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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 24, 2017 13:11:06 GMT -5
Not the best audition for Jeff Capel, is it? |
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95hoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,309 
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Post by 95hoya on Jan 24, 2017 13:17:56 GMT -5
We haven't advanced to the second weekend of the tournament since the Bush administration but again ... nothing to see here, move along. *hands up* What's funny is, I'm around area coaches/players on a daily basis and I used to defend our coach like he was a family member. Now, how do you defend the indefensible? Our rep locally is at a level I'd never thought I'd see. I was at a banquet last night and the topic of our program came up at our table and kids in the '19 and '20 classes who are multi-sport athletes and two of whom are no doubt BE-caliber players just laugh at the mere thought of Georgetown but this has become the norm. I even hate relaying stuff like that because of how much it stings but it is what it is and we actually have people willing to put up with minimally three more years of this?!?! I can echo these sentiments. The perception of Georgetown locally is bad. Not only is it not the cool school or winning program at the current time, but there is no local presence. The current roster isn't filled with local players and even the locals we do have weren't the headline names among locals. Local coaches and players have noted that Georgetown isn't out recruiting like the other schools. This is inexcusable in my mind. You gotta have your face in the crowd on a nightly basis. MD and Nova are at every game. VT, Miami, Pitt, and UVA are constantly in the area. Other staff's are relating with the kids better and just out working us. It's the most frustrating thing for me. |
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Nevada Hoya
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Post by Nevada Hoya on Jan 24, 2017 13:23:07 GMT -5
How do the track and cross country teams do so well, even though there has been a revolving door of coaches? Still get good recruits.
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Post by jld54 on Jan 24, 2017 13:24:24 GMT -5
I recognize that Tremont Waters will not be a savior, and that the team needs much improvement to return to an NCAA level team. But we should not underestimate his importance going forward.
However, I do not think that one can underestimate the importance of a top level PG in today's CBB. I watched much of the Duke - NC State game last night and NC State beat Duke at Duke for the first time in 2 decades. I do not usually watch Duke but read that they have issues this year despite top level, one and done classes. The difference was PG - NC State has far less overall talent but a star PG in Dennis Smith, while Duke could not match his talent level in the backcourt.
Smith dominated and is clearly a top level one and done, so I do not wish to place undue expectations on Waters, but this just goes to show the importance of a top level PG. Such a player makes life a lot easier for everyone else -- open jumpers, easy lay ups for bigs, etc. This year's guards simple cannot fulfill this role and without this, we are easily defended. One 3 PGs are too inconsistent to place pressure on an opponent for a full 40 minutes.
So the administration has a real dilemma, even if there was the will to terminate JT3, which there isn't. Fire the coach and likely lose the best PG recruit in a decade, guaranteeing a St. John's/DePaul level existence, or hoping a praying that we can start a turnaround withWaters, Walker and a good 2018 class. Again, we are in a very bad spot now, the worst since 1999 -- when JT2 left, and 2004 -- when Esh left. But the options are very limited...
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beenaround
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,476
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Post by beenaround on Jan 24, 2017 13:31:05 GMT -5
We haven't advanced to the second weekend of the tournament since the Bush administration but again ... nothing to see here, move along. *hands up* What's funny is, I'm around area coaches/players on a daily basis and I used to defend our coach like he was a family member. Now, how do you defend the indefensible? Our rep locally is at a level I'd never thought I'd see. I was at a banquet last night and the topic of our program came up at our table and kids in the '19 and '20 classes who are multi-sport athletes and two of whom are no doubt BE-caliber players just laugh at the mere thought of Georgetown but this has become the norm. I even hate relaying stuff like that because of how much it stings but it is what it is and we actually have people willing to put up with minimally three more years of this?!?! I can echo these sentiments. The perception of Georgetown locally is bad. Not only is it not the cool school or winning program at the current time, but there is no local presence. The current roster isn't filled with local players and even the locals we do have weren't the headline names among locals. Local coaches and players have noted that Georgetown isn't out recruiting like the other schools. This is inexcusable in my mind. You gotta have your face in the crowd on a nightly basis. MD and Nova are at every game. VT, Miami, Pitt, and UVA are constantly in the area. Other staff's are relating with the kids better and just out working us. It's the most frustrating thing for me. This is crazy! Why isn't the staff recruiting the local scene hard? Is it because the perception is so bad that their only chance is with out of towners who may not be as aware of the situation here? The stuff you and Deacon are posting is disturbing. |
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
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Post by the_way on Jan 24, 2017 13:35:45 GMT -5
Not just PG. It is just guards in general. You need strong guard play.You need a strong backcourt. Depth with that backcourt. Jay Wright is a master of small ball. Look at Maryland playing with Cowan and Tremble. That has always been the case. Even with JT2's best teams from the different eras. Look at the guards.
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hoyarad
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 521
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Post by hoyarad on Jan 24, 2017 13:42:39 GMT -5
Waters is 5'11 160. I'm happy he is coming but I'm going to reserve judgement until he proves it on the court (not Kenner league folks)
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seaweed
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,736
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Post by seaweed on Jan 24, 2017 13:45:13 GMT -5
Waters is 5'11 160. I'm happy he is coming but I'm going to reserve judgement until he proves it on the court (not Kenner league folks) you won't be disappointed. |
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,666
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Post by guru on Jan 24, 2017 14:33:06 GMT -5
Not the best audition for Jeff Capel, is it? Wondering if K will manage to not count these losses in his official record, the ruse he pulled back in 1995? Poor Pete Gaudet. |
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,666
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Post by guru on Jan 24, 2017 14:37:15 GMT -5
I recognize that Tremont Waters will not be a savior, and that the team needs much improvement to return to an NCAA level team. But we should not underestimate his importance going forward. However, I do not think that one can underestimate the importance of a top level PG in today's CBB. I watched much of the Duke - NC State game last night and NC State beat Duke at Duke for the first time in 2 decades. I do not usually watch Duke but read that they have issues this year despite top level, one and done classes. The difference was PG - NC State has far less overall talent but a star PG in Dennis Smith, while Duke could not match his talent level in the backcourt. Smith dominated and is clearly a top level one and done, so I do not wish to place undue expectations on Waters, but this just goes to show the importance of a top level PG. Such a player makes life a lot easier for everyone else -- open jumpers, easy lay ups for bigs, etc. This year's guards simple cannot fulfill this role and without this, we are easily defended. One 3 PGs are too inconsistent to place pressure on an opponent for a full 40 minutes. So the administration has a real dilemma, even if there was the will to terminate JT3, which there isn't. Fire the coach and likely lose the best PG recruit in a decade, guaranteeing a St. John's/DePaul level existence, or hoping a praying that we can start a turnaround withWaters, Walker and a good 2018 class. Again, we are in a very bad spot now, the worst since 1999 -- when JT2 left, and 2004 -- when Esh left. But the options are very limited... Way too much pressure to put on a kid who isn't even a consnensus top 30 player in his class. Consider that Isaac was ranked far higher in his year - was he good enough to carry us to may victories? Different position, but still. And our options are only limited if we allow them to be. |
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 15,400
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 24, 2017 15:28:22 GMT -5
I can echo these sentiments. The perception of Georgetown locally is bad. Not only is it not the cool school or winning program at the current time, but there is no local presence. The current roster isn't filled with local players and even the locals we do have weren't the headline names among locals. Local coaches and players have noted that Georgetown isn't out recruiting like the other schools. This is inexcusable in my mind. You gotta have your face in the crowd on a nightly basis. MD and Nova are at every game. VT, Miami, Pitt, and UVA are constantly in the area. Other staff's are relating with the kids better and just out working us. It's the most frustrating thing for me. This is crazy! Why isn't the staff recruiting the local scene hard? Is it because the perception is so bad that their only chance is with out of towners who may not be as aware of the situation here? The stuff you and Deacon are posting is disturbing. Where's the evidence that the staff is recruiting any area hard? There's been little to no chatter about Gtown recruiting over the past couple of months.. Recruiting effort or lack there of continues to be my biggest issue with JT3.. |
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Post by practice on Jan 24, 2017 15:31:42 GMT -5
Life isn't that serious. It is just basketball. It is not the end of the world because our basketball program is struggling right now. III was in the tournament 2 years ago. We've a hit a few roadblocks and folks want to jump ship? Financially, it is understandable because people work hard for their money. Things will get better. But it is your team and/or your school. You can't bail out now. If you don't like the coach, think about the players. At least support them. They need all the help they can get right now. They are not the direct cause of the problems. They want to win as bad you want to win. I support the players and I support the coaching staff ... primarily by attending games, buy season tickets, etc. Let's face it, those of us on here are "super fans". We are that psycho 1% that cares about the Hoyas enough to read hundreds of posts a week (sometimes a day) and opine obsessively about the state of affairs. I feel bad for the team ... I look at that roster and see enough talent to win beat teams other than St. John's and Depaul ... but we don't. I look at JT3 and his staff and I see a group that made some radical changes in the off season in terms of recruiting, coaching and game plan ... and nothing really worked. I'm sure its more frustrating for all of the above ... they are really living it while we are living vicariously. That being said, at this point my donations and future season ticket purchases will be taking a break until I see that the Administration cares as much as I do about this basketball program. JT3 will land on his feet and I'm sure bigger and better things are in the future for the rest of the staff. |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 24, 2017 15:36:57 GMT -5
Way too much pressure to put on a kid who isn't even a consnensus top 30 player in his class. Consider that Isaac was ranked far higher in his year - was he good enough to carry us to may victories? Different position, but still. I agree. It's way too premature to put all of our hopes on Waters, and that's really unfair to Waters too. That said, he could be a great player for us, we just don't know. Just like Copeland was ranked high and never performed to that level, Josh Hart has way outperformed his ranking in the mid-70s. I think the recruiting rankings are good for a general picture, but they are obviously subjective and they often do not translate to on the court performance. |
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guru
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Post by guru on Jan 24, 2017 15:48:06 GMT -5
Way too much pressure to put on a kid who isn't even a consnensus top 30 player in his class. Consider that Isaac was ranked far higher in his year - was he good enough to carry us to may victories? Different position, but still. I agree. It's way too premature to put all of our hopes on Waters, and that's really unfair to Waters too. That said, he could be a great player for us, we just don't know. Just like Copeland was ranked high and never performed to that level, Josh Hart has way outperformed his ranking in the mid-70s. I think the recruiting rankings are good for a general picture, but they are obviously subjective and they often do not translate to on the court performance. Hard to believe you'd bring up Josh Hart. Talk about twisting the knife!  I watched that kid sit behind Hoyas bench at just about every home game. Freely admit that much of recruiting is a crapshoot, but that's a recruiting miscalculation that just haunts us, and may in fact have been the beginning of the end for JT3. We will see. |
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gunny
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Member is Online
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Post by gunny on Jan 24, 2017 16:17:09 GMT -5
What bothers me the most is that the same mistakes are being made OVER and OVER. One example is Tre Campbell. We see him make one and possibly two shots from behind the arc and the next shot is a 25 footer. This happened in the Xavier game. I am sorry we have seen this a couple times this season. It should have happened once and that is it. Never again, but it has. That is just poor basketball IQ on the player and the coach. The coach should yank him out right away and put him at the end of the bench. Never happens though.
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AltoSaxa
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,130
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Post by AltoSaxa on Jan 24, 2017 16:17:18 GMT -5
Things will get better. But it is your team and/or your school. You can't bail out now. If you don't like the coach, think about the players. At least support them. They need all the help they can get right now. They are not the direct cause of the problems. They want to win as bad you want to win. [/quote]
You can also support the players by advocating they are coached by a different person.
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the_way
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
The Illest
Posts: 5,422
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Post by the_way on Jan 24, 2017 16:23:25 GMT -5
Life isn't that serious. It is just basketball. It is not the end of the world because our basketball program is struggling right now. III was in the tournament 2 years ago. We've a hit a few roadblocks and folks want to jump ship? Financially, it is understandable because people work hard for their money. Things will get better. But it is your team and/or your school. You can't bail out now. If you don't like the coach, think about the players. At least support them. They need all the help they can get right now. They are not the direct cause of the problems. They want to win as bad you want to win. I support the players and I support the coaching staff ... primarily by attending games, buy season tickets, etc. Let's face it, those of us on here are "super fans". We are that psycho 1% that cares about the Hoyas enough to read hundreds of posts a week (sometimes a day) and opine obsessively about the state of affairs. I feel bad for the team ... I look at that roster and see enough talent to win beat teams other than St. John's and Depaul ... but we don't. I look at JT3 and his staff and I see a group that made some radical changes in the off season in terms of recruiting, coaching and game plan... and nothing really worked. I'm sure its more frustrating for all of the above ... they are really living it while we are living vicariously. That being said, at this point my donations and future season ticket purchases will be taking a break until I see that the Administration cares as much as I do about this basketball program. JT3 will land on his feet and I'm sure bigger and better things are in the future for the rest of the staff. That change won't happen in one season though, unless you recruit a one and done player (or two). |
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 24, 2017 18:11:15 GMT -5
I agree. It's way too premature to put all of our hopes on Waters, and that's really unfair to Waters too. That said, he could be a great player for us, we just don't know. Just like Copeland was ranked high and never performed to that level, Josh Hart has way outperformed his ranking in the mid-70s. I think the recruiting rankings are good for a general picture, but they are obviously subjective and they often do not translate to on the court performance. Hard to believe you'd bring up Josh Hart. Talk about twisting the knife! I watched that kid sit behind Hoyas bench at just about every home game. Freely admit that much of recruiting is a crapshoot, but that's a recruiting miscalculation that just haunts us, and may in fact have been the beginning of the end for JT3. We will see. No doubt Hart was a huge miss. And I don't only say that because he's become such a good player. He would have been a solid guard in a time where we basically had none in the pipeline. For whatever it's worth Cameron was similarly ranked in high school but Hart is clearly the better player now. |
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EtomicB
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 15,400
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 24, 2017 18:35:56 GMT -5
Hard to believe you'd bring up Josh Hart. Talk about twisting the knife! I watched that kid sit behind Hoyas bench at just about every home game. Freely admit that much of recruiting is a crapshoot, but that's a recruiting miscalculation that just haunts us, and may in fact have been the beginning of the end for JT3. We will see. No doubt Hart was a huge miss. And I don't only say that because he's become such a good player. He would have been a solid guard in a time where we basically had none in the pipeline. For whatever it's worth Cameron was similarly ranked in high school but Hart is clearly the better player now. Actually it was Domingo who JT3 chose to take over Hart but it doesn't look good either way.. |
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GUMBA
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 737
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Post by GUMBA on Jan 24, 2017 18:40:11 GMT -5
The Post's DC Sports Blog Atlantic 11 poll now has the Hoyas ranked 7th among area teams behind 11-8 Richmond. Oh how our mighty Hoyas have fallen.
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I watched that kid sit behind Hoyas bench at just about every home game. Freely admit that much of recruiting is a crapshoot, but that's a recruiting miscalculation that just haunts us, and may in fact have been the beginning of the end for JT3. We will see.