Job for Craig???OT

[1803]

The LaSalle job is there for the taking after Fran Dunphy turned it down. The school had to fire to slime bags who did their best to cover up rape charges against men's basketball players.

Craig Esherick always ran a clean program at Georgetown, and he obviously has major head coaching experience. LaSalle plays in a good conference, and they have the magic of the Big 5 games, and they are a Catholic School.

LaSalle is said to be looking at O'Hanlon from Lafayette, even though he just signed a looong extension a few weeks ago. I will be interested to see if his name pops up, and I am sure that the people at the school would like to see someone who knows how to run a clean program in a big time conference on the sidelines.

[kghoya]

sounds like a perfect job for craig...he wouldnt be asked to win games right off the bat...just dont let the team get into any trouble...i think he can handle that

[Hilltopper]

Good thought 1803...seems like Craig thought so too. Now that a coach has been named, it can be told that a former Hoya was in touch with the Explorers about moving to Philly...didn't go very far, though.

[SSHoya]

No job for Esherick. Post reports today that John Giannini former University of Maine coach has taken over "the tainted La Salle program."

[RDF]

No offense guys, but why would LaSalle or any other D1 Program want Esherick as a Head Coach? The man has nothing to offer a program. He's a poor coach and his track record consists of one Head Coaching position that was given to him out of loyalty and at the recommendation of Coach JT.

Maybe some fans will realize just how putrid of a Coach this man was when they see he'll never be offered/interviewed for a D1 job. I'd go so far as to say he wouldn't get much looks at D2 as well. A nice place for him would be in High School ranks. However, I also believe it will be a time for him to use that Law Degree that he always brought up when criticized--"Hey, I don't need coaching......INSERT LAW SCHOOL REFERENCE".

I'd venture to say Esh should go into Law or form one half of the future WWE Tag Team Champions with his brother the Bonecrusher Blake. They could be called the Hoya Destroyas and their signature moves would be Esh's "FIST-DOUBLE FIST" which involves him going off top rope and landing a series of fists to the head, and Blake's infamous "Tear The Sign, Cry and Whine" which involves him tearing signs of detractors and crying/whining so loud he makes opponents submit. Their Manager who would escort them to ring would be Mary Fenlon.

I know it's cold but the misery this man brought to my favorite basketball team has made me happy that we can actually speculate on what he will be doing instead of coaching the Hoyas. And LaSalle made two wise moves--not hiring him and cleaning up the program by firing those degenerates who tried to cover up rape.

[DFW HOYA]

That's unnecessary, RDF. No need to run him down anymore than he has been already.

He's still a Georgetown alumnus, you know, and while his failure to evolve beyond the Thompson system cost him his job, he ran a clean program. He will coach again somewhere at some level, and I hope he succeeds doing so.

[EasyEd]

Ditto, DFW.

[FromTheBeginning]

Also, no need to throw Mary under the bus.

[RDF]

It was also unnecessary for this man to take the Head Coaching Job at Georgetown. So with that, comes expectations and criticism. If it's too much, don't do it. Face it DFW, the guy sucked as a Basketball Coach and what School in D1 will look at him? For what reason? Being a nice man? Being able to run a clean program? There are plenty of people in D1 who run a clean program and can COACH basketball as well. Your excuses for this guy are lame.

Let me get this straight, it's okay for people to criticize or bash guys like Iverson, Victor Page, Kenny Brunner (which I have done when I agreed with reasons given) but you can't bash Esherick? I didn't start this thread on Esh's job prospects in Coaching, I just brought some reality to the situation--he won't be offered a D1 job by anyone. I suggested he coach HS where he'd be a better fit. He can also be a Lawyer, but he's not a quality basketball coach and I dont' care if he's from GU, he stunk. So did Chip Simms. It's not being harsh if it's a fact.

After the way he "Dared" GU to do something, lost the team, and taunted fans with his "Esh-ysburgh Address" which consisted of "I'm not going anywhere and I'll be here 30 more years if I want", I don't care what happens to him, if he's successful, and where he ends up. This is a forum for Hoya fans and some like him and wish him well--see above--and some don't see my posts and the Silent Majority who have more class and tact than I do. When it comes to Esherick, he got what he deserved and good riddance!

[1803]

I agree, no reason to jump all over the guy.

I just thought it would be a good job for him because he has experience at a mafor program, and ran what was by all accounts a clean program.

The first thing a school needs to do coming off a scandal as atrocious as the one at LaSalle is hire someone who the community, and the media knows is going to run things on the up and up so the school doesn't have to have its name dragged through the mud again.

It is a moot point now that LaSalle has made their move, but according to one poster there was contact to gauge the interest, and it made sense on some levels.

[SFHoya99]

1803 said:

I agree, no reason to jump all over the guy.

I just thought it would be a good job for him because he has experience at a mafor program, and ran what was by all accounts a clean program.

The first thing a school needs to do coming off a scandal as atrocious as the one at LaSalle is hire someone who the community, and the media knows is going to run things on the up and up so the school doesn't have to have its name dragged through the mud again.

It is a moot point now that LaSalle has made their move, but according to one poster there was contact to gauge the interest, and it made sense on some levels.

In honest discussion, there are plenty of clean coaches who are also better basketball coaches than Esherick. You can always find someone better than Esherick.

As for RDF, I suppose the rest of you are right. We should show Esherick more respect. But everyone on this board has criticized people endlessly, and Esherick being is the only one who gets a free pass? That's BS. Esherick is always painted as a "nice guy" but he struck me as not a nice person at all. Arrogant, intractable, disrepectful or his players and the fans. Maybe he was a nice guy. Maybe it was just the bad situation.

But if we're coming down on RDF for criticizing him, be sure not to be critical of anyone else when posting. I sure as heck couldn't do it.

[RDF]

What the LaSalle Program needed was a Basketball Coach who runs a clean program and can coach basketball. The previous coach was fired for his failures as a coach as much as the incident. If LaSalle was having the success of St. Joe's this would've never happened. I'm not saying it's right, but it's reality. Schools are not as "Holier than Thou" as they act. This was an "out" for them to get rid of a lousy coach and from all appearances, a lousy human being. So they did so. But if John Calipari or Bob Huggins (two more degenerates) wanted the job, I have a feeling they would have been hired in a minute.

Now what troubles me is how some people still don't understand how awful Esherick was as a Coach. I'm not saying you have to dislike him to the point I do, but to honestly feel he is in line for a D1 job with his lack of ability as a coach, is what has me curious? He always gets the "He's a nice guy, etc...." well I'm of the belief you show your true self when adversity hits, and we saw the "Esh":

1. Brag about his abilties as a Coach
2. Taunt the Fans
3. Dare the Administration to Fire Him

This is a nice guy/classy person? Does he care about GU? Sure. Did he do his best? Sure. It's just for that reason he stinks. His best effort was taking GU to a level where the program was 2-3 years from Patriot League. I love GU. I would do my best, but I don't believe I have the qualifications to coach the Hoyas and that makes me different from Esh. I know my own limitations. He didn't. He also got an ego so big he felt he was doing "something nobody else could do". Well let's see how JT III does and if he isn't any better, then onto someone else. That is how it works and should work.

Esherick is a Sacred Cow to many of the people on this board. I'm tired of the fact that he's teflon while others--including former athletes on the GU teams have to take a beating. I don't have a problem with them being criticized and DFW you don't have a problem with criticizing III as you have a few times already, but I thank the Hoops Gods we have a new coach and one with goals and attitude that things aren't terrible and wanting to be a top tier program. The Esh just made excuses, alienated players and fans, and brought this program to a level we hadn't seen since 1970.

So forgive me for not seeing why anyone would want him, why he deserves another shot, and why anyone located in a Competitive level of Basketball would think of hiring him. Funny thing is DFW said that "All of the complaining won't change a thing, Esh's going nowhere", so we stayed relatively calm. Well looks like the complaining worked, because we have a new coach, more top tier recruits have visited GU in past 5 months than in Esherick's entire tenure, and we have a Staff focused on what can be done, not what is holding them back.

Negativity works in many ways and I see as much regarding other topics as I've posted on Esherick. He's not void of taking crap just because he's gone. Iverson is gone and nobody said a thing when I trashed him for being irresponsible a few weeks ago?? Guess it's an Esh Thang, I wouldn't/couldn't understand. (and thank God I don't!)

[1803]

Allow me to clarify my position.

I do not think that Esh is a good coach, and I am glad the he is no longer the head coach at Georgetown.

LaSalle was in a special situation, where their coach was forced out because of ethical violations that go way beyond the normal monkey business involved in big time basketball. This had to do with sexual assault, which is something that goes way beyond the basketball court. Any university employee trying to cover up something like this woudl have been fired. So LaSalle was left in a spot where their biggest problem was the perception of running a filthy program.

No one can deny these two facts about Craig Esherick:
1) He was the head coach at a major program for the last five years.

2) He ran what was by all accounts a clean program.

I thought that these two things would fulfill some of the major criteria that LaSalle was looking for.

[SFHoya99]

1803 said:

Allow me to clarify my position.

I do not think that Esh is a good coach, and I am glad the he is no longer the head coach at Georgetown.

LaSalle was in a special situation, where their coach was forced out because of ethical violations that go way beyond the normal monkey business involved in big time basketball. This had to do with sexual assault, which is something that goes way beyond the basketball court. Any university employee trying to cover up something like this woudl have been fired. So LaSalle was left in a spot where their biggest problem was the perception of running a filthy program.

No one can deny these two facts about Craig Esherick:
1) He was the head coach at a major program for the last five years.

2) He ran what was by all accounts a clean program.

I thought that these two things would fulfill some of the major criteria that LaSalle was looking for.

Certainly they do.

I think LaSalle would prefer this:

1) Clean, no hint of scandal
2) Chance to have the team win

Why take a coach with no hint of scandal, but who helped run a successful program into the ground, when you could find someone clean but either a positive track record of winning or even someone with potential to win?

I guess that's my point. I also don't understand why Craig gets painted as a nice guy. Maybe these folks know him, and he is, but I don't. I'm not sure why he gets the benefit of the doubt and Iverson doesn't, as RDF pointed out. Both have a lot od evidence out there that they have some personality weaknesses. If we aren't allowed to comment on one, we shouldn't be able to on the other. (But I'd prefer we do on both).

[Cambridge]

No disrespect RDF, but I wouldn't say that there was no one coming to AI's defense. In fact your thread lit up quite a discussion.

[hoyarooter]

I hear that Ric Flair is going to change his name to Esheric Flair so he can team with Esh in WWE. Has a nice ring, doesn't it? The figure four and the double fist sound like an unbeatable combination to me.

[jerseyhoya34]

hoyarooter said:

I hear that Ric Flair is going to change his name to Esheric Flair so he can team with Esh in WWE. Has a nice ring, doesn't it? The figure four and the double fist sound like an unbeatable combination to me.

You know what's funny... There are now Ric Flair action figure doll ads in the Google ads on this website. Haha! Smart marketing... Woo!

[jerseyhoya34]

DFW said:

That's unnecessary, RDF. No need to run him down anymore than he has been already.

He's still a Georgetown alumnus, you know, and while his failure to evolve beyond the Thompson system cost him his job, he ran a clean program. He will coach again somewhere at some level, and I hope he succeeds doing so.

I think RDF's post is a by-product of what the Esherick years engendered among the Hoya fandom. I'll be honest that it turned off many people to the degree that they have tuned out and may not come back to the table. On a fan board, the fact that RDF is still tuned in is important, but he seems to be one of the folks who was turned off by the Esherick regime. He wrote of the "Silent Majority" in Hoya-land, and I think it is an interesting comment considering the outpouring of support that an online petition received without a shred of coordination among Hoya listservs and so forth. A similar petition at a larger school in the BE received signatures numbering in the hundreds, and they opened it up to non-alumni if I'm not mistaken. What's more is that this school had a coach who was perhaps worse than Esherick.

Maybe RDF was a little harsh in his rhetoric, but at the heart of what he says about Esherick's record is a statement about Esherick's lack of success. Is anyone willing to debate against it on the merits?

At the heart of what RDF posted is also a statement about some unfortunate conduct by someone close to Esherick. Is anyone willing to debate that such action did not take place?

Your statement about running people down more than they have been run down is something with which I sympathize. After all, Esherick said that he "resented the hell" out of folks who count wins and losses as a signal of his performance as a coach and seemingly passed us off as folks who don't care about the academics. In doing so, he also questioned our knowledge about basketball in an "on the record" format. On his way out the door, he questioned DeGioia's honesty because he initially gave his support to Esherick but changed that after Esherick verbally attacked the fans in a public setting. This was all unnecessary and inappropriate.

Unfortunately, some folks on this board did not call Esherick out for that tirade but call RDF out now. That, it seems, is the uncontroversial position. It is an easy position to have RDF is a fairly anonymous person, so it is easy to call him out, but stand up to the establishment in a way that is public and transparent and that is taboo.

I must admit that I do not have much sympathy for the Esherick defense because he embarassed himself in the media and called out the fans who had the temerity to suggest that he was an awful coach. In my mind, he is not the kind of person who I would defend given his ego and disregard for facts as it relates to college basketball. I don't have much sympathy for cronyism, which, I would suggest, was in play to some degree.

Anyway, I'm willing to keep the discussion clean, but let's allow a debate on the facts.

[DFW HOYA]

Interesting topic.

RDF said:

I don't have a problem with them being criticized and DFW you don't have a problem with criticizing III as you have a few times already, but I thank the Hoops Gods we have a new coach and one with goals and attitude that things aren't terrible and wanting to be a top tier program.

A few times already? At the time of the announcement, based on some e-mails from sources I received that questioned the hiring process, I held back on any comments on JT3 until learning more about how it was handled. Following Frank Rienzo's detailed explantion of same, I have no ongoing issues with how the process was handled. What else am I criticizing him for? Frankly, not much has been going on...hiring assistant coaches, a few recruits, not much else.

The Esh just made excuses, alienated players and fans, and brought this program to a level we hadn't seen since 1970.

(Actually, I think you mean 1972. 1970 was a pretty good year by the then-contemporary standards.)Nonetheless, the pre-2001 Esherick was generally tolerated on this board for letting the sun shine in on the program a little more than it had been under JT2, for improving the recruiting, talking up McDonough improvements, improving GU's stature in the local media, etc. Sometime after the 2001 NCAA's, for reasons I'm not sure why, the Esherick staff retreated to a bunker mentality.

Funny thing is DFW said that "All of the complaining won't change a thing, Esh's going nowhere", so we stayed relatively calm. Well looks like the complaining worked, because we have a new coach, more top tier recruits have visited GU in past 5 months than in Esherick's entire tenure, and we have a Staff focused on what can be done, not what is holding them back.

Now there's a point of dispute. (Was this board calm ? )

First, as late as March 5th, or 11 days before he was fired, there was nothing to suggest there was any institutional will to fire Craig Esherick and eat his contract. Jack DeGioia said as much and I take him at his word.

What changed? The petition? Losing to Virginia Tech? No, none of these. What changed is Craig's Mar. 6 quotes in the Associated Press which was a visible affront to DeGioia's leadership. He declared himself off-limits, which is a bad thing to do in any event, and really bad to do in print.

When I was at the BC game the following week and saw two very prominent alumni sitting with Jack that afternoon, I told a fellow classmate that something was probably up. And it was.

My original post was meant to say that you don't have to like Esherick as a coach but show him some basic respect as an Georgetown alumnus, and not resort to cheap laughs better suited for opposing teams and the Timberwolves.

He's moved on. So should we.

[RDF]

DFW, I think you have taken a few shots at III and the one that really was uncalled for was when you took issue with him saying "Our facilities are fine..." and while I agree with you about GU needing to improve this area, why bash someone who isn't going to sulk over what he doesn't have? You can't change things if you whine/complain about what others have compared to your program. It's eye of beholder and to me Duke is an interesting example. If you looked at Duke pre-Coach K Cameron Indoor was known for being small, dumpy, place that most kids ignored in favor of UNC, and other program's superior facilities. Even with it being on campus, other programs would out-recruit them for players because they had something to sell--winning.
III is doing the smart thing, keep things positive and if you can do that, get some talent, and win, MCI will have more fans and donations start to help. The only to reach an Elite Level is to build it right-- hard work and believing. By taking him to task for having a good attitude and NOT making excuses was a shot in my opinion.

As for my take on Esherick's meltdown the constant attacks and pressure being put on him led him to breaking down. It's obvious when someone is in over their head and by sitting back and not being proactive, he might have had another 2-3 years to take this program down further. Fans opinions turned uglier as he proved time and time again he couldn't coach and then the EXCUSES came out. Most people will accept others mistakes better when they own up to them. But he made excuses and that leads to more "Venom". When it got worse, he lashed out and basically committed career suicide. Do you honestly believe the fans attacks and hostility didn't play a major part in him breaking down and lashing out??

For a long time on the site you said we were talking to "Deaf Ears". Well it's amazing what persistence can do and to finally see this man leave GU is one of the brightest days this program has seen in a decade. (that's how sad things have changed) That's also why I'm excited about the prospects of JT III and his Staff. They've shown a "We're going to get it done" attitude and aren't placing limitations on what they can do. After the excuses and poor coaching, we have someone who is willing to say "I want GU to be on top and have a plan to do so". Whether I agree with him or not on all topics, it's refreshing he wants to sell GU's program to all players and doesn't believe in limiting himself based upon what the program cannot offer, he focuses on strengths.

Difference of opinions are fine and I respect those who feel differently but not when they ignore factual information and seem to protect a person who did as much to hurt the program as he did to help it. We weren't allowed to say what we wanted when he was in charge and now that he's gone it seems to be the same. I just dont' think some people understand the frustration and anger or even hurt he caused many Hoya fans. GU wasn't liked or hated, we were ignored and that is lowest level you can reach as a program. Esherick did more to put Hoyas in this position than help it and when he mouthed off, he took it to a level that everyone who disliked him as a coach wanted to go on the attack and see him gone. What goes around comes around this person mouthed off, so to me he's fair game no matter if 1, 10, or 20 years pass. I'm not posting this daily, just as a way of sharing why I think he's never qualified to work in D1 Basketball again.

We can agree to disagree but other than my WWE reference--which some found funny and I have the Private Messages to prove it--I stated many facts that might be harsh, but they were factual. Every detractor said "no piling on" well I speak for every Hoya fan who was miserable that he piled it on us for 5 and Half Seasons and his departure is like a new life for the program. Only LaSalle fans are luckier than Hoyas right now, they didn't have to see him coach.