RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 8,835
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Post by RDF on Aug 13, 2008 11:16:48 GMT -5
Was that overhyped munchkin Landon Donovan on the team again? I can't stand that dwarf.
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thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,866
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Post by thebin on Aug 13, 2008 11:52:59 GMT -5
The US men's soccer team actually did quite well all things considered. They beat Japan, outplayed world class Holland side and only lost on a free kick in the last few seconds, and played a close game against a world class Nigeria down a man the entire game. Tough breaks.
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Post by williambraskyiii on Aug 13, 2008 12:01:19 GMT -5
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 17,899
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Post by SFHoya99 on Aug 13, 2008 12:04:49 GMT -5
It's a bad decision in my opinion -- but K does have slightly quicker wings on his current team.
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PDRHoya99
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 766
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Post by PDRHoya99 on Aug 13, 2008 12:14:08 GMT -5
The US men's soccer team actually did quite well all things considered. They beat Japan, outplayed world class Holland side and only lost on a free kick in the last few seconds, and played a close game against a world class Nigeria down a man the entire game. Tough breaks. I believe they tied the Dutch 2-2. Given that these aren't full international squads is this even impressive though? Olympic soccer teams are limited to 3 players over age 23 on their squad, essentially making it a non-event compared to World Cup or European Championships.
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vcjack
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,875
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Post by vcjack on Aug 13, 2008 12:18:35 GMT -5
I think a worse strategy is that they are launching a bazillion 3's even though they aren't falling AND the roster isn't really tailor made like a normal Duke team
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Post by strummer8526 on Aug 13, 2008 12:28:29 GMT -5
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kghoya
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 5,049
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Post by kghoya on Aug 13, 2008 13:22:52 GMT -5
Was that overhyped munchkin Landon Donovan on the team again? I can't stand that dwarf. no. its a u23 tournament with the exception of 3 older players. he wasnt one of the older players. that being said, most of the players are munchkins.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2008 14:04:41 GMT -5
The US men's soccer team actually did quite well all things considered. They beat Japan, outplayed world class Holland side and only lost on a free kick in the last few seconds, and played a close game against a world class Nigeria down a man the entire game. Tough breaks. They lost. They stink. The end.
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RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 8,835
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Post by RDF on Aug 13, 2008 14:19:45 GMT -5
Coach K's "Re-Deem" team looked like trash against an awful Angola team. I'm also tiring of hearing how these guys are more "likeable" then the '04 team considering Anthony, James, Boozer, and Wade were all on that team--with Tim Duncan--yeah he's someone who is a bad apple, and fact Iverson was best behaved and most respectable person on the team in his behavior during the games.
I hope this team flops miserably--and I like a lot of the players on this team--but I can't stand the attitude and Coach K.
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hoyarooter
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by hoyarooter on Aug 13, 2008 14:45:54 GMT -5
I think a worse strategy is that they are launching a bazillion 3's even though they aren't falling AND the roster isn't really tailor made like a normal Duke team I agree with this, and the worst culprit has been Kobe, who is a stellar 1-14 in the two games.
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Nevada Hoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 18,672
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Post by Nevada Hoya on Aug 13, 2008 15:14:56 GMT -5
Anyone else enjoy watching the youngest looking 16 year olds in the world last night? I'm finding the Chinese very questionable in all of this. Twelve at the most.
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thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,866
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Post by thebin on Aug 13, 2008 16:37:27 GMT -5
Yeah, probably no way to prove it with a complicit government issuing passports, but the Chinese women's gold is more tainted than Barry Bonds all time HR mark. They weren't even 14 or 15 either. This is an enormous advantage in the sport, incalcuably so. The Chinese have been busted doing this before. Like HGH, if the state backs them up, it's impossible to bust.
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theexorcist
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,506
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Post by theexorcist on Aug 13, 2008 16:45:41 GMT -5
I refuse to watch the Olympics. It's a coming-out party for a repressive regime whose leaders didn't do what they promised they would and who consistently play fast and loose with the rules and scream racism whenever journalists call them on the carpet for it.
And it's bankrolled by NBC, who's cool with reporting for Tiananmen Square where people - COLLEGE STUDENTS! - PEACEFUL COLLEGE STUDENTS!! - were shot for asking for minimal rights, just as long as they win the week.
One of the world's apparently most powerful regimes apparently can't deal with the security threat posed by Joey Cheek. Give me a break.
Cowards.
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njhoya06
Century (over 100 posts)
Posts: 228
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Post by njhoya06 on Aug 13, 2008 17:06:55 GMT -5
The US men's soccer team actually did quite well all things considered. They beat Japan, outplayed world class Holland side and only lost on a free kick in the last few seconds, and played a close game against a world class Nigeria down a man the entire game. Tough breaks. I believe they tied the Dutch 2-2. Given that these aren't full international squads is this even impressive though? Olympic soccer teams are limited to 3 players over age 23 on their squad, essentially making it a non-event compared to World Cup or European Championships. This Dutch team more or less won the European U-21 Championship, and we really deserved to beat them. Sucks whatever that guy's name was decided to throw an elbow in the 4th minute today. We should have been able to get a point from today.
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thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,866
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Post by thebin on Aug 13, 2008 21:35:40 GMT -5
I refuse to watch the Olympics. It's a coming-out party for a repressive regime whose leaders didn't do what they promised they would and who consistently play fast and loose with the rules and scream racism whenever journalists call them on the carpet for it. And it's bankrolled by NBC, who's cool with reporting for Tiananmen Square where people - COLLEGE STUDENTS! - PEACEFUL COLLEGE STUDENTS!! - were shot for asking for minimal rights, just as long as they win the week. One of the world's apparently most powerful regimes apparently can't deal with the security threat posed by Joey Cheek. Give me a break. Cowards. I generally agree with every word of this- but I'm not leting them take the Olympics from me until 2012 so I won't be ignoring them. I'm guessing you don't really care about the Olympics to begin with? I almost wretched though as the color man during the opening ceremonies seemed to be reading from the Party script. Not Costas, the other guy. Costas actually did mention the Tianamen massacres pretty prominently shortly thereafter.
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theexorcist
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,506
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Post by theexorcist on Aug 13, 2008 22:14:29 GMT -5
I refuse to watch the Olympics. It's a coming-out party for a repressive regime whose leaders didn't do what they promised they would and who consistently play fast and loose with the rules and scream racism whenever journalists call them on the carpet for it. And it's bankrolled by NBC, who's cool with reporting for Tiananmen Square where people - COLLEGE STUDENTS! - PEACEFUL COLLEGE STUDENTS!! - were shot for asking for minimal rights, just as long as they win the week. One of the world's apparently most powerful regimes apparently can't deal with the security threat posed by Joey Cheek. Give me a break. Cowards. I generally agree with every word of this- but I'm not leting them take the Olympics from me until 2012 so I won't be ignoring them. I'm guessing you don't really care about the Olympics to begin with? I almost wretched though as the color man during the opening ceremonies seemed to be reading from the Party script. Not Costas, the other guy. Costas actually did mention the Tianamen massacres pretty prominently shortly thereafter. I LOVE the Olympics. I still think that Epyx's Summer Games and Winter Games are great. I love the pageantry and the competition in all the crazy sports. I'm jingoistic and even have a cool new TV that would make women's beach volleyball a religious experience. My brother got to visit Norway when the Winter Olympics were going on in Lillehammer, and I'm still a little bitter. I'll watch in 2010 and 2012. But I can't watch it and help NBC's ad numbers. Not when the country that is running them is using them as propaganda to sell a despicable regime.
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RBHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 4,143
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Post by RBHoya on Aug 14, 2008 1:00:28 GMT -5
Agree re: China being ridiculous, cheating with the young gymnasts and what have you. Not sure if it's been posted or others saw this story, it's not really sports related but I couldn't help but shake my head when I saw it: sports.yahoo.com/olympics/beijing/blog/fourth_place_medal/post/The-Chinese-pulled-a-Milli-Vanilli-during-the-Op?urn=oly,100162 Which brings me to another series of questions that I've been thinking a lot about... Will China beat us in the gold medal count? Will they beat us in the overall medal count? And if so (to either)... does it matter? Does it bother you? I have mixed feelings about it. Obviously I want to see us win everything. Right now it seems like we're not on pace, though I'm not familiar enough with the projections to know whether it will turn around. I assume that we'll win at least a few in track and the Chinese probably won't win more than maybe 1 or 2, but that still might not be enough to take the lead back. But if we do lose on golds and potentially overall, I'm not sure if I should really care. Like we saw with the gymnasts that were clearly too young and clearly issued false government documents in order to win... in that situation the GOVERNMENT ITSELF is complicit in cheating. How messed up is that? If the government itself is willing to cheat that way, doesn't that taint any sort of victory they may gain? Also, they rack up tons of golds in events that I consider to be "trivial" (obviously they're not trivial to the people in them and I respect their effort, but they're not mainstream sports), like the lightweight weightlifts and a ton of women's lifts, for instance. Their attempt to win the medal count is clearly "centrally planned" and has been in the works for many years, as they have targeted sports like shooting or kayaking where the competition was not especially stiff, and poured resources into taking those medals home just so the medal count would look better. In the medal count a gold in flyweight women's lifting or wrestling is worth the same as a gold in men's basketball, but is it REALLY worth the same? They also identify children with aptitude at young ages and essentially groom them to win gold medals "for the glory of the country".... and obviously good American athletes start in their sports early too, but most don't start training to be olympians until they are at least old enough to make a decision on their own, and all can quit at any time if they want (and while I'm sure the Chinese athletes would say the same was true for them, we all know it isn't quite that easy). To top it all off there are 4 times as many of them as there are of us, and they have the homefield advantage. But it still bothers me, that their government is going to use this as propaganda and that they're all going to be over their celebrating this as a triumph of "the Chinese way" over the inferior western system (you know, where people actually choose to pursue olympic success rather than being compelled to so their government can look good). And of course any criticism of how this "success" came about will be silenced (if it comes from within) or censored (if it comes via internet). For the moment I'm just hoping we turn it around and pick up some golds in things like wrestling, boxing, volleyball or water polo to help us catch up. If we can do that in addition to the mens and womens basketball, womens tennis, track, and couple other medals that we're favored to win, we might be able to turn it around and make all the rest of this moot. FWIW, it's the only reason I'm rooting for K, Melo, Kobe, and LeBron (all of whom I HATE--especially with all the bs about "character" that's being spewed) to win the gold.
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thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,866
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Post by thebin on Aug 14, 2008 7:13:57 GMT -5
Agree re: China being ridiculous, cheating with the young gymnasts and what have you. Not sure if it's been posted or others saw this story, it's not really sports related but I couldn't help but shake my head when I saw it: sports.yahoo.com/olympics/beijing/blog/fourth_place_medal/post/The-Chinese-pulled-a-Milli-Vanilli-during-the-Op?urn=oly,100162 Which brings me to another series of questions that I've been thinking a lot about... Will China beat us in the gold medal count? Will they beat us in the overall medal count? And if so (to either)... does it matter? Does it bother you? I have mixed feelings about it. Obviously I want to see us win everything. Right now it seems like we're not on pace, though I'm not familiar enough with the projections to know whether it will turn around. I assume that we'll win at least a few in track and the Chinese probably won't win more than maybe 1 or 2, but that still might not be enough to take the lead back. But if we do lose on golds and potentially overall, I'm not sure if I should really care. Like we saw with the gymnasts that were clearly too young and clearly issued false government documents in order to win... in that situation the GOVERNMENT ITSELF is complicit in cheating. How messed up is that? If the government itself is willing to cheat that way, doesn't that taint any sort of victory they may gain? Also, they rack up tons of golds in events that I consider to be "trivial" (obviously they're not trivial to the people in them and I respect their effort, but they're not mainstream sports), like the lightweight weightlifts and a ton of women's lifts, for instance. Their attempt to win the medal count is clearly "centrally planned" and has been in the works for many years, as they have targeted sports like shooting or kayaking where the competition was not especially stiff, and poured resources into taking those medals home just so the medal count would look better. In the medal count a gold in flyweight women's lifting or wrestling is worth the same as a gold in men's basketball, but is it REALLY worth the same? They also identify children with aptitude at young ages and essentially groom them to win gold medals "for the glory of the country".... and obviously good American athletes start in their sports early too, but most don't start training to be olympians until they are at least old enough to make a decision on their own, and all can quit at any time if they want (and while I'm sure the Chinese athletes would say the same was true for them, we all know it isn't quite that easy). To top it all off there are 4 times as many of them as there are of us, and they have the homefield advantage. But it still bothers me, that their government is going to use this as propaganda and that they're all going to be over their celebrating this as a triumph of "the Chinese way" over the inferior western system (you know, where people actually choose to pursue olympic success rather than being compelled to so their government can look good). And of course any criticism of how this "success" came about will be silenced (if it comes from within) or censored (if it comes via internet). For the moment I'm just hoping we turn it around and pick up some golds in things like wrestling, boxing, volleyball or water polo to help us catch up. If we can do that in addition to the mens and womens basketball, womens tennis, track, and couple other medals that we're favored to win, we might be able to turn it around and make all the rest of this moot. FWIW, it's the only reason I'm rooting for K, Melo, Kobe, and LeBron (all of whom I HATE--especially with all the bs about "character" that's being spewed) to win the gold. I'll be honest- I do care about the medal count. No it's not terribly important, but I want us to win it as always. I see the overall medal count as the most important one, I didn't realize anyone looked only at golds until pretty recently, but evidentally that is how most of the world orders their medals tables- by golds only. I think that is silly- why do they give out three medals then? But oh well. Incidentally, China is on record for going after the total golds and not total medals as well as targeting the low hanging fruit sports like women's weightlifting and synch diving- an absurdity pretty much invented so the Chinese could win the golds. Is China going to beat us in the golds? Certainly. At this point they are walking away with it and we are nearing the end of our medals machine when swimming ends soon. They haven't even started giving medals out for the ridiculous sports like ping pong and badmiton where China cleans up. We'll make up some on track, but it's not swimming. I'd like to think we will win our share of freestyle wrestling and boxing medals, but it seems to me we are a shadow of our former selves in those combat sports. And don't forget there are loads of martial arts medals now too. Come to think of it, we might need to worry more about beating South Korea in golds than China. Overall medal count will be close.
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thebin
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,866
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Post by thebin on Aug 14, 2008 7:25:35 GMT -5
Whether you think the medal table is important or not, what is undeniable is that many people do think it's important. The govt in China has spend at least 9 figures and the better part of a decade planning to take the golds title away from the US. With that said, why on earth is a team victory in a 2-3 week tournament with sometimes 10-15 athletes per team only awarded a single medal on the table? The same impact on the table as a single 100 pound women's weightlifting medal for which the pool of people who actually compete in that event worldwide is less than 1% of the pool of people who compete in the more popular team sports....If you win for example the men's basketball bronze, that should absolutely count for 3 bronze medals on the table.
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