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Post by FrazierFanatic on Jan 9, 2017 16:11:20 GMT -5
A show of hands from those of you around the table who will take the "high road" and give back a portion of their salary:  Such arguments are not well founded because they make an assumption that a winning record is the measurement of a coach at Georgetown within the University. As noted before, it isn't and there are many examples of this. Those are not the terms of this agreement and won't be going forward. Beyond which, if III ever gave back money, Big John would disown him, clearing the way for his departure. I seem to recall Bi John saying the only color he cared about was green... Did Bi John have anything to do with the design of the pink sneakers? |
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Jan 9, 2017 16:14:01 GMT -5
But this coach already accomplished those things. The difference is that I think that should give him considerable job security, and you do not. But those are accomplishments few coaches achieve. We have a coach who has done that and many so-called fans want to run him out. That is amazing to me, but I will simply respectfully agree to disagree. Like it or not, it's a What Have You Done For Me Lately profession. His accomplishments occurred when George W. was present. Each solid big east season since has been capped with a humiliating NCAA tourney loss (save for Utah), which nullifies the regular season. Sorry, but that's how this works. So we are rewarding him for accomplishments that are a decade old. It's not logical. So what you are really saying is that our season will turn around on Jan. 20 when we have another Republican in the White House. |
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hoyajinx
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,683 
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Post by hoyajinx on Jan 9, 2017 16:14:49 GMT -5
I'm almost certain we've been down this road on more than one occasion. Can we just circle back on the discussion a couple dozen pages back and couple dozen before that for all the same arguments. If this argument were a coach, it would be one of the retreads we would be afraid to hire.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 23,604
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Post by prhoya on Jan 9, 2017 16:15:59 GMT -5
This is getting silly now. I have no idea what you do prhoya, but my feeling is that if you were leaving your job and owed a substantial sum of money you would not just give it back to your employer. And what type of amendment do you suggest? Negotiate a lower salary, and then dismiss him? Even if he did renegotiate (and I wouldn't), any sensible person would negotiate a clause stating that if he was dismissed the original terms kicked in. There's no reason to give up money if you're going to get canned anyway. David Falk is III's agent. He's not renegotiating or giving anything back. You can throw "reasonable" out the window. |
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smokeyjack
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,313
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Post by smokeyjack on Jan 9, 2017 16:29:10 GMT -5
Let's just permanently retire two concepts here:
1. JT3 is not giving back a dime, nor should he feel remotely compelled to do so. As was stated multiple times, we both signed a contract based on expected value. It's exceedingly rare that these things ever work out equally well for both sides. In this case, unfortunately, GU came out well on the short side. C'est la vie. I don't know exactly where the value prop line would be drawn, but had he taken us to another Final Four, won a BET title and posted a .500 record in the postseason after 2008, we would likely all agree he was worth every penny. In my opinion, he hasn't been close. But Alford is a rare bird indeed. That's not happening with anyone related to JTJr.
2. Winning is absolutely part of the expectation for the men's basketball coach at GU. What level of on-court success is expected? That's blurry and as stated earlier rarely if ever stated in any coaching contract. But to claim winning isn't part of the formula is insanity.
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Post by FrazierFanatic on Jan 9, 2017 16:39:36 GMT -5
Let's just permanently retire two concepts here: 1. JT3 is not giving back a dime, nor should he feel remotely compelled to do so. As was stated multiple times, we both signed a contract based on expected value. It's exceedingly rare that these things ever work out equally well for both sides. In this case, unfortunately, GU came out well on the short side. C'est la vie. I don't know exactly where the value prop line would be drawn, but had he taken us to another Final Four, won a BET title and posted a .500 record in the postseason after 2008, we would likely all agree he was worth every penny. In my opinion, he hasn't been close. But Alford is a rare bird indeed. That's not happening with anyone related to JTJr. 2. Winning is absolutely part of the expectation for the men's basketball coach at GU. What level of on-court success is expected? That's blurry and as stated earlier rarely if ever stated in any coaching contract. But to claim winning isn't part of the formula is insanity. 100% accurate on both points. |
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gunny
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 561
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Post by gunny on Jan 9, 2017 16:49:40 GMT -5
Like it or not, it's a What Have You Done For Me Lately profession. His accomplishments occurred when George W. was present. Each solid big east season since has been capped with a humiliating NCAA tourney loss (save for Utah), which nullifies the regular season. Sorry, but that's how this works. So we are rewarding him for accomplishments that are a decade old. It's not logical. So what you are really saying is that our season will turn around on Jan. 20 when we have another Republican in the White House. Make Georgetown great again? |
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tashoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,681
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Post by tashoya on Jan 9, 2017 19:38:15 GMT -5
Partially true I'm sure. Coming off a Final Four, being the son of the man who made the Georgetown program a nationally recognized thing, there was/is actual value to JT3 being a Thompson. His lineage is worth more to Georgetown than it would be to any other school in the world. I would bet that the majority would say that lineage is now holding th university back. As we've said before, both parties have received many blessings for being associated with one another. But, if it's not working, it may be time to part ways. You are probably right. I meant when he signed his initial deal after the FF and, arguably, the one after that. |
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 6,665
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Post by guru on Jan 9, 2017 23:07:03 GMT -5
With the blowout win tonight, JT3 is now earning $333,333.33 per win this season.
If we win the rest of our regular season games, that number drops to $130,434.78 per win this season — which, I think we'd all agree, would be quite the bargain.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Jan 9, 2017 23:16:27 GMT -5
With the blowout win tonight, JT3 is now earning $333,333.33 per win this season. If we win the rest of our regular season games, that number drops to $130,434.78 per win this season — which, I think we'd all agree, would be quite the bargain. We get it. You're obsessed with his legally binding contract that doesn't fluctuate for any reason, wins and losses included. Since you clearly have time on your hands, if you still have that calculator handy, what does JT3's current salary equate to in 2007 dollars? I know that it's pointless information to have but I'm curious and you started it. |
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LCPolo18
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by LCPolo18 on Jan 10, 2017 1:19:42 GMT -5
With the blowout win tonight, JT3 is now earning $333,333.33 per win this season. If we win the rest of our regular season games, that number drops to $130,434.78 per win this season — which, I think we'd all agree, would be quite the bargain. During his tenure at Georgetown, JT3 is now averaging approximately $100,000 for each of his 273 wins over the last 12.5 seasons (approximately 22 wins per season). |
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 10, 2017 6:51:33 GMT -5
With the blowout win tonight, JT3 is now earning $333,333.33 per win this season. If we win the rest of our regular season games, that number drops to $130,434.78 per win this season — which, I think we'd all agree, would be quite the bargain. We get it. You're obsessed with his legally binding contract that doesn't fluctuate for any reason, wins and losses included. Since you clearly have time on your hands, if you still have that calculator handy, what does JT3's current salary equate to in 2007 dollars? I know that it's pointless information to have but I'm curious and you started it. $333,333 per win would equal $286,360 per win in 2007 dollars. $130,434 per win would equal $112,053 per win in 2007 dollars. www.usinflationcalculator.com/ |
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Jan 10, 2017 7:14:58 GMT -5
We get it. You're obsessed with his legally binding contract that doesn't fluctuate for any reason, wins and losses included. Since you clearly have time on your hands, if you still have that calculator handy, what does JT3's current salary equate to in 2007 dollars? I know that it's pointless information to have but I'm curious and you started it. $333,333 per win would equal $286,360 per win in 2007 dollars. $130,434 per win would equal $112,053 per win in 2007 dollars. www.usinflationcalculator.com/Nice job if you can get it... and keep it no matter what... |
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IDenj
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by IDenj on Jan 10, 2017 7:16:24 GMT -5
I can't believe coaches contract has become part of the discussion. Especially thinking he should return part of his salary.
I thought we were Georgetown fans.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Jan 10, 2017 7:21:43 GMT -5
I can't believe coaches contract has become part of the discussion. Especially thinking he should return part of his salary. I thought we were Georgetown fans. This "return part of his salary" keeps coming up. I haven't read it, but I was away. Did someone even mentioned it? |
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Filo
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Post by Filo on Jan 10, 2017 9:05:05 GMT -5
I can't believe coaches contract has become part of the discussion. Especially thinking he should return part of his salary. I thought we were Georgetown fans. This "return part of his salary" keeps coming up. I haven't read it, but I was away. Did someone even mentioned it?
Yeah, I don't know who would gave said anything about it and how this keeps coming up... I followed this trail but i just don't see it.  Steve Alford at UCLA "gave back" his extension last year after missing the NCAAs Because Steve Alford did it, would you? Because Steve Alford did it, would you? A good, reasonable person/gentleman probably would. |
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blueandgray
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by blueandgray on Jan 10, 2017 9:25:34 GMT -5
I honestly could care less about his salary. The university made a business judgment, signed him to a contract that they thought was fair at the time, end of story. Jt3 has shown up, worked hard, and has struggled to get results. That's it. If anything, we should be calling for the administration to give back part of their salary for making the commitment to begin with....but that argument is just as ridiculous.
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prhoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by prhoya on Jan 10, 2017 9:53:57 GMT -5
This "return part of his salary" keeps coming up. I haven't read it, but I was away. Did someone even mentioned it? Yeah, I don't know who would gave said anything about it and how this keeps coming up... I followed this trail but i just don't see it. Because Steve Alford did it, would you? A good, reasonable person/gentleman probably would. It's easy to say this when you're not the one giving the money back. I wasn't talking about giving money back. He shouldn't do that. What I meant is not taking more, nevermind the extension of his contract. Filo, don't show all your feathers... |
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guru
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by guru on Jan 10, 2017 10:30:15 GMT -5
I honestly could care less about his salary. The university made a business judgment, signed him to a contract that they thought was fair at the time, end of story. Jt3 has shown up, worked hard, and has struggled to get results. That's it. If anything, we should be calling for the administration to give back part of their salary for making the commitment to begin with....but that argument is just as ridiculous. The idea that he should give money back to the University is absurd. He works hard, he's just not that good at his job. My only point in posting the snarky stat about wins per game was to point out that he is wildly overpaid, which is Georgetown's fault. It's part of the overall mismanagement of this program that has placed it in its current position. Having said all that - and with the enormous caveat that it came against St. John's - I think the team showed signs of life yesterday, especially at the point guard position. If the rest of this season only serves to groom Mosely as a competent lead guard, at least we get something out of it. I like that kid. |
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Post by HometownHoya on Jan 10, 2017 10:33:06 GMT -5
I can't believe coaches contract has become part of the discussion. Especially thinking he should return part of his salary. I thought we were Georgetown fans. This "return part of his salary" keeps coming up. I haven't read it, but I was away. Did someone even mentioned it? I had mentioned a move like that could regain good will if this season ended up unsuccessful, thinking back to the Steve Alford move. Clearly it must be an idiotic proposition from the responses. It was a small quip in a post that began the point that contracts are based on past performance so current performance has no affect on how JT3 is being compensated. hoyatalk2.proboards.com/post/710463/threadhoyatalk2.proboards.com/post/710490/thread |
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