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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 30, 2009 23:17:00 GMT -5
So before we turn into Maryland, what do we have to do to start graduating players? It's not clear to me where things are breaking down, but it's becoming increasingly apparent that they are, in fact, breaking down. And Jon Wallace isn't about to show up from in the class of '10. So what can we hope for? What would be a sign of III and the AD properly addressing the problem of people jumping ship?
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Mar 30, 2009 23:20:41 GMT -5
I was hoping we'd see less and less transfers as we got further into 3's tenure when people were no longer being recruited over. Now I don't know. I'm still an optimist so I think we've just had some bad luck with transfers over the years. If anyone besides dajuan or greg leaves we might have a real problem on our hands. It just seems like we've had some unlucky problems with recruits who think they're better than they are.
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hoyaboy1
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoyaboy1 on Mar 30, 2009 23:21:17 GMT -5
This thread would have been better if you waited for the next 2 guys to leave, so we could really go crazy.
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 30, 2009 23:23:49 GMT -5
This thread would have been better if you waited for the next 2 guys to leave, so we could really go crazy. Yeah, I mean, I'm hoping we get a few people on record and then just gradually watch as the whole thing slide into some form of hilarious chaos.
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hoyatables
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by hoyatables on Mar 31, 2009 8:37:59 GMT -5
Isn't Sapp graduating this year? Didn't four guys graduate last year? Didn't a couple of guys graduate the year before that?
Plenty of people staying all four years. Sheesh.
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JimmyHoya
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Hoya fan, est. 1986
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Post by JimmyHoya on Mar 31, 2009 8:47:37 GMT -5
Well Sapp might be distracted with pre-draft camps and skip the end of the semester.
We had the 4 final Esh recruits all graduate last year.
Jansen will graduate!
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Post by HoyasAreHungry on Mar 31, 2009 8:51:22 GMT -5
exactly....we have kids graduate. It's a give and take with every program. If we are bringing in future NBA talent every year....alot will choose to leave early. That's just a fact. I don't hear this type of thing from UNC or from other places. If you want us to graduate everyone we bring in then we won't be competitive on the basketball court. Just as simple as that. As long as a few of those kids that leave early come back and get their degrees eventually I have no problem with it
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ScreamingHoya
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Ted Valentine: Getting it wrong since 1979.
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Post by ScreamingHoya on Mar 31, 2009 9:38:52 GMT -5
hoyatables, yeah we've graduated a normal amount in the past couple years, but we're talking about the present. This year's seniors (or should I say senior) are JT3's first recruiting class. Egerson, Spann and Thorton all peaced. Next year, Macklin, Summers and Rivers are all gone. That's one in seven players who decided to stay all four years and five of the seven transferred out. Not exactly a major selling point for the recruiting staff.
Any more jumping ship will only make things worse.
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hoyatables
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Post by hoyatables on Mar 31, 2009 9:41:33 GMT -5
hoyatables, yeah we've graduated a normal amount in the past couple years, but we're talking about the present. This year's seniors (or should I say senior) are JT3's first recruiting class. Egerson, Spann and Thorton all peaced. Next year, Macklin, Summers and Rivers are all gone. That's one in seven players who decided to stay all four years and five of the seven transferred out. Not exactly a major selling point for the recruiting staff. Any more jumping ship will only make things worse. Ok, but the problem is not an academic/eligibility problem, which is what the title of the thread suggests.
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guru
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Post by guru on Mar 31, 2009 9:54:15 GMT -5
hoyatables, yeah we've graduated a normal amount in the past couple years, but we're talking about the present. This year's seniors (or should I say senior) are JT3's first recruiting class. Egerson, Spann and Thorton all peaced. Next year, Macklin, Summers and Rivers are all gone. That's one in seven players who decided to stay all four years and five of the seven transferred out. Not exactly a major selling point for the recruiting staff. Any more jumping ship will only make things worse. Ok, but the problem is not an academic/eligibility problem, which is what the title of the thread suggests. The numbers will still look really ugly when the NCAA starts counting these seasons in its grad rate statistics. One for Seven? We're veering down toward UMCP territory. Scary.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 31, 2009 10:03:42 GMT -5
Transfers that leave in good academic standing don't have the same punishment in the APR system. For some reason they still report the grad rate, though.
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chep3
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Post by chep3 on Mar 31, 2009 10:09:36 GMT -5
If players leave early and come back and get their degrees, does that count towards the grad rate for the APR?
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 31, 2009 10:40:03 GMT -5
If players leave early and come back and get their degrees, does that count towards the grad rate for the APR? I believe both for the APR and the Grad Rate, you have six years to graduate.
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757hoyafan
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Post by 757hoyafan on Mar 31, 2009 10:41:35 GMT -5
W/in 6 years(I think) @ Chep
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Post by Hoya TMF on Mar 31, 2009 10:47:38 GMT -5
The transfers seem to be more of the problem than anythign else. Egerson had personal reasons, Spann, Thornton, Macklin and Rivers left because of playing time. Its unfortunate, but I don;t get the sense that kids are leaving because they don't make the grade. Besides, what do these numbers really mean. Most people realize that Georgetown is a good academic institution with a reputation for graduating players. There are legit reasons for the low numbers in the last few years. So what exacly are we worried about? Whose opinion of Georgetown has changed? I doubt anyone.
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 31, 2009 12:22:08 GMT -5
First of all, the word "Graduating" does not imply that I'm accusing anyone of academic ineligibility. It implies that I'm concerned about players not staying for 4 years and "GRADUATING."
Second, this is a problem b/c of the APR and b/c we will never get over "inexperience" problems if every 2 years, our entire team bails or goes to the NBA.
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Post by Hoya TMF on Mar 31, 2009 12:46:05 GMT -5
what leads you to believe that its a trend? its been two years. there were legitimate reasopns for each of these kids transferring, and it had more to do with growing pains than anything else. after going to a final four, it was clear that JTIII could get more talented kids than were in his first recruting class. It also became clear that Makclin and Rivers were not going to get the run they wanted. I don't thinkw e have to worry about that as much anymore. Despite the rumors about Wright elaving, I don't believe he or anyone else will do so. I think this is more of a sign of a program intr ansition than anythign else. When Esherick's kids talked about transferring , it was because the program sucked. No longer. It looks bad now, but I think it will end up being a blip. Looking at our roster now, only Greg looks like he has a shot at leaving early. if others do so, it will likely be based on team success and then, who could blame them?
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Post by HoyaSinceBirth on Mar 31, 2009 12:52:19 GMT -5
I honestly think that kids who transfer in good academic standing should not count against a school in terms of gradation rate.
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Post by strummer8526 on Mar 31, 2009 12:55:48 GMT -5
I honestly think that kids who transfer in good academic standing should not count against a school in terms of gradation rate. But they do, right? That's my understanding of the system. Like it or not, it's something we need to be aware of. And if we're going to bash other schools when they graduate 1 kid in 2 years (1 out of 7 recruits? 8?), then we need to look hard at ourselves as well.
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SFHoya99
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Post by SFHoya99 on Mar 31, 2009 13:11:56 GMT -5
I honestly think that kids who transfer in good academic standing should not count against a school in terms of gradation rate. But they do, right? That's my understanding of the system. Like it or not, it's something we need to be aware of. And if we're going to bash other schools when they graduate 1 kid in 2 years (1 out of 7 recruits? 8?), then we need to look hard at ourselves as well. Huh? Really? You're going to limit your opinions to an NCAA-derived stat? Really what you shouldbe doing is looking at the cause for each program before criticizing, not criticizing everyone based on a faulty metric. Ahhh, critical thinking.
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