SHUT UP--Jerry West!!

[RDF]

Add Jerry West to the "SHUT UP" list. He's whining about his dislike for the Draft Lottery process--which to me is by far the most exciting of the major sports and it's also the best/quickest draft--so what's not to like? Oh wait, the Logo just is upset that he wont' get Oden or Durant--well he's a genius in the front office--and worked the Rudy Gay trade--so shouldn't he build around a great talent like that?

Fact is--that you see that tanking doesn't get rewarded in the NBA--Boston and Memphis just died trying to get those players and were not rewarded--they had best opportunity to get them and yet didn't. So West now says changes should be made, blah blah, blah, yeah--I've got one for you Jerry--go back to the Lakers and fix them--build around a player who is superior to Durant and in his prime--and you'll see the level of success doesn't have to be based on a top 2 pick after having a team you built poorly stink and flop to try and get better.

[hoyarooter]

Jerry West is one of my two favorite all-time NBA players, along with Magic. That said, I agree with you, RDF. Whining doesn't become the Logo.

[SFHoya99]

I think they should go back to the original lottery system that they changed after the Magic won it twice in a row. You need some level of parity in the league, but there's no reason the best players should go to the crappiest teams. Here's a tip for West and Ainge -- try actually acquiring good players.

The Jazz, the Pistons, and a whole host of other teams have done it without ever getting the Top pick or perennially being in the lottery.

[StPetersburgHoya (Inactive)]

He went to West Virginia that alone puts him on notice. Now he's dead to me.

[HoyaFanNY]

the entire lottery process is idiotic. mlb doesn't do it, and the nfl doesn't do it. the lottery isn't about preventing teams from tanking games, it's about another way for the nba to create drama and draw viewers. the entire 'tanking games' talk is nonsense.

[Deleted]

hoyafanny said:

the entire lottery process is idiotic. mlb doesn't do it, the nhl doesn't do it, and the nfl doesn't do it. the lottery isn't about preventing teams from tanking games, it's about another way for the nba to create drama and draw viewers. the entire 'tanking games' talk is nonsense.

NHL actually does have a lottery system for the draft - it's not nearly as complex as the NBA system, but it's there.

[HealyHoya]

sfhoya99 said:

I think they should go back to the original lottery system that they changed after the Magic won it twice in a row. You need some level of parity in the league, but there's no reason the best players should go to the crappiest teams. Here's a tip for West and Ainge -- try actually acquiring good players.

The Jazz, the Pistons, and a whole host of other teams have done it without ever getting the Top pick or perennially being in the lottery.

Darco (or is it Darko). Anyhow, exactly SF, good teams/gm's employ a variety of tools to build and maintain competitive teams.

Detriot did not draft Chauncey, Rasheed or Rip. The Jazz didn't draft Boozer or Okur.

West needs to settle down.

[HoyaFanNY]

this lottery is different. west wanted oden and i can't blame him for complaining. there is a BIG difference between having a shot at oden and the last two years with bargnani and bogut. scrap this lottery sham and go from worst to first.

[SFHoya99]

Actually, the lottery was created specifically because teams were tanking. Does it add more fun? Sure. But it was introduced as an anti-tanking measure.

MLB doesn't need an anti-tanking measure because its draft doesn't have an immediate impact or a particularly good rate of return. The NFL doesn't need it because with only 16 games, the perception of tanking really only exists for a game or two. Plus, with a 53 man roster where you've got thirty significant contributors, the impact of a first rounder is less than in basketball.

In basketball, teams were tanking for 30 games because they think Oden or Durant will instantly turn them into a playoff team. It's horrible for a league that already has an image problem.

[RDF]

hoyafanny said:

the entire lottery process is idiotic. mlb doesn't do it, and the nfl doesn't do it. the lottery isn't about preventing teams from tanking games, it's about another way for the nba to create drama and draw viewers. the entire 'tanking games' talk is nonsense.

Teams shouldn't be rewarded for terrible managment, bad play, and tanking--which Memphis and Boston DID do and if you watch the NBA you would know that. The Lottery gives those teams the best opportunity to win--but it's not assured and it shouldn't be. Jerry West stole Kobe Bryant--in a Draft loaded with talent and did so by trading Vlade Divac to Charlotte for him--so you can acquire superstar players without needing the 1 or 2 pick in the Draft. How is a guy like West going to brag about how deep this draft is a DAY before the lottery and then whine/cry about it after he didn't win is pathetic. All West does is get emotional now--and he needs to either commit or just quit. If he can't take it--get the bleep out.

As for the NBA Draft--Lottery--it's the best process out there. You have the same poorly run teams getting rewarded, hype for the First Round--and then most of your success is coming from guys outside the First Round--which has been moving in that trend for a while now--check out the last 5 lists of First Round picks--some homerun's but a LOT OF STIFFS. In the NBA--all of the teams who don't make the postseason at least get a shot at franchise changing players--not just the same awful franchises--and yet the poorest teams still have best chance with highest percentage of winning it.

When is creating interest in your spot considered BAD? For a league with all comes of negative media coverage and numerous "NBA sucks...." from majority of people who don't watch--this is something that creates/brings interest--how that is bad, I'd like to know?

[HoyaFanNY]

let me get this right. you think an owner, gm, head coach, several assistants, and 12 players all conspired to purposely lose games? the thought of it is ridiculous. coaches lose games they lose their job. players play badly and they lose their jobs. you honestly think they would lose games purposely, risking their job, just so they get a better shot at oden. nonsense.

the raiders could as easily tank the season as you accuse boston or memphis of doing. they started out 0-5. they weren't going to the playoffs. then they lost their last 9 games. how is that different than boston or memphis? paul pierce played just over half of bostons games due to injury (that is 25 ppg) and wally played only 32. so you want to penalize a team for having their top 2 scorers injured a good part of the season. gasol missed a bunch of games with injury also. these are young teams. if you take away their best players, it's common sense that they will lose games. the lottery is a fraud.

[RDF]

hoyafanny said:

let me get this right. you think an owner, gm, head coach, several assistants, and 12 players all conspired to purposely lose games? the thought of it is ridiculous. coaches lose games they lose their job. players play badly and they lose their jobs. you honestly think they would lose games purposely, risking their job, just so they get a better shot at oden. nonsense.

the raiders could as easily tank the season as you accuse boston or memphis of doing. they started out 0-5. they weren't going to the playoffs. then they lost their last 9 games. how is that different than boston or memphis? paul pierce played just over half of bostons games due to injury (that is 25 ppg) and wally played only 32. so you want to penalize a team for having their top 2 scorers injured a good part of the season. gasol missed a bunch of games with injury also. these are young teams. if you take away their best players, it's common sense that they will lose games. the lottery is a fraud.

Watch the games played dude--if you didn't watch--and sure sounds like you didn't--you wouldn't understand. Little things--like being in a game--and for whatever reason not playing your top players--and leaving in scrubs or young players to play at key moments/down the stretch of a game-it's well known that Celtics were angling for the top 2--and Doc Rivers was rewarded for following the order of Danny Ainge--same with Memphis--the reaction of West says it even louder then the fact his team fired Fratello and then went to And1 Mixtape style of ball--they just tanked things so badly it was beyond comprehension.

The Raiders are run by a man who has been dead for 5 years--and they believe in things that no team on the planet does--so come up with a different example. If you can throw it deep, the Raiders love you as a QB--and that is what they have in Russell. They also need a RB, a better OL, and some tough minded WR's who are capable of behaving like professionals, so getting Russell isn't the answer to all of their problems. They also had a defense that was Playoff caliber--their defense is really solid and they tried to win--so how does that relate to what Boston and Memphis were doing on by sitting people on purpose, and playing in a manner that assured you that you would lose?

[SFHoya99]

NY, you obviously did not pay attention to basketball this season.

Players were benched for injuries they admitted they didn't have. It was the biggest joke out there.

[HoyaFanNY]

what players sf? pierce might have elbow surgery this summer and miss the team usa qualifying games. is he faking it? the celtics and grizzlies stunk, plain and simple. boston played without their top 2 scorers most of the season and you expect them not to stink? please. the two of you are either too arrogant or ignorant to realize you're way off base here. oliver stone would be proud of you.

rdf, you just argued against your own point. you said that the celtics and grizzlies shouldn't be rewarded for terrible management, but you have no problem with the raiders being rewarded? they shut down moss and lamont jordan at the end of the season just like boston did pierce. you're being rather hypocritical.

not to mention that your best argument is that i must not have watched that much basketball. that's pretty weak.

[AvantGuardHoya]

I, for one, don’t consider West’s reaction a case of after the fact sour grapes. FWIW, he’s on record as being against the current form of the lottery. Even though his team had the largest percent possibility of landing the number one pick, West still didn’t like the process:

Quote:

''Never have and never will,'' West said.

West believes the worst team should have much better odds of being awarded the top pick. It would give him a much easier feeling about heading to the May 22 Draft Lottery in Secaucus, N.J.


www.commercialappeal.com/mca/basketball/article/0,1426,MCA_466_5537238,00.html

[RDF]

hoyafanny said:

what players sf? pierce might have elbow surgery this summer and miss the team usa qualifying games. is he faking it? the celtics and grizzlies stunk, plain and simple. boston played without their top 2 scorers most of the season and you expect them not to stink? please. the two of you are either too arrogant or ignorant to realize you're way off base here. oliver stone would be proud of you.

rdf, you just argued against your own point. you said that the celtics and grizzlies shouldn't be rewarded for terrible management, but you have no problem with the raiders being rewarded? they shut down moss and lamont jordan at the end of the season just like boston did pierce. you're being rather hypocritical.

not to mention that your best argument is that i must not have watched that much basketball. that's pretty weak.

It's obvious you didn't watch much Boston or Memphis basketball or pay attention to what they were doing and we'll leave it at that.

As for shutting down Lamont Jordan--that actually HELPS the Raiders compete--that guy is GARBAGE and if that is your definition of tanking it, some who oppose you might say that proved they were trying to compete.

Randy Moss shuts himself on/off and that argument ends this discussion. If you want to say that "benching" Randy Moss matters--you don't a single thing about anything. Moss was about as committed to the Raiders as I am in trying to explain this crap to you any longer.

End of discussion and have a nice day.

[SFHoya99]

Hey Fanny:

"Did you happen to catch what Ryan Gomes said after the Bucks beat (or lost to, depending on your point of view) the Celtics?

Gomes scored 13 points in the first three quarters, and then took a seat as Boston clinched the second-worst record to Memphis. "I probably (would have played), but since we were in the hunt for a high draft pick, of course things are different," he said."

Milwaukee Jorunal Sentinel

[HoyaFanNY]

insanity. we will have to agree to disagree on this issue.

[hoyaboy1]

hoyafanny said:

insanity. we will have to agree to disagree on this issue.

Agree to disagree usually means "I'm wrong but am stopping the discussion rather than admitting it."

[Deleted]

hoyaboy1 said:

Agree to disagree usually means "I'm wrong but am stopping the discussion rather than admitting it."

Time to dust off an oldie but goodie... BOOM goes the dynamite!