Boz
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Post by Boz on Jul 24, 2009 19:54:20 GMT -5
How about this? Obama would not be delighted to speak with you? ;D Maybe Obama prefers to speak for himself, thank you very much. TOTUS would beg to differ with you. ;D ;D ;D |
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Jul 25, 2009 9:57:58 GMT -5
Gates has accepted invite to WH. Should be an interesting meeting.
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on Jul 25, 2009 10:05:44 GMT -5
Gates has accepted invite to WH. Should be an interesting meeting. Another attempt at a photo op to avoid actually apologizing. |
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Post by strummer8526 on Jul 25, 2009 11:06:51 GMT -5
Gates has accepted invite to WH. Should be an interesting meeting. Another attempt at a photo op to avoid actually apologizing. If he were trying to angle for a photo op rather than an apology, wouldn't he invite the cop? It sounds like he's backing up his opinion by meeting with the person he views as potentially a victim. Personally, I think that more likely than not, Gates deserved what he got. But cooler heads likely could have prevailed. I don't necessarily think the cops acted "stupidly," but I can understand why someone would think that, and at least Obama gave an honest opinion that he's willing to back up. |
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Jul 25, 2009 11:19:24 GMT -5
Umm, except that it didn't occur in his house, at lease not most of it. You wonder how two intelligent people like Crowley and Gates (I've seen him on Colbert a few times) could get into such a ridiculous incident. That's an easy one to answer: Gates escalated the incident by immediately bringing up race ("why, because I'm a black man in America?". Even the black officer involved says "Gates' reaction to Crowley was 'a little bit stranger than it should have been.'" www.chicagotribune.com/news/sns-ap-us-harvard-scholar-arresting-officer,0,4731766.story My prediction: there's an audio recording out there of at least part of the incident and Gates is going to sound like a complete, irrational ass and the officer(s) are going to be vindicated (that's too strong of a word, but I can't think of a better one right now). |
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Jul 25, 2009 15:25:29 GMT -5
I believe Sgt/ Crowley is invited. See the transcript of Obama's impromptu chat with the press. No word yet whether Sg. Crowley has accepted.
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RusskyHoya
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Post by RusskyHoya on Jul 25, 2009 15:38:30 GMT -5
My prediction: there's an audio recording out there of at least part of the incident and Gates is going to sound like a complete, irrational ass and the officer(s) are going to be vindicated (that's too strong of a word, but I can't think of a better one right now). Yep, that recording is lying right next to the tape of Michelle Obama ranting about whitey  |
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Jul 25, 2009 17:38:45 GMT -5
Crowley should have refused the invite. My question is as follows: Doesn't Obama have more important things to do than share a beer with a cop and a jackass?
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EasyEd
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Post by EasyEd on Jul 25, 2009 19:47:25 GMT -5
Crowley should have refused the invite. My question is as follows: Doesn't Obama have more important things to do than share a beer with a cop and a clown? This is important to President Obama. It gives him the opportunity to have a photo op with both men involved, the press will be all over it to show that the President didn't really mean what he said and they will be ready to let the issue go. The fact of the matter is that a relatively minor matter (the incident itself) escalated primarily because POTUS probably solicited a question from the audience/press because he wanted to raise the racial question for a "teachable moment". It backfired on him and he's not man enough to offer a real apology so he's trying to appear the mediator where they all shake hands and everything's hunky dory. Mind you he is not the first person, Democrat or Republican, to offer a non-apology and seek to ease out of an unpleasant situation of his own making through sweet-sounding words and a smile. It's all too common on both sides of the aisle. |
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TC
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Post by TC on Jul 25, 2009 21:08:20 GMT -5
Crowley should have refused the invite. My question is as follows: Doesn't Obama have more important things to do than share a beer with a cop and a clown? Seven page thread says about a media issue that dominated multiple 24-hour news cycles says no. |
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Jul 25, 2009 21:18:12 GMT -5
This is such a trivial issue for national Republicans to beat into the ground, particularly when they criticize Obama for getting involved in the first place. Particularly stunning are charges of "photo op" given the January 2001-January 2009 period in our history. Think about asking military commanders to rotate a warship in a time of war to maximize the scenic backdrop for President Bush's passenger-side flight in a military plane with "Mission Accomplished" banner.
It is time for the Republicans to come up with a policy agenda beyond the pandering "chicken bucket" approach of Chairman Steele, the reflexive "no, can't do" of Minority Leader McConnell, etc. By the way, sources advise that Professor Gates liked his tax cut.
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Post by fsohoya on Jul 25, 2009 21:38:56 GMT -5
Gimme a break, Ambassador. This issue hasn't been pushed by Republicans. It's been - rightly for a shocking change when it comes to Obama - pushed by the media. That, and it seems a public that is smart enough to see through Gates and the President attacking the cops in the interest of, it appears, racebaiting. And if they let Obama turn this into some sort of victory by bringing the two sides together, it's right back to shame on the media. Obama is getting hammered because he should have kept his mouth shut about something he neither had the basic facts about, nor business declaring judgement on.
The Bush administration was plenty repulsive and the GOP is an embarrasing disaster, but that's got nothing to do with the matter at hand.
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Post by jerseyhoya34 on Jul 25, 2009 21:54:02 GMT -5
Gimme a break, Ambassador. This issue hasn't been pushed by Republicans. It's been - rightly for a shocking change when it comes to Obama - pushed by the media. That, and it seems a public that is smart enough to see through Gates and the President attacking the cops in the interest of, it appears, racebaiting. And if they let Obama turn this into some sort of victory by bringing the two sides together, it's right back to shame on the media. Obama is getting hammered because he should have kept his mouth shut about something he neither had the basic facts about, nor business declaring judgement on. Senate Republicans, via their national campaign committee, have already cut an ad on the issue and have circulated online petitions. I have not looked elsewhere. Now, given issues with Senate Republicans, this probably did not get attention and would not naturally get as much attention as a Obama's comments because he is the President of the United States. However, to suggest that the issue has not been pushed by Republicans flies in the face of their active campaigning on the issue as well as comments made in this thread. My take on it is that President Obama made a political mistake. I still have not yet seen an analysis that suggests his comments on their face were wrong. The police, in fact, acted stupidly for coaxing a resident from his home and arresting him after a verbal altercation inside of the residence. This does not mean that Professor Gates was a saint, and any interpretation that suggests as much involves a blatant misreading of President Obama's comments. I would be curious to hear thoughts on who should participate in the public debate on the issue if Obama is not allowed without a public firestorm. Are we basically down to Gates vs. Crowley, his legal team, and the local PBA's? The Bush administration was plenty repulsive and the GOP is an embarrasing disaster, but that's got nothing to do with the matter at hand. It goes to the credibility of the attacks on Obama for allegedly seeking a photo op when there were times for criticism of the Bush administration on the same front, and many on this board bit their nails instead. My point was not that these omissions had bearing on the merits of the Gates issue, and apologies if it came across as such. |
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Post by strummer8526 on Jul 26, 2009 0:49:51 GMT -5
I didn't hear all of Obama's comments on the subject. Did he say anything explicitly about race, or did he just say the cops acted "stupidly"? Because I think there are a lot of people, myself included, who would say this had nothing to do with race but that there's a decent chance that the cops acted less-than-intelligently in addressing an old man in his house.
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Jul 26, 2009 2:02:04 GMT -5
I didn't hear all of Obama's comments on the subject. Did he say anything explicitly about race, or did he just say the cops acted "stupidly"? Because I think there are a lot of people, myself included, who would say this had nothing to do with race but that there's a decent chance that the cops acted less-than-intelligently in addressing an old man in his house. Can we quit with the "old man in the house" bunk? The guy is 58. Hell, a 59-year-old almost won The Open last week. People make sound like this was some feeble old geezer who they drug out of the house by his walker. And BTW, Obama did tie it to race, even though it had NOTHING to do with race. And until people admit it had nothing to do with race, then we're not going to be able to continue making progress on true racial issues. |
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AvantGuardHoya
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Post by AvantGuardHoya on Jul 26, 2009 4:29:22 GMT -5
The more things change....
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Jul 26, 2009 8:57:24 GMT -5
The letter I'd love to see:
Dear President Obama:
Thank you for your gracious though utterly empty symbolic invitation. However, I will not be able to make it to the White House as I have a job to do. Unlike you, I'll assume your intentions are honorable and that you are not merely acting to cover your own backside after speaking "stupidly" and without the facts.
Now back to that job thing. How about you devote the time this empty little beer session would take up and read some of the 1,000 or so pages of health care reform you're asking the public to swallow sight unseen. I'll devote the time to keeping Cambridge safe.
Enjoy your beer.
Your pal, Jim Crowley
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TC
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Post by TC on Jul 26, 2009 9:25:03 GMT -5
The guy is 58. Hell, a 59-year-old almost won The Open last week. People make sound like this was some feeble old geezer who they drug out of the house by his walker. And BTW, Obama did tie it to race, even though it had NOTHING to do with race. And until people admit it had nothing to do with race, then we're not going to be able to continue making progress on true racial issues. They dragged him out of his house by his cane, not his walker. Get it right people! If you read Obama's statement he did not tie the actual incident to race : Now, I’ve — I don’t know, not having been there and not seeing all the facts, what role race played in that. But I think it’s fair to say, number one, any of us would be pretty angry; number two, that the Cambridge police acted stupidly in arresting somebody when there was already proof that they were in their own home. And number three, what I think we know separate and apart from this incident is that there is a long history in this country of African-Americans and Latinos being stopped by law enforcing disproportionately. That’s just a fact. As you know, Lynn, when I was in the state legislature in Illinois, we worked on a racial profiling bill because there was indisputable evidence that blacks and Hispanics were being stopped disproportionately. And that is a sign, an example of how, you know, race remains a factor in the society. That doesn’t lessen the incredible progress that has been made. I am standing here as testimony to the progress that’s been made. And yet the fact of the matter is, is that, you know, this still haunts us. And even when there are honest misunderstandings, the fact that blacks and Hispanics are picked up more frequently, and oftentime for no cause, casts suspicion even when there is good cause. And that’s why I think the more that we’re working with local law enforcement to improve policing techniques so that we’re eliminating potential bias, the safer everybody’s going to be.Politically his statements were unwise. They were not untrue. Ultimately, Republicans will overreach on this issue like the Cambridge Police Union and lose because of it. |
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GIGAFAN99
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Post by GIGAFAN99 on Jul 26, 2009 10:11:33 GMT -5
The guy is 58. Hell, a 59-year-old almost won The Open last week. People make sound like this was some feeble old geezer who they drug out of the house by his walker. And BTW, Obama did tie it to race, even though it had NOTHING to do with race. And until people admit it had nothing to do with race, then we're not going to be able to continue making progress on true racial issues. They dragged him out of his house by his cane, not his walker. Get it right people! If you read Obama's statement he did not tie the actual incident to race : Now, I’ve — I don’t know, not having been there and not seeing all the facts, what role race played in that. But I think it’s fair to say, number one, any of us would be pretty angry; number two, that the Cambridge police acted stupidly in arresting somebody when there was already proof that they were in their own home. And number three, what I think we know separate and apart from this incident is that there is a long history in this country of African-Americans and Latinos being stopped by law enforcing disproportionately. That’s just a fact. As you know, Lynn, when I was in the state legislature in Illinois, we worked on a racial profiling bill because there was indisputable evidence that blacks and Hispanics were being stopped disproportionately. And that is a sign, an example of how, you know, race remains a factor in the society. That doesn’t lessen the incredible progress that has been made. I am standing here as testimony to the progress that’s been made. And yet the fact of the matter is, is that, you know, this still haunts us. And even when there are honest misunderstandings, the fact that blacks and Hispanics are picked up more frequently, and oftentime for no cause, casts suspicion even when there is good cause. And that’s why I think the more that we’re working with local law enforcement to improve policing techniques so that we’re eliminating potential bias, the safer everybody’s going to be.Politically his statements were unwise. They were not untrue. Ultimately, Republicans will overreach on this issue like the Cambridge Police Union and lose because of it. "Save on gas. Drive this car." "Hey buddy, that car you sold me gets lousy gas mileage!" "Oh those were two separate suggestions completely unrelated. You must have inferred a relationship. Sorry." No matter what text analysis we do on the answer to the question, when you segue from "police acted stupidly" to a discussion of racial profiling, you're making the connection between this incident and racial profiling. That's clearly how anyone would take his words. So yes, he did comment on the incident in the context of race relations. Crowley will rightfully accept the invitation and this will be over. |
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kchoya
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Post by kchoya on Jul 26, 2009 11:39:25 GMT -5
The more things change.... Thank you for such a meaningful contribution. Of course, what more could one expect from a person who probably thinks this was racial profiling. |
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