RDF
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 8,835
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Post by RDF on Mar 4, 2006 22:45:45 GMT -5
If you were in HoyaChat during the game with a lot of the same people who have posted on this board after the game, you would know that Brandon was indeed" thrown under the bus." Repeatedly. Every time he made a good play, someone would say "finally" or "about time." And every time he did something bad, they'd be calling for him to be removed from the team. And I'm sick of it. Is he our savior? No. Did he play poorly tonight? You bet he did. But goddamnit, he doesn't deserve about 80% of the crap he's gotten every time we lose, especially if the entire team was asleep for 40 minutes. But I completely agree with the total lack of effort. I just don't agree with placing the blame on one guy when the entire team and coaching staff should all be at fault for not coming out with a better performance tonight. The reason the focus continually goes back to Bowman is simple......he is SUPPOSED to be the leader of this team. Why? He is a senior who "supposedly" has NBA aspirations- that should be the type of player the rest of the team can look to and count on when times get tough and when others are slipping. Look at other teams who played in tough games today and see who stepped up. WVU/Cincy- Gansey, Pittsnoggle, Hicks and White....all seniors, all stepped up. UConn/Ville- Anderson and Brown stepped up for UConn....you guessed it, seniors!! Wash/Arizona- Brandon Roy had a big game......yup, senior. These are 3 of many games where teams were in close games, in March, with tournament appearances and seedings at stake and each time there were seniors who stepped up and delivered for their teams. Ours didn't. Can we be too hard on these kids sometimes? Probably, but I would think that would be OK. If I were one of the players on this team, the time I'd be worried is when fans of the team stopped caring what I did. We expect more from Brandon and that should make him proud and happy that there are so many fans out there who think he can be a great player. After a loss like this, they should expect their fans to be Editeded.....if no one cared about the outcome of this game, that wouldn't be much of a fanbase, would it? Imagine coming back after this game and checking this board and seeing everyone talking about how they didn't really care that we lost or that it was OK that our senior leader had 8 turnovers because we can't expect too much from him or that seedings and tournament appearances don't matter to us......would you want to play for fans like that? Not me. I would want my fans to be angry as hell and expect more out of me next time- if they didn't, I'd wonder what kind of fans they really were. The bottom line is that at this level of college basketball and especially at this time of year, seniors.....especially 4-year starter seniors who have ideas about the NBA....are supposed to step up and lead the team. This hasn't happened and we, as fans, have a right to be upset and to express our displeasure. In fact, we owe it to the team to do JUST that. AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! May I add that Bowman and SR's should understand even more due to fact they played in most apathetic time in recent GU history--the last year of Esherick's tenure. Nobody cared--we were a joke, and people would've not only expected this loss, there would've been about 10 of us who would've posted--because that is about all that was left towards the end--before Esh's firing was announced. So Bowman should realize that fans do care--they do expect more and as Highsmith said--it's due to his ability and possibilities as a player--not that we don't think he's decent--he can be very solid but he's inconsistent and doesn't understand HOW to play the game--which isn't all tied to scoring. Good basketball and leadership is about doing whatever it takes to WIN--which he's often disappeared and failed to do.
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Post by RockawayHoya on Mar 4, 2006 22:52:51 GMT -5
If you were in HoyaChat during the game with a lot of the same people who have posted on this board after the game, you would know that Brandon was indeed" thrown under the bus." Repeatedly. Every time he made a good play, someone would say "finally" or "about time." And every time he did something bad, they'd be calling for him to be removed from the team. And I'm sick of it. Is he our savior? No. Did he play poorly tonight? You bet he did. But goddamnit, he doesn't deserve about 80% of the crap he's gotten every time we lose, especially if the entire team was asleep for 40 minutes. But I completely agree with the total lack of effort. I just don't agree with placing the blame on one guy when the entire team and coaching staff should all be at fault for not coming out with a better performance tonight. The reason the focus continually goes back to Bowman is simple......he is SUPPOSED to be the leader of this team. Why? He is a senior who "supposedly" has NBA aspirations- that should be the type of player the rest of the team can look to and count on when times get tough and when others are slipping. Look at other teams who played in tough games today and see who stepped up. WVU/Cincy- Gansey, Pittsnoggle, Hicks and White....all seniors, all stepped up. UConn/Ville- Anderson and Brown stepped up for UConn....you guessed it, seniors!! Wash/Arizona- Brandon Roy had a big game......yup, senior. These are 3 of many games where teams were in close games, in March, with tournament appearances and seedings at stake and each time there were seniors who stepped up and delivered for their teams. Ours didn't. Can we be too hard on these kids sometimes? Probably, but I would think that would be OK. If I were one of the players on this team, the time I'd be worried is when fans of the team stopped caring what I did. We expect more from Brandon and that should make him proud and happy that there are so many fans out there who think he can be a great player. After a loss like this, they should expect their fans to be Editeded.....if no one cared about the outcome of this game, that wouldn't be much of a fanbase, would it? Imagine coming back after this game and checking this board and seeing everyone talking about how they didn't really care that we lost or that it was OK that our senior leader had 8 turnovers because we can't expect too much from him or that seedings and tournament appearances don't matter to us......would you want to play for fans like that? Not me. I would want my fans to be angry as hell and expect more out of me next time- if they didn't, I'd wonder what kind of fans they really were. The bottom line is that at this level of college basketball and especially at this time of year, seniors.....especially 4-year starter seniors who have ideas about the NBA....are supposed to step up and lead the team. This hasn't happened and we, as fans, have a right to be upset and to express our displeasure. In fact, we owe it to the team to do JUST that. Everything you've said is true, except that we've already discussed Brandon's "lack of leadership" mentality before. He wasn't chosen as a captain AS A SENIOR this year for a reason. Opposing teams don't game plan around Brandon, they do so against Jeff or Roy. While BB is an integral part of our team and plays a major role in whether or not we win or lose, he should not carry the brunt of the blame for a loss in which 99.9% of us DIDN'T SEE. Aside from the turnovers, BB did not have a poor game, and as FL already pointed out either in this thread or another, 2 or 3 of them were unwarranted and bad calls. So while BB does deserve criticism along with many of his teammates for giving a subpar effort, he is NOT the reason we lost tonight.
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miamihoya
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 698
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Post by miamihoya on Mar 5, 2006 3:36:19 GMT -5
I totallly agree with Way's first post on this board. Im okay with constructive criticism and what not. But is just seems liks every time we lose one game (whether it be South Florida or Villanova) everyone starts jumping off the wagon and declaring what a failure the team and season has been. Should we have lost today? No. But at the same time, most teams at our level (that being good teams, but not ELITE teams) lose one or two games in the season that they should of won. This is our game (vandy would be the next closest). Other than this we have won every game we were supposed to win, and a few we werent. Yes it was a tough loss and a poor effort on the court today (I was at the game and saw it first hand), but I truly believe we are still very capable of perfoming well in the Big East and NCAA tourney. Lets not forget that just three days before beating Duke we were one shot away from losing to USF in an equally lackluster performance.
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AvantGuardHoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
"It was when I found out I could make mistakes that I knew I was on to something."
Posts: 1,481
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Post by AvantGuardHoya on Mar 5, 2006 6:40:08 GMT -5
I have a tremendous problem with the carelessness with which certain posts are written. I try to be very specific with mine and greatly appreciate it when others do the same. I don’t often indulge in attacks on players or posters. I do, however, try my best to get clarity when someone makes a point I disagree with. I boarded the Hoya bus in 1979 and haven’t once thought about getting off. And we all know there’ve been some tough times since then. Last season served to raise my hopes that we could play with the big boys again. Recruiting success and our results this year have only confirmed that sense. I’m thrilled that Macklin, Summers, et al are coming. I had tix to see a handful of wins this year that were very encouraging, including the Duke, Cincy and ‘Cuse contests. In short I’m as dyed-in-the-wool as any Hoya fanatic. Having said that, when we lose it bothers me. Always has and probably always will. I can be philosophical about certain defeats, but there are some that are inexplicable to me. Last night will be Exhibit A for a long time. By no means do I consider it the end of the world and I’m certainly not ragging on the team, specific players or Coach, but no one should try to gloss over this egregious loss. We should all be embarrassed by it. I am certain the team and Coach are. Losing to UConn, ‘Nova, WVa, even Marquette and Vandy I can almost ( ) accept. But USF? You must be smokin’ something! I will repeat what I wrote in another thread, though I suspect many, if not most of you, know this already: the last place Bulls had lost 17 in a row. Earlier in the season they’d lost to such heavyweights Texas A & M- Corpus Christi, Florida International and the MEAC’s own Bethune-Cookman, among others. We may not have arrived at the mountaintop yet, but surely we're on a higher plateau than those also rans. And you want me to act like this is just another “freakin’ loss”? Maybe I should ask what are you drinkin’!! Again, I’m not ready to jump off what used to be known as the Calvert Street Bridge (it’s now the Ellington Bridge, for those who care). I’m most appreciative of the progress that has been made and the brightness of the future. But the egg that was laid last night in Florida stinks so bad it will still smell in NYC at least through Wednesday. Maybe you got some funk spray that masks the odor….
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on Mar 5, 2006 11:30:14 GMT -5
I second TheWay.
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Filo
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,910
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Post by Filo on Mar 5, 2006 12:06:56 GMT -5
Losing to UConn, ‘Nova, WVa, even Marquette and Vandy I can almost ( ) accept. But USF? You must be smokin’ something! I will repeat what I wrote in another thread, though I suspect many, if not most of you, know this already: the last place Bulls had lost 17 in a row. Earlier in the season they’d lost to such heavyweights Texas A & M- Corpus Christi, Florida International and the MEAC’s own Bethune-Cookman, among others. We may not have arrived at the mountaintop yet, but surely we're on a higher plateau than those also rans. And you want me to act like this is just another “freakin’ loss”? Maybe I should ask what are you drinkin’!! You are right that the loss was indefensible, horrible, should never have happened, et al. But I can almost understand losing to USF -- they played us tight last time, they gave UConn a hard time and seemed to be playing well despite their record, it was their Senior Night, etc. (NOT defending it, making excuses for it or saying it was somehow acceptable -- because it was most definitely NOT). But what completely boggles my mind is how much the Hoyas had to play for and they still apparently did not give the effort. We have seen all the criticisms / explanations (seniors lack leadership, Green was sick, etc.) but I have to lay this one on the coaching staff. I love JTIII and I am thrilled with how he has turned this program around. But it is up to the coach to make sure the players are ready. They apparently were not.
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SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
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Post by SirSaxa on Mar 5, 2006 12:31:08 GMT -5
Wow. Some astonishing things are happening! First, GU loses a game that few of us imagined they could/would. Next, I find myself in agreement with both TheWay and EasyEd on the same day! It was an awful loss. Should never have happened. But it did. One awful, disappointing, lousy, tough-to-take loss. One. Now let's get back on track and back to business at MSG. Finally, FILO, no question the Staff deserves criticism for this game. But regardless of the staff, the players knew how important the game was. This loss is shared by everyone, HC, assistants, and team.
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Filo
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 3,910
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Post by Filo on Mar 5, 2006 13:10:23 GMT -5
I'm with you Sir Saxa! In fact, I am done thinking about the loss. Focus on Weds. and let's see what happens. If they bring a better effort and play the way they can, there is no reason the Hoyas can't make it past Thursday, at least.
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EasyEd
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
Posts: 7,272
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Post by EasyEd on Mar 5, 2006 13:30:16 GMT -5
SirSaxa - if you agree with TheWay and me on this one, you must go back and re-examine your position.
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SirSaxa
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 747
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Post by SirSaxa on Mar 5, 2006 13:39:12 GMT -5
SirSaxa - if you agree with TheWay and me on this one, you must go back and re-examine your position. LMAO! You're right again EasyEd! Let me get to work researching this right away. This may take a while!
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