Brandon Jennings may stick it to the NCAA

[HoyaOnBothSides]

Great article in the Times today:

www.nytimes.com/2008/06/23/sports/basketball/23rhoden.html?_r=1&ref=sports&oref=slogin

The article talks about Brandon Jennings' considerations for taking his "gap" year and spending it playing for a pro team in Europe.

This goes back to the OJ Mayo debate on this board - this scenario will play out more and more often as players begin to realize they are grossly undercompensated, and the delusion of any higher purpose for "one and done" college athletes (education, etc) will begin to fade away.

Rhoden expressed it very well, in particular stating:

"He [Jennings] would come into the N.B.A. with money and maturity after having lived abroad for a season or two. This is true education, the kind of education an elite college basketball or football player will be hard pressed to receive inside forced study halls, where the primary objective is to stay eligible."

[theexorcist]

I've stated a few times that I don't like the age limit. That said, this really doesn't matter.

Playing overseas is not easy. No English-speaking country has a legitimate pro league, so culture shock isn't small. In addition, pro coaches aren't big on development, and so someone could quickly languish on the bench if they can't produce (if you can't lead Maccabi Tel Aviv to the Euroleague championship and if you're gone after a year, you may be out of a job really quickly).

The larger threat is a "touring team" of US-based pros who can possibly get sneaker money and essentially play exhibition games for a year. Add some good coaching and they'll throw off the sham of college and simply focus on basketball (Madrid versus Tucson for a year? College is a joke in his eyes).

[RDF]

This kid going overseas would end up as the "Maurice Clarett" of Basketball. It would be an ignorant move, it would ruin his career--the kid is immature and this just adds to that. If you want to show a commitment--get your behind in the books and make sure you qualify for CBB. That would've shown maturity and commitment--not globe trotting around and proving you are a streetball "master" at the Elite 24 Game at Rucker Park. From what I've seen Jennings isn't mature enough to start at Sesame Street University--he's a ball hog--has no clue how to run a team and depsite his physical talent--he's in for a rude awakening if he thinks his behavior/on court demeanor will make a team better.

Get your ass in the books--pass the SAT and get to Tuscon to prove you are really the type of person who has been talked about as great. Or be a Clarett--go to Europe and suffer a miserable failure and then come running home hoping you are given a second chance as other basketball prodigies have been--but without a resume for anyone to see, other then dressing like it's 1988 and being a ballhog/flashy no substance player in pickup style games.

[SFHoya99]

European Ball is much better than Brandon Jennings thinks it is.

I think he'd spend most of his time on the bench; check that, I doubt any good Euro team would pay him that much for one year of development where then they lose him to the NBA soon after. So he'd either play low level ball for cheaper or not at all.

This is a non-starter.

[moe09]

Tell us how you really feel, RDF.

I don't profess to be any sort of expert on European ball, but I think the kid would at least get a good amount of run in Europe, if not start. Whatever you may say, if he was able to jump straight to the draft, I'm sure there would be some teams that would pull the trigger on him. Whether he would jump to Europe and fall through the cracks without immediate success remains to be seen, but to immediately write him off is simply naive.

[moe09]

“For a person that plays ball, our dream is to get to the N.B.A.,” Jennings said. “College is like, O.K., we’ll do this one year, but our real mind-set is that we’re trying to get to the league, take care of our families. They’re making us do college so we feel like, Let’s do one year, go to class half the time.”

Sounds like exactly the kind of kid you want representing your university... If not just for the "class half the time" comment.

[Jack]

As always with a pioneer, you want to find the right test case, and Jennings does not seem to be it. If the rule was in place for LeBron and he had gone to Europe for a year or two, we might have already figured out a better system.

[SFHoya99]

Jun 23, 2008 15:32:18 GMT -5 moe09 said:

Tell us how you really feel, RDF.

I don't profess to be any sort of expert on European ball, but I think the kid would at least get a good amount of run in Europe, if not start. Whatever you may say, if he was able to jump straight to the draft, I'm sure there would be some teams that would pull the trigger on him. Whether he would jump to Europe and fall through the cracks without immediate success remains to be seen, but to immediately write him off is simply naive.

No, he wouldn't. At least not in a tough league on a first-division team. These are players who have played together for years, are 27-28 years old, etc.

It's like expecting a HS kid to go straight to the NBA and be a starter their first year. Who has done that? Kobe, Garnett, LeBron. Tracy McGrady was a sub. Same with Jermaine O'Neal.

The shortest guy there is 6'6" and that's Bryant. Brandon Jennings is a 6' ball-hog PG in the Sebastian Telfair mold who is #1 because the class isn't very strong.

I think he'd be lucky to get run on a club like Benetton Treviso and he's more likely to get exposed than impress.

[kchoya]

Jun 23, 2008 15:32:18 GMT -5 moe09 said:

Tell us how you really feel, RDF.

I don't profess to be any sort of expert on European ball, but I think the kid would at least get a good amount of run in Europe, if not start. Whatever you may say, if he was able to jump straight to the draft, I'm sure there would be some teams that would pull the trigger on him. Whether he would jump to Europe and fall through the cracks without immediate success remains to be seen, but to immediately write him off is simply naive.

Why would a team take him? Say Tony Parker, at 18-years-old, came to the Seattle Sonics and said I want to play in the NBA for a year and then go play in the European league, do you think Seattle would take that deal? No. What's to gain in the long-term development of the team? Nothing.

[MCIGuy]

Jun 23, 2008 10:00:06 GMT -5 HoyaOnBothSides said:

Great article in the Times today:

www.nytimes.com/2008/06/23/sports/basketball/23rhoden.html?_r=1&ref=sports&oref=slogin

The article talks about Brandon Jennings' considerations for taking his "gap" year and spending it playing for a pro team in Europe.

This goes back to the OJ Mayo debate on this board - this scenario will play out more and more often as players begin to realize they are grossly undercompensated, and the delusion of any higher purpose for "one and done" college athletes (education, etc) will begin to fade away.

Rhoden expressed it very well, in particular stating:

"He [Jennings] would come into the N.B.A. with money and maturity after having lived abroad for a season or two. This is true education, the kind of education an elite college basketball or football player will be hard pressed to receive inside forced study halls, where the primary objective is to stay eligible."

First of all Rhoden is tyopically an idiot. I do agree however that time overseas can be a superior form of education than the one provided by some universities. But there are a couple of things to point out:

1)Jennings isn't doing this because he felt some moral need to challenge the NCAA. He's doing it because his stupid butt couldn't get the grades. And when I write "stupid" I'm talking mostly about how he carries himself and how he comes across in interviews rather than how he performs in the classroom.

2)I have always been a supporter of a two year delay for high school kids before they can go to the NBA and if they didn't want to go to college I have felt that going overseas would be a nice option. I still do. But I doubt most of these kids don't want leave this continent at that early of an age unless they can get hooked up like the biggest high school stars such as Jennings.

[MCIGuy]

Jun 23, 2008 16:41:21 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

Jun 23, 2008 15:32:18 GMT -5 moe09 said:

Tell us how you really feel, RDF.

I don't profess to be any sort of expert on European ball, but I think the kid would at least get a good amount of run in Europe, if not start. Whatever you may say, if he was able to jump straight to the draft, I'm sure there would be some teams that would pull the trigger on him. Whether he would jump to Europe and fall through the cracks without immediate success remains to be seen, but to immediately write him off is simply naive.

No, he wouldn't. At least not in a tough league on a first-division team. These are players who have played together for years, are 27-28 years old, etc.

It's like expecting a HS kid to go straight to the NBA and be a starter their first year. Who has done that? Kobe, Garnett, LeBron. Tracy McGrady was a sub. Same with Jermaine O'Neal.

The shortest guy there is 6'6" and that's Bryant. Brandon Jennings is a 6' ball-hog PG in the Sebastian Telfair mold who is #1 because the class isn't very strong.

I think he'd be lucky to get run on a club like Benetton Treviso and he's more likely to get exposed than impress.

Kobe didn't start that first year. At least not immediately.

Anyway something that perhaps shouldn't be brought into this discussion, but how would a young guy like Jennings who would be far away from home and his community react if European fans start throwing verbal, racial insults his way that black soccer players over there deal with routinely? Will it mature him, make him stronger and make him appreciate more playing in front of the more friendly crowds of the NBA? Or will he have such a strong negative (and understandable) reaction that it sets him back emotionally and professionally?

[HoyaSinceBirth]

I mean I think this is interesting, and i agree on several things
first he's not doing this for any reason other than the fact that he may not qualify for college and if he does he will probably struggle to stay eligible.
second he probably can't just go to a high level team in a high level league and immediately succeed.

However I think what he could do is find a team near the bottom of the league that would be willing to employ what would essentially be a gimmick for a year and let him start and work through his mistakes. Preferably this would be a team that already has an american on it that could serve as a role model/guide in his new home.

[JohnnyTwoTimes]

I agree with SF here. A Euroleague level team would not be interested in giving an 18-year old ball hog a one-year contract, and even if they were, it is almost assured that he would be grabbing a lot of pine. He could go to a lower level team and get more run, but that would nullify the theory that he is getting all of this coaching and development, because there is a vast difference between what Euroleague teams are able to do in that regard compared with lower level European squads. Moreover, if he played on a lower level team, he would not have the necessary exposure to boost his draft stock to where I am sure he would want it to be.

A Euroleague-level team is somewhere between a top NCAA team and your average NBA team (in fact, in several exhibitions the past couple of years, teams like CSKA Moscow have beaten NBA teams). You would have to be a pretty special high school player to step in and get a lot of playing time for a team like that.

I'll also add that -- and this is based only on what I have seen in All Star games, so it's not worth much -- Jennings is precisely the type of player a Euroleague team would not be interested in. From what I have seen, his #1 priority is to attempt the most difficult pass imaginable. If there were a PG who could pull off such a move, it would be a guy like Derrick Rose, a more physically mature player who brings heady leadership to the position. And even for him, it would be pretty tough.

[tgo]

Jun 24, 2008 8:05:36 GMT -5 HoyaSinceBirth said:

a team near the bottom of the league that would be willing to employ what would essentially be a gimmick for a year and let him start and work through his mistakes.

i dont follow you, what kind of gimmick would that be? upwards of 85% of american basketball fans have never heard of him so they certainly dont know who he is in South Kerpluckistan so it isnt going to fill any seats. to use a professinal team that is trying to win games and make a profit as a minor league training ground is not going to be very attractive for the team in question unless he is a major difference maker and they hope that difference gets them into title contention or some other level that the franchise hasnt reached in a while. in other words, if it were lebron james maybe they take the chance knowing they only have him for a year.

[SFHoya99]

Jun 23, 2008 21:13:30 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

Jun 23, 2008 16:41:21 GMT -5 SFHoya99 said:

No, he wouldn't. At least not in a tough league on a first-division team. These are players who have played together for years, are 27-28 years old, etc.

It's like expecting a HS kid to go straight to the NBA and be a starter their first year. Who has done that? Kobe, Garnett, LeBron. Tracy McGrady was a sub. Same with Jermaine O'Neal.

The shortest guy there is 6'6" and that's Bryant. Brandon Jennings is a 6' ball-hog PG in the Sebastian Telfair mold who is #1 because the class isn't very strong.

I think he'd be lucky to get run on a club like Benetton Treviso and he's more likely to get exposed than impress.

Kobe didn't start that first year. At least not immediately.

Anyway something that perhaps shouldn't be brought into this discussion, but how would a young guy like Jennings who would be far away from home and his community react if European fans start throwing verbal, racial insults his way that black soccer players over there deal with routinely? Will it mature him, make him stronger and make him appreciate more playing in front of the more friendly crowds of the NBA? Or will he have such a strong negative (and understandable) reaction that it sets him back emotionally and professionally?

1. Kobe not starting is even a stronger data point that Brandon Jennings wouldn't blow the Euro League away.

2. I think it's a valid point. But even not going there -- the general cultural adaptation period would likely hamper even the most worldly of kids somewhat -- as a college freshman most of us had trouble adjusting to an ideal world of college in our own country. Forget about adjusting to pro ball as well where, again, the team has no long term designs on you.

[Deleted]

Jun 24, 2008 10:01:39 GMT -5 tgo said:

they certainly dont know who he is in South Kerpluckistan so it isnt going to fill any seats.

Ahem....that's Kerplackistan...

[RDF]

Most of the kids who would contemplate going overseas don't even show the discipline to get eligible for NCAA ball--which is sad because most of them can do it--they just don't want to study. Jennings is intelligent enough to qualify--but qualifying meant less to him then wearing Gumby Haircut and throwing a showtime pass at the Rucker. If the kid isn't professional enough to hold up his end of responsibility--why would he be professional enough to handle playing on the bench in Europe and learning how to play the game correctly while being in a different country? He is a talent--but so are numerous kids who play the game and for the life of me--I still don't get why these guys don't learn from the previous mistakes made by talented people who think the game "needs them"?

Hopefully he'll pass his standardized test score and this nonsense will go away. All I know about Jennings is that I'm 100% happy he's nowhere near DC and never considered being a Hoya--or wasn't recruited by Georgetown.

[moe09]

Alright, forgot about the 1-year contract. However, there's no reason he couldn't be there for a couple years considering the time it'll take for him to adjust.

[Z]

for the reasons mentioned above, i dont see a mid to high non-US team taking him on for a year or 2. playing abroad will (best case scenario) leave him as a much more unknown quantity than someone they can evaluate against high-major talent in a major CBB conference. also, he can't shoot, is noted by other HS players as being selfish, and has the build of a malnuitritioned telfair. other than that, no college needed. perhaps we could enlist korleone young or leon smith as a mentor. i do enjoy the idea of a travelling team of durant's, beasley's, oden's etc. that would play exhibitions against non-US teams in lieu of being one and dones.

[SirSaxa]

Jun 23, 2008 15:45:44 GMT -5 moe09 said:

“For a person that plays ball, our dream is to get to the N.B.A.,” Jennings said. “College is like, O.K., we’ll do this one year, but our real mind-set is that we’re trying to get to the league, take care of our families. They’re making us do college so we feel like, Let’s do one year, go to class half the time.”

Sounds like exactly the kind of kid you want representing your university...

I agree with you completely, but that is an argument against forcing kids to go to college when they really don't want to.