Historic Upset

[jerseyhoya34]

The press is going to love the UCONN loss. Unbelievable game. Have at it.

Now, I don't think we'll hear as much about the GU/Princeton game.

[RockawayHoya]

Easy one there.

[DFW HOYA]

The comparisons will go back to that 1979 Penn team that went through Rutgers, St. John's, and UNC.

Ironically, there's a ESPN special this week on Villanova-Georgetown as the defining NCAA upset. Guess that idea needs to be retired once and for all.

[AustinHoya03]

No. The 1985 final was bigger. Love GMU and this was a HUGE upset, just not the biggest ever.

[RockawayHoya]

dfw said:

Ironically, there's a ESPN special this week on Villanova-Georgetown as the defining NCAA upset. Guess that idea needs to be retired once and for all.

If GMU wins the nat'l title, absolutely no question about that.

[NorthCarolinaHOYA]

Yes a great win form George Mason. Being a life long hoya fan i'm kind of stunned how LSU and George Mason can get to the final four and Georgetown can't. Seems like other schools get all the breaks and we simply don't. I wonder how this will effect the balance of basketabll in this area.

[theEDGEfactor]

one of the biggest upsets in NCAA tounry history

[RockawayHoya]

Speaking of history...

Has there ever been a year where no number one seeds made it to the final four? I can't remember one, off the top of my head.

[DFW HOYA]

northcarolinahoya said:

I wonder how this will effect the balance of basketabll in this area.

It doesn't affect the balance of power in the short term--Georgetown and Maryland still have the press coverage and, if anything, it probably minimizes GW's outstanding season but early round exit.

What it does allow is for more visibility to GMU in scheduling, in national recruiting, and in TV appearances. Suddenly, ESPN is interested in a GMU-Georgetown game notwithstanding the GW fans throwing up their hands in utter frustration.

As for the John Feinstein Gary Williams Invitational opting not to invite Mason back in 2006 for a Maryland-Notre Dame and GW-Virginia Tech doubleheader instead, well, that's three NIT teams on the bill.

[RDF]

Let's schedule a tournament with GU, George Mason, and 2 other teams and see which tournament draws better?? Screw the Twerps and Hobbits.

[NorthCarolinaHOYA]

DFW, thanks for your insight and i need your response to calm me down a little. Don't get me wrong. GM played a great game and i take nothing away from them. The fans have been great and i girl i'm trying to date attends the university so i'm on my way now over to the campus. It couldnt have happen to a better team than UCONN. I hope this game POPS that programs bubble once for all and i hope they have a hard time recovering from this. I just want our HOYA's to one get back to the final four and for once start kicking UCONNs but again.

[MCIGuy]

Amen to RDF.

The only area team of the Big Three that really has to worry is George Washington. Maryland and Gtown have legacies and power conferences (plus plenty of TV time) to shield them. The Colonials do not. George Washington's season in which they got way too much coverage from the media considering the teams they played, is virtually forgotten about except for the negatives of the recent storylines considering where a couple of their players came from. That may not be fair but life often isn't.

George Mason's victory becomes part of NCAA legend which means Larranaga will be both a local celebrity/legend and a national one for the rest of his life. His coaching job may go down as the very best coaching ever for an NCAA tourney (although its the players who make it happen during game time). Larranaga, as a respected coach, vaults ahead of the locals III and Hobbs and draws even with Gary Williams. I trust III will make his mark in the next few seasons so its not that big a deal to me. Larranaga certainly is more lovable than Gary Williams and the media will come to him on a more regular basis and there will be superior coverage for George Mason....especially if Larranaga stays.

This defeat will eat at Jim Calhoun leading to one of a few possibilities:

1)Calhoun will be emotionally spent after the empty showing he got from his "Compromise Season" and will retire quicker than he expected.
2)Calhoun will have to take a hard look in the mirror and take a step back and realize he doesn't need to sell his soul for a championship. He will then bring i his kind of players and try for another shot.
3)Calhoun will try to block out the pain of the defeat by going all out on the recruiting trail and loading up like never before to give him that third championship which he will believe the committee stole from him by placing GMU in the Washington bracket.

Is it the greatest upset of all time? Hard to say only because of the fact that GMU had beaten two power house teams earlier in the tourney and had home court advantage against UConn. Toss up.

[RusskyHoya]

It's a big upset, but I feel like the 15 over 2 upsets were bigger, as was Penn's run, the '85 Nova thing, etc. Let's not forget that GMU had, for all intents and purposes, home games for the rounds of 16 and 8. That doesn't take away from the magnitude of what they've accomplished, but it's a factor to keep in mind.

[RDF]

Now some will laugh at this statement, but I really didn't view their wins against Michigan State and UNC as upsets--to me Mason was the better team. They proved it twice against Wichita State, and I'd rather have Mason's backcourt then UConn's. I think Marcus Williams was best player on court, but I think Mason had more talent at guard then Uconn when it came to people who could make plays and especially handle the basketball.

What you are seeing is a lot of poor guard play/recruiting from Power Conference Schools. It's where the difference can be made up and as great as Will Thomas was today--the play of Skinn, Campbell, and Butler was difference between the teams and allowed them to have shot. Those guys were flat out better then 3 other teams they played and Michigan State didn't even belong in this tournament if you watched them play all year--they stunk. UNC was not that good either--and to me Mason was as good but far superior in backcourt.

What impressed me was how the Patriot bigs held their own and didn't back down--standing ovation for them and just great to see kids fight/claw. They played with the heart/toughness that I love seeing in a team--when a guy was knocked down, they raced over to pick him up. When a guy made a play, they fed off it. It is beautiful basketball to watch.

BTW---two best games I saw this year were at MCI--our win over Duke and today's game. Great basketball and happy for Mason--hope they win it all!

[DanMcQ]

Sorry, but not much compares to Texas Western's upset of Kentucky (and there's even a movie about that ).

Also, LSU went to the Final 4 twenty years ago as an 11 seed so that's been done before.

I have to say that even thought it destroyed my bracket, it was sweet to see UConnvict bite the dust. What was Denham Brown thinking when he pulled back for a three? He had plenty of time to drive in for a layup. Also nice to see Mr. Laptop get called for palming the ball at a crucial moment (although he palms the ball every time he has it so it's a little inconsistent to wait to call it then).

All in all, a great day for area basketball.

[MCIGuy]

Forgot to mention...earlier this week Feinstein wrote that Gary Williams and Jim Larranaga don't exactly get along. Who other than Williams could ahve issues with Larranaga? The only reason why Williams isn't upset over this victory by GMU is because of the guy who was coaching the other team and a certain player on that same team.

[jcshoya82]

Sort of echoing RDF's statement: Will Thomas was a beast today. I can't express to this board how much I love when it is so blatently obvious who wants the ball off the boards. Thomas was that guy today.

As far as the Michigan St. and UNC games not being upsets...I wouldn't go quite that far...but they are a great team. There is no doubt about that.

[GIGAFAN99]

rdf said:

Now some will laugh at this statement, but I really didn't view their wins against Michigan State and UNC as upsets--to me Mason was the better team. They proved it twice against Wichita State, and I'd rather have Mason's backcourt then UConn's. I think Marcus Williams was best player on court, but I think Mason had more talent at guard then Uconn when it came to people who could make plays and especially handle the basketball.

What you are seeing is a lot of poor guard play/recruiting from Power Conference Schools. It's where the difference can be made up and as great as Will Thomas was today--the play of Skinn, Campbell, and Butler was difference between the teams and allowed them to have shot. Those guys were flat out better then 3 other teams they played and Michigan State didn't even belong in this tournament if you watched them play all year--they stunk. UNC was not that good either--and to me Mason was as good but far superior in backcourt.

What impressed me was how the Patriot bigs held their own and didn't back down--standing ovation for them and just great to see kids fight/claw. They played with the heart/toughness that I love seeing in a team--when a guy was knocked down, they raced over to pick him up. When a guy made a play, they fed off it. It is beautiful basketball to watch.

BTW---two best games I saw this year were at MCI--our win over Duke and today's game. Great basketball and happy for Mason--hope they win it all!

True, on the first part. I thought that 4-pack of Murray St., UNC, MSU, and George Mason was as balanced as I've ever seen. Murray St. could have even been in the Sweet 16 just as easily as the other 3.

[RDF]

Living in Big 10 land--that was no upset. Spartans stunk all year and were getting credit for last year when fact is they lost Alan Anderson, Torbert, and Chris Hill which isn't to say they were great players--but they gave them more options then just Ager, Brown, and Davis. If you were picking teams, you rather have Neitzel or Lamar Butler?? Will Thomas or Delco Rowley? Jai Lewis cancelled out Paul Davis and in my opinion has better basketball IQ, and Folarin Campbell is superior to Ager as an all around player--Ager is a gunner who isn't a great shooter. Fact Skinn didn't play proves who was better too.

As for UNC--Bobby Frasor, Danny Green, Wes Miller, and Marcus Ginyard aren't as good as the Mason backcourt.

Hansbrough is a fine player but Noel and Terry are role players.

Wichita State got spanked twice--no argument there from anyone.

Today was an upset--but I'd still take Mason's backcourt over UConn's in terms of depth and versatility. If you have a great backcourt you have a shot against anyone. If you have good frontcourt with it, you can go to Final Four and win it all. Teams like LSU have thrown a wrench into this formula but let's see how things unfold as I'd take Mason's team over LSU's in terms of who could/would have success in this format over longer period. Guards give you a shot, bigs can dominate and still lose--that's why LSU barely beat a marginal Texas A&M team. You give LSU a dominant guard and they win this tournament hands down.

[mapei]

Back to the biggest upset in NCAA history (since Texas Western, OK), for me it has to be NC State over Phi Slamma Jamma in '83, much less likely than Nova over Georgetown given that Nova had already given us very tough games in the regular season.

Oddly, the only thing that NC State victory is remembered for is Valvano running around the court afterward. People remember the Nova game because GTown was so hated and the country so glad to see us lose.