hoya9797
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Post by hoya9797 on Mar 4, 2011 15:01:20 GMT -5
Yeah, it's Real refreshing when 90% of the student there also break the honor code but don't get punished like this guy. The LDS Church is simply trying to make an example out of this kid. It's obviously working. Tell me you have data to back up your 90% figure. Yeah, that seems low.
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DFW HOYA
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Post by DFW HOYA on Mar 4, 2011 15:13:00 GMT -5
Yeah, it's Real refreshing when 90% of the student there also break the honor code but don't get punished like this guy. The LDS Church is simply trying to make an example out of this kid. It's obviously working. Georgetown students and/or alumni probably have very little awareness of LDS practices, but rest assured 90% of students are not at risk here. 98% of the 32,000 students at BYU are LDS. They not only take the Honor Code seriously but work hard to support it--it is something that is considered a positive and not a punitive measure. In addition, LDS students at BYU have to be nominated by a local bishop as a prerequisite for admission, so the faith community takes these issues seriously. Athletes know very well what is expected of them. If students are at BYU they buy into it--if not, they probably went to Utah instead. Also, realize that life at BYU is a six year process, not four: undergraduate years interrupted by the two year mission. There are a larger number of BYU students that are married as upperclassmen, usually after the mission, and separate living environments exist for this.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Mar 4, 2011 15:22:05 GMT -5
DFW seems to be right, with most students trying to live up to the Honor Code at BYU. The difference, of course, is that if they fail, they usually don't get publicly & quickly punished like Davies did. Then again, it doesn't do BYU any good to punish a regular student to demonstrate how much moral they are then everyone else: deadspin.com/#!5775738/a-byu-grad-on-brandon-davies-sex-and-the-universitys-double-standard
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FormerHoya
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Post by FormerHoya on Mar 4, 2011 15:30:27 GMT -5
Why do you have to take two mormons fishing?
Because if you just take one, he'll drink all your beer.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Mar 4, 2011 17:35:23 GMT -5
Yeah, it's Real refreshing when 90% of the student there also break the honor code but don't get punished like this guy. The LDS Church is simply trying to make an example out of this kid. It's obviously working. Tell me you have data to back up your 90% figure. Yup, there's empirical evidence to show the exact number of BYU students that violate honor code. Sorry, I only live here and know people that go there. I'm sorry I don't have a double-blind, published study to back up my numbers. The larger point is that the church/university is making an example out of this kid for their own benefit. Why did he have to be suspended for the rest of the season? A violation is a violation, but why such a harsh punishment? Especially when many other students also violate the honor code and receive much lighter punishments (or no punishment at all). The Church would mush rather have all this good publicity than have a run to the Elite Eight. The basketball team (and everything else at BYU) is merely a tool to expand the church's mission. The LDS church couldn't pay enough money to get all the great publicity that they've received this week. They're thrilled to have everyone from ESPN to Jim Rome talking about how great their honor code is. I have nothing against the honor code. My problem is the disproportionate response to this one incident.
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bmartin
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Post by bmartin on Mar 4, 2011 17:35:40 GMT -5
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Mar 4, 2011 17:39:55 GMT -5
Yeah, it's Real refreshing when 90% of the student there also break the honor code but don't get punished like this guy. The LDS Church is simply trying to make an example out of this kid. It's obviously working. Georgetown students and/or alumni probably have very little awareness of LDS practices, but rest assured 90% of students are not at risk here. 98% of the 32,000 students at BYU are LDS. They not only take the Honor Code seriously but work hard to support it--it is something that is considered a positive and not a punitive measure. In addition, LDS students at BYU have to be nominated by a local bishop as a prerequisite for admission, so the faith community takes these issues seriously. Athletes know very well what is expected of them. If students are at BYU they buy into it--if not, they probably went to Utah instead. Also, realize that life at BYU is a six year process, not four: undergraduate years interrupted by the two year mission. There are a larger number of BYU students that are married as upperclassmen, usually after the mission, and separate living environments exist for this. Very much the picture that BYU wants the rest of the country to see. In practice, it's not quite the same. Also, ask Jimmer, Jim McMahon and Steve Young how their missions went.
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Mar 5, 2011 3:06:10 GMT -5
I don't want to cloud the issue here, but I do think I need to make a couple of points.
I have no problem with those who are convicted in their beliefs. I also think that for whatever reason, many of those whose religious beliefs more closely mirror many of the traditional Judeo-Christian teachings are almost ridiculed in today's American society -- often under the misplaced guise of "separation of church and state." That being said, it's obvious that our ... or anyone else's personal beliefs on matters of faith will vary widely. Tolerance is a fundamental principle of our society. So tolerance of those who are more "liberal" should be equal to tolerance to those whose views seem radically conservative to us. And if an institution uniformly leans to what we view as a radical extreme, then we really shouldn't have any issue at all. But because of our almost instinctual tendency to accept those of different views, it strikes us as wrong when others are punished for exercising those very individual rights to express and act on such beliefs. But I do think that ignores the point of the original devout beliefs. I think that is the distinction that Tbird and KC make in different ways. And as much as I think the Davies kid got too harsh of a punishment, it's still important to recognize that he made up his own mind, both in choosing BYU as well as in acting as he wished. There really isn't an ideological "solution" to this issue in my mind.
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Mar 5, 2011 8:01:57 GMT -5
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Mar 5, 2011 9:36:54 GMT -5
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DanMcQ
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Post by DanMcQ on Mar 5, 2011 10:52:45 GMT -5
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hifigator
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Post by hifigator on Mar 7, 2011 16:45:28 GMT -5
DFW wrote:
There are a larger number of BYU students that are married as upperclassmen, usually after the mission, and separate living environments exist for this.
Do they let you have sex at that point?
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Mar 7, 2011 16:56:35 GMT -5
DFW wrote: There are a larger number of BYU students that are married as upperclassmen, usually after the mission, and separate living environments exist for this.Do they let you have sex at that point? Missionary.
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tashoya
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Post by tashoya on Mar 7, 2011 21:36:26 GMT -5
Nicely played kc. Will I ever outgrow juvenile humor? I certainly hope not cuz that's just funny.
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TBird41
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Post by TBird41 on Apr 13, 2011 14:22:35 GMT -5
Deadspin just released an investigative report on BYU & their honor code deadspin.com/#!5791461/the-truth-about-race-religion-and-the-honor-code-at-byu Really doesn't make BYU look good
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Apr 13, 2011 16:13:43 GMT -5
Deadspin just released an investigative report on BYU & their honor code deadspin.com/#!5791461/the-truth-about-race-religion-and-the-honor-code-at-byu Really doesn't make BYU look good It exposes them for the hypocritical frauds they are.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 13, 2011 16:26:50 GMT -5
Deadspin just released an investigative report on BYU & their honor code deadspin.com/#!5791461/the-truth-about-race-religion-and-the-honor-code-at-byu Really doesn't make BYU look good It exposes them for the hypocritical frauds they are. Predictably, talk radio here in Salt Lake City is blowing up. Very amusing.
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hoyainspirit
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Post by hoyainspirit on Apr 13, 2011 16:43:29 GMT -5
It exposes them for the hypocritical frauds they are. Predictably, talk radio here in Salt Lake City is blowing up. Very amusing. Is it a station with an internet stream? If so, what is it?
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Apr 13, 2011 19:27:49 GMT -5
"They" need to be shown the error of "their" ways so "they" can live a righteous life like the rest of us. Really not good.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Apr 15, 2011 11:35:03 GMT -5
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