Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 19, 2023 23:48:52 GMT -5
I take your point, but the pendulum swings both ways. Remember the type of press and buzz that Georgetown got in 2021 with the BET? That run showed that our program still had a fair amount of cachet among journalists, etc. That's something that DePaul doesn't have, nor will it get it barring a stretch of winning, which it has been unable to put together for way longer than Georgetown. In a way, we are kind of at a crossroads, which is why getting the next hire is so key. Many of the people currently in sports media are in the 40-60 range, and those people (especially the older end of the range) remember a strong Georgetown program, and even the younger ones would recall some strong years, too. These types of media people, including at ESPN, but also elsewhere would love to write a "Georgetown back on top," story, and I promise if we hire a coach like Pitino that gets us back to the NCAA tournament those stories will be written. You cannot say the same thing about DePaul, simply because they do not have the same level of past success, nor frankly, do journalists care a whole lot about them. I realize we look like a "clownshow," and it certainly seems that way give Ewing's ineptitude. But, most people aren't paying that much attention to us, and at most just know we are really bad. Hire a good coach, put together some wins, and suddenly the narrative changes. The real problem arises if we take a "safe" (James Jones style) or risky choice (Mike Jones or someone without head coaching experience), and then we spend another 4-6 years in the wilderness. At some point, we would be so bad for so long that many of those journalists and fans who would easily come back if we started winning will have (sadly) moved on either in interest, simply because they are no longer in the industry, or (eventually) pass away. That cachet among journalists you speak of was much more about Ewing than Gtown. It was a feel-good story, especially for ESPN folks. To be fair if Pitino took over DePaul they'd get a lot of press much in the same way Iona is getting coverage now. Gtown looks like a "clown show" much more due to the administration than Ewing's terrible record, inaction during a 33-game HM losing streak(Goodman updates the full list after each loss) is a head-scratcher to anyone covering CBB. Local press is more important than the national press for programs anyway, we know why Gtown gets little coverage locally... Agree that every loss after last season is on the administration. It makes them look incompetent.
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 20, 2023 13:37:55 GMT -5
That cachet among journalists you speak of was much more about Ewing than Gtown. It was a feel-good story, especially for ESPN folks. To be fair if Pitino took over DePaul they'd get a lot of press much in the same way Iona is getting coverage now. Gtown looks like a "clown show" much more due to the administration than Ewing's terrible record, inaction during a 33-game HM losing streak(Goodman updates the full list after each loss) is a head-scratcher to anyone covering CBB. Local press is more important than the national press for programs anyway, we know why Gtown gets little coverage locally... Fair enough. But as you said, I think a Pitino-led Georgetown squad would get as much, if not greater, attention than Ewing got. Otherwise, I think the only thing that is going to get us attention is winning. Winning makes a lot of pesky problems go away. Someone like Pitino would get us back to winning almost immediately. It's what this program needs.
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hoyarooter
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Post by hoyarooter on Jan 20, 2023 20:36:34 GMT -5
It doesn't have to be Pitino. He brings substantial baggage with him (although don't get me wrong, if he's hired, I won't object), and there are many coaches out there who are capable of turning a program around within a couple years. We just need to get rid of Patrick (and Ronny, hopefully) and make a good hire.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 20, 2023 21:35:48 GMT -5
That cachet among journalists you speak of was much more about Ewing than Gtown. It was a feel-good story, especially for ESPN folks. To be fair if Pitino took over DePaul they'd get a lot of press much in the same way Iona is getting coverage now. Gtown looks like a "clown show" much more due to the administration than Ewing's terrible record, inaction during a 33-game HM losing streak(Goodman updates the full list after each loss) is a head-scratcher to anyone covering CBB. Local press is more important than the national press for programs anyway, we know why Gtown gets little coverage locally... Fair enough. But as you said, I think a Pitino-led Georgetown squad would get as much, if not greater, attention than Ewing got. Otherwise, I think the only thing that is going to get us attention is winning. Winning makes a lot of pesky problems go away. Someone like Pitino would get us back to winning almost immediately. It's what this program needs. I infinitely agree that Pitino is the right, best & perfect choice for Gtown but I'm not sure the folks running the program will be willing to give Pitino all the things I think he'll ask for. Will Gtown ante up for more staff members, a new S&C person(team)& trainer, a nutritionist, an analytics person etc.? These are all the positions he had on his staff at L'ville & many of the positions BE peers have as well. I believe Gtown will have to show Pitino they're serious about the MBB program, just offering 4 million dollars won't cut it either...
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 20, 2023 22:13:55 GMT -5
Fair enough. But as you said, I think a Pitino-led Georgetown squad would get as much, if not greater, attention than Ewing got. Otherwise, I think the only thing that is going to get us attention is winning. Winning makes a lot of pesky problems go away. Someone like Pitino would get us back to winning almost immediately. It's what this program needs. I infinitely agree that Pitino is the right, best & perfect choice for Gtown but I'm not sure the folks running the program will be willing to give Pitino all the things I think he'll ask for. Will Gtown ante up for more staff members, a new S&C person(team)& trainer, a nutritionist, an analytics person etc.? These are all the positions he had on his staff at L'ville & many of the positions BE peers have as well. I believe Gtown will have to show Pitino they're serious about the MBB program, just offering 4 million dollars won't cut it either... Why not? We have a Top 15 budget that the Thompsons/Ewings throw away each year among Friends&Family. If we start from scratch and fire all the proven losers, then there's plenty for Pitino and the staff he needs to win championships.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 20, 2023 23:29:38 GMT -5
I infinitely agree that Pitino is the right, best & perfect choice for Gtown but I'm not sure the folks running the program will be willing to give Pitino all the things I think he'll ask for. Will Gtown ante up for more staff members, a new S&C person(team)& trainer, a nutritionist, an analytics person etc.? These are all the positions he had on his staff at L'ville & many of the positions BE peers have as well. I believe Gtown will have to show Pitino they're serious about the MBB program, just offering 4 million dollars won't cut it either... Why not? We have a Top 15 budget that the Thompsons/Ewings throw away each year among Friends&Family. If we start from scratch and fire all the proven losers, then there's plenty for Pitino and the staff he needs to win championships. This is the operative word... What would you be willing to gamble if Gtown's administration decides to make the 180-degree turn that would entice Pitino?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 20, 2023 23:52:07 GMT -5
Why not? We have a Top 15 budget that the Thompsons/Ewings throw away each year among Friends&Family. If we start from scratch and fire all the proven losers, then there's plenty for Pitino and the staff he needs to win championships. This is the operative word... What would you be willing to gamble if Gtown's administration decides to make the 180-degree turn that would entice Pitino? I can read your question to mean several things, so instead I’ll answer that if Pitino is hired, he’ll clean house and have $15M to shape the program like he wants it. That’s a Top 15 budget nationally. If he cannot do it with that amount, then he shouldn’t be hired.
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hoyaguy
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Post by hoyaguy on Jan 21, 2023 0:52:43 GMT -5
This is the operative word... What would you be willing to gamble if Gtown's administration decides to make the 180-degree turn that would entice Pitino? I can read your question to mean several things, so instead I’ll answer that if Pitino is hired, he’ll clean house and have $15M to shape the program like he wants it. That’s a Top 15 budget nationally. If he cannot do it with that amount, then he shouldn’t be hired. Yep like the school was willing to double down on an 0-20 coach by cleaning out much of the staff and hiring a new people just to run it back. If they are actually willing to approach pitino then i think they will be serious
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Post by aleutianhoya on Jan 21, 2023 8:19:41 GMT -5
I infinitely agree that Pitino is the right, best & perfect choice for Gtown but I'm not sure the folks running the program will be willing to give Pitino all the things I think he'll ask for. Will Gtown ante up for more staff members, a new S&C person(team)& trainer, a nutritionist, an analytics person etc.? These are all the positions he had on his staff at L'ville & many of the positions BE peers have as well. I believe Gtown will have to show Pitino they're serious about the MBB program, just offering 4 million dollars won't cut it either... Why not? We have a Top 15 budget that the Thompsons/Ewings throw away each year among Friends&Family. If we start from scratch and fire all the proven losers, then there's plenty for Pitino and the staff he needs to win championships. Serious question, PR: How much of our budget is available for the things you mention rather than tied up in facilities' payments? In 20-21, we had the 20th highest budget. How much of that goes to the downtown arena and thus isn't really available?
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CTHoya08
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Bring back Izzo!
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Post by CTHoya08 on Jan 21, 2023 11:00:29 GMT -5
Why not? We have a Top 15 budget that the Thompsons/Ewings throw away each year among Friends&Family. If we start from scratch and fire all the proven losers, then there's plenty for Pitino and the staff he needs to win championships. Serious question, PR: How much of our budget is available for the things you mention rather than tied up in facilities' payments? In 20-21, we had the 20th highest budget. How much of that goes to the downtown arena and thus isn't really available? I think a lot of it does go downtown and that’s why the budget number is partially misleading. Schools that have big on-campus arenas don’t have a line item in their “basketball” budget for rent, and whatever the costs associated with the arena are would likely fall under a general “athletics” or “physical plant” budget. That said, we’ve been paying our head coaches seven-figure annual salaries for quite some time now. The bottom line is that, while it might be a bit misleading to suggest that the program is a top-twenty program when it comes to fungible expenses like staff salary and recruiting, it’s also highly doubtful that we’re in the poorhouse. I think the funds are there. The problem is whether the university will commit to cleaning house rather than continuing to earmark them for Ronny and friends.
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Post by augustusfinknottle on Jan 21, 2023 11:05:40 GMT -5
Could there be a better definition of “win win” than clearing the Ronny cost?
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 21, 2023 13:04:00 GMT -5
Why not? We have a Top 15 budget that the Thompsons/Ewings throw away each year among Friends&Family. If we start from scratch and fire all the proven losers, then there's plenty for Pitino and the staff he needs to win championships. Serious question, PR: How much of our budget is available for the things you mention rather than tied up in facilities' payments? In 20-21, we had the 20th highest budget. How much of that goes to the downtown arena and thus isn't really available? Aleu, I would love to see a complete breakdown of the budget. Think about it, why keep it confidential? It’s not like there’s going to be a big uproar. Who would complain? My only guess is that it’s the Thompson Way (i.e., The Family wants to keep private how they give themselves undeserved amounts). Btw, I know private institutions don’t have to reveal that info.
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hoyaguy
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Post by hoyaguy on Jan 21, 2023 14:59:15 GMT -5
Serious question, PR: How much of our budget is available for the things you mention rather than tied up in facilities' payments? In 20-21, we had the 20th highest budget. How much of that goes to the downtown arena and thus isn't really available? Aleu, I would love to see a complete breakdown of the budget. Think about it, why keep it confidential? It’s not like there’s going to be a big uproar. Who would complain? My only guess is that it’s the Thompson Way (i.e., The Family wants to keep private how they give themselves undeserved amounts). Btw, I know private institutions don’t have to reveal that info. Yeah there is no way they would reveal their cuts and the number for renting cap one might make some people pass out and make it all the more obvious an on campus solution would’ve been far better years ago. Revealing the budget breakdown would only show more incompetence
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 21, 2023 16:02:52 GMT -5
This is the operative word... What would you be willing to gamble if Gtown's administration decides to make the 180-degree turn that would entice Pitino? I can read your question to mean several things, so instead I’ll answer that if Pitino is hired, he’ll clean house and have $15M to shape the program like he wants it. That’s a Top 15 budget nationally. If he cannot do it with that amount, then he shouldn’t be hired. Here's an example of my point, HC's don't want to do the job of an AD along with their coaching duties... www.statecollege.com/as-shrewsberrys-stock-rises-so-might-krafts-need-to-be-proactive/“I’m committed to keeping our [coaches],” Kraft said near the end of 2022. “Micah is a really really, really good coach. Now, here’s what I will tell you and I said this before I got up here. It’s not just about paying the coach, and the great coaches know that it’s about keeping staff, being able to hire staff, which is part of the process, it’s also about putting the infrastructure behind them to be successful. Where can I recruit, how do I recruit? How do I feed my athletes? How do I keep my athletes healthy, that infrastructure, which I think is lacked for a lot of our sports. […] So paying your coach is great, but the great coaches understand it’s all the other stuff that helps you eventually win the national championship.”
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prhoya
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Post by prhoya on Jan 21, 2023 16:11:20 GMT -5
I can read your question to mean several things, so instead I’ll answer that if Pitino is hired, he’ll clean house and have $15M to shape the program like he wants it. That’s a Top 15 budget nationally. If he cannot do it with that amount, then he shouldn’t be hired. Here's an example of my point, HC's don't want to do the job of an AD along with their coaching duties... www.statecollege.com/as-shrewsberrys-stock-rises-so-might-krafts-need-to-be-proactive/“I’m committed to keeping our [coaches],” Kraft said near the end of 2022. “Micah is a really really, really good coach. Now, here’s what I will tell you and I said this before I got up here. It’s not just about paying the coach, and the great coaches know that it’s about keeping staff, being able to hire staff, which is part of the process, it’s also about putting the infrastructure behind them to be successful. Where can I recruit, how do I recruit? How do I feed my athletes? How do I keep my athletes healthy, that infrastructure, which I think is lacked for a lot of our sports. […] So paying your coach is great, but the great coaches understand it’s all the other stuff that helps you eventually win the national championship.” I don’t know about you, but to me Pat looks slow and depressed. He’s not doing his job, let alone the job of others. For example, in Recruiting… Pat hasn’t been seen in a high school/AAU gym in a long time. Also, Pat’s player retention and conduct problems show that he is not an on-hands team manager.
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Bigs"R"Us
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 21, 2023 18:01:47 GMT -5
You don’t need to waste time recruiting high schoolers when you have the portal.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on Jan 21, 2023 18:50:30 GMT -5
Here's an example of my point, HC's don't want to do the job of an AD along with their coaching duties... www.statecollege.com/as-shrewsberrys-stock-rises-so-might-krafts-need-to-be-proactive/“I’m committed to keeping our [coaches],” Kraft said near the end of 2022. “Micah is a really really, really good coach. Now, here’s what I will tell you and I said this before I got up here. It’s not just about paying the coach, and the great coaches know that it’s about keeping staff, being able to hire staff, which is part of the process, it’s also about putting the infrastructure behind them to be successful. Where can I recruit, how do I recruit? How do I feed my athletes? How do I keep my athletes healthy, that infrastructure, which I think is lacked for a lot of our sports. […] So paying your coach is great, but the great coaches understand it’s all the other stuff that helps you eventually win the national championship.” I don’t know about you, but to me Pat looks slow and depressed. He’s not doing his job, let alone the job of others. For example, in Recruiting… Pat hasn’t been seen in a high school/AAU gym in a long time. Also, Pat’s player reten tion and conduct problems show that he is not an on-hands team manager. I'm not sure what your point is here besides Ewing is bad at his job
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