Hoyas 70 Louisville 60 Game Discussion

[rustyshackleford]

I'm interested in seeing how our newer, tougher version of Greg does against Samardo and their front line. I think that's what held him back from putting down dominating performances on Samuels in the past but I think that's changed.

Aside from Delk and Sosa their guards are very inefficient and we need to let them shoot/put more pressure on Samuels. Everybody knows Sosa's game as well - streaky and a poor decision maker. Playing smart defense where we don't have our big man flashing out should be enough to put us in a position to win as long as julian and greg bring their hard hats.

[westendhoya]

As down as I am about the last 2 weeks, I think this is a game where we come in and stomp them. Lou. is not good at all and better yet I think they are a good matchup for us. Crowd will probbaly keep it close though but we should pull away late.

[RDF]

What is with the arrogance of Hoya fanbase? Louisville "is not good at all"? Really? I watched them beat Syracuse in Carrier Dome which is something Georgetown hasn't done in III's entire tenure.

It's ridiculous how arrogant this fanbase is in regards to how they view Georgetown and their "placement". We see RPI, Ken Pomeroy's fantasy Factory, Joe Lunardi's Never Never Land, as reasons to "value" the placement of the Hoyas. I've got one for you--WIN SOME GAMES WHEN YOU ARE ON THE COURT!!! A top 10 team doesn't have to get "motivated" to play a game. A contending team doesn't take anyone for granted because they realize they are trying to improve each game and that is motivation enough.

Oh but never fear--a loss at Louisville makes Georgetown a .500 team in it's last 14 games but they are still "a lock" to make the NCAA's--even though they aren't a lock to be a friggin .500 Big East team.

[guru]

Feb 19, 2010 13:01:21 GMT -5 RDF said:

What is with the arrogance of Hoya fanbase? Louisville "is not good at all"? Really? I watched them beat Syracuse in Carrier Dome which is something Georgetown hasn't done in III's entire tenure.

It's ridiculous how arrogant this fanbase is in regards to how they view Georgetown and their "placement". We see RPI, Ken Pomeroy's fantasy Factory, Joe Lunardi's Never Never Land, as reasons to "value" the placement of the Hoyas. I've got one for you--WIN SOME GAMES WHEN YOU ARE ON THE COURT!!! A top 10 team doesn't have to get "motivated" to play a game. A contending team doesn't take anyone for granted because they realize they are trying to improve each game and that is motivation enough.

Oh but never fear--a loss at Louisville makes Georgetown a .500 team in it's last 14 games but they are still "a lock" to make the NCAA's--even though they aren't a lock to be a friggin .500 Big East team.

If we play a full game, we should beat Louisville. But when was the last time we played a full game?

As for our "lock" status, I'm not convinced until we get two more conference wins. If we fail to do that, which seems very possible given the recent results, then we go into the Big East Tournament squarely on the bubble. Who would have thought that a month ago? Not me.

[rustyshackleford]

Feb 19, 2010 13:07:11 GMT -5 guru said:

Feb 19, 2010 13:01:21 GMT -5 RDF said:

What is with the arrogance of Hoya fanbase? Louisville "is not good at all"? Really? I watched them beat Syracuse in Carrier Dome which is something Georgetown hasn't done in III's entire tenure.

It's ridiculous how arrogant this fanbase is in regards to how they view Georgetown and their "placement". We see RPI, Ken Pomeroy's fantasy Factory, Joe Lunardi's Never Never Land, as reasons to "value" the placement of the Hoyas. I've got one for you--WIN SOME GAMES WHEN YOU ARE ON THE COURT!!! A top 10 team doesn't have to get "motivated" to play a game. A contending team doesn't take anyone for granted because they realize they are trying to improve each game and that is motivation enough.

Oh but never fear--a loss at Louisville makes Georgetown a .500 team in it's last 14 games but they are still "a lock" to make the NCAA's--even though they aren't a lock to be a friggin .500 Big East team.

If we play a full game, we should beat Louisville. But when was the last time we played a full game?

As for our "lock" status, I'm not convinced until we get two more conference wins. If we fail to do that, which seems very possible given the recent results, then we go into the Big East Tournament squarely on the bubble. Who would have thought that a month ago? Not me.

Even if we win just one game and that game is in the BE tourney we're in. Our strength of schedule and good wins are too numerous for us to not be at worst an arkansas/arizona analogue in terms of a high loss/ strong strength of schedule tourney entry.

[MassHoya]

As JT III says, this team could win every game or could lose every game in the BE. The Hoyas should be rested though and L'ville plays on Saturday. The team does respond to the challenge of a big game and this has become just that. I like their chances.

[RDF]

Feb 19, 2010 14:53:37 GMT -5 MassHoya said:

As JT III says, this team could win every game or could lose every game in the BE. The Hoyas should be rested though and L'ville plays on Saturday. The team does respond to the challenge of a big game and this has become just that. I like their chances.

Wasn't last night a big game? You know against the biggest rival this program has in the conference? Guess I thought it was a big game--and a challenge but the team only thought the last 10 minutes out of an entire 40 mattered--or maybe they wanted more of a challenge.

It's obvious that a lot of these guys could give a crap about basketball and I could really give a crap about how hurt they'll be when they miss the tournament. It takes an entire team focused on one goal to achieve it--and while there are a few that really care (Freeman and Wright)--too many don't or don't care to understand the importance of winning.

[FrazierFanatic]

RDF - most of us are hurting after last night, incredibly frustrated and disappointed with where this team has been heaqding the last 10 days. But if all you want to do is spew venom inpost after post after post, might I suggest that you take a sabbatical for the next few weeks, then come back next season and see where everything stands? Might save us all some reading time and you some blood pressure points.

[DanMcQ]

Feb 19, 2010 15:24:16 GMT -5 RDF said:

It's obvious that a lot of these guys could give a crap about basketball and I could really give a crap about how hurt they'll be when they miss the tournament. It takes an entire team focused on one goal to achieve it--and while there are a few that really care (Freeman and Wright)--too many don't or don't care to understand the importance of winning.

This is about as on target as the post that a kid who turned out to have the flu was an "immature player" because he looked like he was pouting a couple times when he was subbed out of the Rutgers game.

Did you get on the phone with the players from Minnesota to ask them if they gave a crap? Or are they telepathically transmitting their lack of care about the season to you? Be upset about a loss and how they lost - fine. The rest of it is unfair criticism of the players.

[CAHoya07]

Every game from here on out is the most important game of the season. All four are at least in the mix for the NCAA Tournament.

After the last two losses, I can't say I'm all that confident going into Louisville. However, we CAN definitely beat them, if we can be focused for a full 40 minutes. It took them 2 OT's to defeat a Harangody-less Notre Dame team, and they were getting beat off the dribble pretty badly. I think we have a good chance, we just have to sack up on the road.

Although the last two losses have definitely hurt our seeding, I think we are still in good shape for the NCAA Tournament. I bet you we will still be ranked in the top 15 next week, and we'll be a projected four seed. Here's how I see it playing out (without taking into play Big East tournament, at this point):

12-6: 2 or 3 seed
11-7: 4 or 5 seed
10-8: 5 or 6 seed
9-9: 7 or 8 seed
8-10: don't even want to think about it...

I'll disappointed if we end up worse than a 6-seed. But as Dan said, one game at a time... beat Louisville.

[SFHoya99]

Feb 19, 2010 13:01:21 GMT -5 RDF said:

What is with the arrogance of Hoya fanbase? Louisville "is not good at all"?

Hmm, way to apply a few posts to thousands of people, RDF.

I'm a Kenpom fanboy, and I think Louisville is plenty good. It's a road game, against a good team, with a vastly improved Samardo Samuels.

And while they've been inconsistent because their guards have been inconsistent, our defense has had a tendency to make inconsistent players consistently good.

I don't see us winning at WVU. We must beat Cincy and Notre Dame at home or I'm going to go ballistic (though neither is a gimme, of course).

So Louisville is our best pre-BE tourney chance at another good win. To get any of its momentum back, this team needs to finish 3-1 (and I only say that because 4-0 seems so darn unlikely).

[GIGAFAN99]

What's already killing me about this game is I'm sitting here thinking how effectively we could press this team and how I know it will absolutely never happen. I still have no idea why, I just know it won't.

So I don't know what to think here. Might come down to Monroe v Samuels: who fouls out last.

[RDF]

Feb 19, 2010 16:25:51 GMT -5 DanMcQ said:

Feb 19, 2010 15:24:16 GMT -5 RDF said:

It's obvious that a lot of these guys could give a crap about basketball and I could really give a crap about how hurt they'll be when they miss the tournament. It takes an entire team focused on one goal to achieve it--and while there are a few that really care (Freeman and Wright)--too many don't or don't care to understand the importance of winning.

This is about as on target as the post that a kid who turned out to have the flu was an "immature player" because he looked like he was pouting a couple times when he was subbed out of the Rutgers game.

Did you get on the phone with the players from Minnesota to ask them if they gave a crap? Or are they telepathically transmitting their lack of care about the season to you? Be upset about a loss and how they lost - fine. The rest of it is unfair criticism of the players.

Oh get off it Dan--way to take your personal dislike of me and apply it to something you obviously cannot understand. It's called reading--as in what these guys SAY--from THEIR MOUTH--not my words after defeat. Then you apply their attitude, watch them play on the court--and it's not hard to see who is committed to competing and who has their thoughts elsewhere. For instance--did you see Hollis Thompson last night? That look like a kid who was into the game/ready to play? Julian Vaughn was intimidated and didn't compete at all--and that's what I ask for as a fan--competition and people who care. When you are scared--dont' waste your coach/teammate's time--just make up an excuse and don't play because you are not going to help.

Failure is fine-but being afraid to fail is worthless. I saw far too much of that--and as I said a year ago after WVU game--and have said after the USF game this year--this team is going downhill and where have I been proven wrong? If I can see this from MPLS and the people in charge in DC can't see it--what does that say about them? I don't get millions to run this program--and it doesn't take much to see what the problem is--attitude or lack of one. Mistakes that are happening are type that should be corrected by this time of year and any talk of "not being up for an opponent" is inexcusable and reason to recruit over someone or bench them. If you can't get as excited to play an opposing team as you do to act like a male cheerleader in Mid October-then maybe you are doing the wrong thing on gamedays.

When players are saying "we don't take this team as seriously....." or "We don't get up for this game...." and the way they came out last night--who in their right mind would support that as having a team of players "ready to play"? I must have been alone in seeing:

1. Players not ready to catch a simple pass
2. Players not knowing where they were on court
3. Players avoiding contact/playing scared of Syracuse
4. Players slumping their shoulders simply due to opponent making a shot
5. Players walking around while other team is running their ass off the court

The proof is on video if you'd like to view that nonsense again. 30 minutes of horse****, scared basketball and then 10 of competing. Then you come here and other sites and see people led by the head coach CELEBRATING the "comeback". You should be ashamed of only giving 10 hard minutes out of 40--not lauded for it. Getting beat happens--but not playing hard until you are humiliated is not to be tolerated at the level Georgetown says they aspire to compete at. This is a business and if you don't want to compete--the coach needs to find someone who will and I don't give a damn who the player is--they need to sit or be gone if they can't get motivated to play. What the hell is the point of pursuing the sport if you don't enjoy competing against other players? U like wearing a uniform--then go buy one like fans do.

As for the comment about insulting fans--if it doesn't apply to you-then nothing to worry about right? I've been on every Hoya site and the lack of respect for opponents is insane. The games they see as "wins" are a joke. Hell--I almost forgot that Georgetown was a combined 0-5 against the remaining opposition last year with the talk around here. Better warn the team--because we know they can't get motivated for certain teams. What a joke.

[Buckets]

Feb 18, 2010 23:23:46 GMT -5 bronxhoya87 said:

Let me save you the trouble of watching the game. We lose by 8-13.

Anyone who claims to have any idea how this team is going to perform next game is lying.

I'll perhaps get killed for saying this, but the double bye is still within reach. West Virginia still has to go to Villanova.

Last night sucked but left me strangely optimistic.

Louisville is 6-1 in home conference games this year. If the guys who played the last ten minutes against Syracuse show up, we win. If the guys who played the first thirty show up... let's just hope they don't.

[hoya81]

Feb 19, 2010 17:53:45 GMT -5 RDF said:

Feb 19, 2010 16:25:51 GMT -5 DanMcQ said:

This is about as on target as the post that a kid who turned out to have the flu was an "immature player" because he looked like he was pouting a couple times when he was subbed out of the Rutgers game.

Did you get on the phone with the players from Minnesota to ask them if they gave a crap? Or are they telepathically transmitting their lack of care about the season to you? Be upset about a loss and how they lost - fine. The rest of it is unfair criticism of the players.

Oh get off it Dan--way to take your personal dislike of me and apply it to something you obviously cannot understand. It's called reading--as in what these guys SAY--from THEIR MOUTH--not my words after defeat. Then you apply their attitude, watch them play on the court--and it's not hard to see who is committed to competing and who has their thoughts elsewhere. For instance--did you see Hollis Thompson last night? That look like a kid who was into the game/ready to play? Julian Vaughn was intimidated and didn't compete at all--and that's what I ask for as a fan--competition and people who care. When you are scared--dont' waste your coach/teammate's time--just make up an excuse and don't play because you are not going to help.

Failure is fine-but being afraid to fail is worthless. I saw far too much of that--and as I said a year ago after WVU game--and have said after the USF game this year--this team is going downhill and where have I been proven wrong? If I can see this from MPLS and the people in charge in DC can't see it--what does that say about them? I don't get millions to run this program--and it doesn't take much to see what the problem is--attitude or lack of one. Mistakes that are happening are type that should be corrected by this time of year and any talk of "not being up for an opponent" is inexcusable and reason to recruit over someone or bench them. If you can't get as excited to play an opposing team as you do to act like a male cheerleader in Mid October-then maybe you are doing the wrong thing on gamedays.

When players are saying "we don't take this team as seriously....." or "We don't get up for this game...." and the way they came out last night--who in their right mind would support that as having a team of players "ready to play"? I must have been alone in seeing:

1. Players not ready to catch a simple pass
2. Players not knowing where they were on court
3. Players avoiding contact/playing scared of Syracuse
4. Players slumping their shoulders simply due to opponent making a shot
5. Players walking around while other team is running their ass off the court

The proof is on video if you'd like to view that nonsense again. 30 minutes of horse****, scared basketball and then 10 of competing. Then you come here and other sites and see people led by the head coach CELEBRATING the "comeback". You should be ashamed of only giving 10 hard minutes out of 40--not lauded for it. Getting beat happens--but not playing hard until you are humiliated is not to be tolerated at the level Georgetown says they aspire to compete at. This is a business and if you don't want to compete--the coach needs to find someone who will and I don't give a damn who the player is--they need to sit or be gone if they can't get motivated to play. What the hell is the point of pursuing the sport if you don't enjoy competing against other players? U like wearing a uniform--then go buy one like fans do.

As for the comment about insulting fans--if it doesn't apply to you-then nothing to worry about right? I've been on every Hoya site and the lack of respect for opponents is insane. The games they see as "wins" are a joke. Hell--I almost forgot that Georgetown was a combined 0-5 against the remaining opposition last year with the talk around here. Better warn the team--because we know they can't get motivated for certain teams. What a joke.

[hoya81]

Then wouldn't you be happier picking another team to root for? Really, man, much to be disappointed about last night. But unless you have a relationship with the players that involves greater familiarity with them than just watching them play, you don't have much credibility as a judge of their character. they played a better team. they got rattled. they figured it out, too late, sadly, but they did all they could to figh back. relax, dude. it is a game, after all.

[guru]

Feb 19, 2010 21:10:16 GMT -5 hoya81 said:

Then wouldn't you be happier picking another team to root for? Really, man, much to be disappointed about last night. But unless you have a relationship with the players that involves greater familiarity with them than just watching them play, you don't have much credibility as a judge of their character. they played a better team. they got rattled. they figured it out, too late, sadly, but they did all they could to figh back. relax, dude. it is a game, after all.

Uh Oh. I sense another RDF "Milkshakes and orange slices for all" manifesto coming

[hoya73]

To get to the ostensible topic of this thread:

Besides the Monroe-Samuels matchup, I'll be looking at two things in Tuesday's game:

1. Do we effectively attack Lousiville's press, not just get the ball over half court, but attack to score when pressed.

2. Do we keep from getting burned by a hot 3-point shooter, like Cubillan was in the Marquette game. If Jerry Smith or someone hits an early three, we need to guard him closely before he strings together 3 or 4 made threes.

[hoya73]

What I'd like to see on attacking the press;

Back dribble with 2 perimeter players trying to be available for a diagonal pass in the backcourt, to then be relayed to Greg over halfcourt in the center of the floor. Then, with Greg as decision maker, the perimeter guy who didn't get the first diagonal pass cuts hard to the rim. Vaughan sets pick on whoever's guarding Greg, giving Greg the option of driving to the basket or passing to the cutter. Vaughan rolls to basket as third option or as offensive rebounder.

What I've seen too much of this year: diagonal pass to a perimeter player just over halfcourt where he can be effectively trapped with the halfcourt line as a 3rd defender.

[DanMcQ]

Feb 19, 2010 17:53:45 GMT -5 RDF said:

Feb 19, 2010 16:25:51 GMT -5 DanMcQ said:

This is about as on target as the post that a kid who turned out to have the flu was an "immature player" because he looked like he was pouting a couple times when he was subbed out of the Rutgers game.

Did you get on the phone with the players from Minnesota to ask them if they gave a crap? Or are they telepathically transmitting their lack of care about the season to you? Be upset about a loss and how they lost - fine. The rest of it is unfair criticism of the players.

Oh get off it Dan--way to take your personal dislike of me and apply it to something you obviously cannot understand. It's called reading--as in what these guys SAY--from THEIR MOUTH--not my words after defeat. Then you apply their attitude, watch them play on the court--and it's not hard to see who is committed to competing and who has their thoughts elsewhere. For instance--did you see Hollis Thompson last night? That look like a kid who was into the game/ready to play? Julian Vaughn was intimidated and didn't compete at all--and that's what I ask for as a fan--competition and people who care. When you are scared--dont' waste your coach/teammate's time--just make up an excuse and don't play because you are not going to help.

Failure is fine-but being afraid to fail is worthless. I saw far too much of that--and as I said a year ago after WVU game--and have said after the USF game this year--this team is going downhill and where have I been proven wrong? If I can see this from MPLS and the people in charge in DC can't see it--what does that say about them? I don't get millions to run this program--and it doesn't take much to see what the problem is--attitude or lack of one. Mistakes that are happening are type that should be corrected by this time of year and any talk of "not being up for an opponent" is inexcusable and reason to recruit over someone or bench them. If you can't get as excited to play an opposing team as you do to act like a male cheerleader in Mid October-then maybe you are doing the wrong thing on gamedays.

When players are saying "we don't take this team as seriously....." or "We don't get up for this game...." and the way they came out last night--who in their right mind would support that as having a team of players "ready to play"? I must have been alone in seeing:

1. Players not ready to catch a simple pass
2. Players not knowing where they were on court
3. Players avoiding contact/playing scared of Syracuse
4. Players slumping their shoulders simply due to opponent making a shot
5. Players walking around while other team is running their ass off the court

The proof is on video if you'd like to view that nonsense again. 30 minutes of horse****, scared basketball and then 10 of competing. Then you come here and other sites and see people led by the head coach CELEBRATING the "comeback". You should be ashamed of only giving 10 hard minutes out of 40--not lauded for it. Getting beat happens--but not playing hard until you are humiliated is not to be tolerated at the level Georgetown says they aspire to compete at. This is a business and if you don't want to compete--the coach needs to find someone who will and I don't give a damn who the player is--they need to sit or be gone if they can't get motivated to play. What the hell is the point of pursuing the sport if you don't enjoy competing against other players? U like wearing a uniform--then go buy one like fans do.

As for the comment about insulting fans--if it doesn't apply to you-then nothing to worry about right? I've been on every Hoya site and the lack of respect for opponents is insane. The games they see as "wins" are a joke. Hell--I almost forgot that Georgetown was a combined 0-5 against the remaining opposition last year with the talk around here. Better warn the team--because we know they can't get motivated for certain teams. What a joke.

Personal dislike for you? I call you out for crapping all over the players' motivation which apparently only YOU can accurately divine from watching them on TV and this is your response? I know and speak with several people who see the players on a daily basis and you know what? You're wrong - they ARE motivated, they DO care, and they ARE trying hard. Sometimes it doesn't turn out the way we and they would like and often it's because the team they are playing is the number 5 team in the country and/or just better than they are on that night.

Your recent posts sound a lot like someone who has an axe to grind against the program, not a supporter of it. Who are you to question the coach of the program and how he chooses to run HIS program and support HIS players in public? These guys are 18, 19 and 20 year old college students giving their best. If you think you can determine their motivation simply from watching them on TV and reading a couple of postgame quotes, then you are not nearly as smart as you portray yourself in your condescending posts. I've got news for you: you don't have a monopoly on disappointment when the Hoyas lose.

I made no comment about you insulting fans, but hey, congratulations on posting on multiple Hoya fora across the internet. You might try having some simple respect for people before you judge them in a public forum - it might get you farther.