and staff are methodically transforming Gtown into a national destination school again. We have the facilities, basketball lineage, location(DC), academic reputation to directly go toe to toe with any school in the country. PE and staff have realized this. We've begun to mend relationships with programs in the DMV, made inroads up n down the east coast and have a presence in the south and beginning to branch out west. Kudos to the staff making the effort. It will pay off big time. The staff has certainly done some good things. I like that when Ewing was hired he didn't seem shy about getting out there and giving interviews. I like that the staff seems to be recruiting aggressively, and landed Pickett. But, it's important to keep in mind we haven't played a game yet, and we don't have any 2018 commits yet (I realize Ewing got started late there, but still, we need players). As far as the other posters pointing out that Ewing is different from other coaches because he hasn't coached in college before...That's the point I and others were making when we were saying we were hesitant to hire Ewing. But, at the time, we were told that Ewing was an NBA assistant for 15 years, clearly had the ability to coach a college program, etc. And all that very well could be true. I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, but the fact is hiring Ewing was a risky move, and it's very unclear at this point whether it's going to turn out well. I certainly hope it does, and I have no doubt Ewing will put in hard work to try to make it happen.
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