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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Nov 30, 2022 16:02:58 GMT -5
The silver lining in Ewing’s coaching tenure is that I now have more time on my hands since I don’t need to read any of the recruiting posts or follow any of the recruiting websites any more. My chances of winning the lottery are now greater than a highly ranked HS recruit coming here while Ewing is coach, and this season will likely have the same effect on transfer recruits. Same here. I haven’t watched a recruiting video since last year’s crop. The idea that someone like Miranda would consider GU under Pat makes me question the advice he’s getting. Same here too. While I will occasionally browse (like now, but it's the first time in a while I've checked out the recruiting board), it's hard to get excited about recruits when we are performing so poorly and when it's hard to know if the current staff will even be around to recruit some of these guys, especially those who are a year or two out. Obviously, our assistants all knew what they were getting into, having all signed up last year, but this cannot possibly be an easy job at the moment. It's also hard to put too much focus on high school kids, when the current staff seems intent on relying on the transfer portal to restock the team when the previous group leaves en masse after each season. In my mind, it seems like the best pitch to kids is to have charismatic, personable assistants who can recruit well simply be sheer force of personality. Building that connection can overcome a ton of stuff, including poor performance on court. I have to think that's what Nickelberry did to draw in Murray and others this off season. That's probably the best "pitch" that can be made. But even that becomes increasingly tough when the same problems persist year to year. Georgetown, as an institution, has a lot to offer outside of basketball, but frankly, 99% of high school kids looking to play basketball, make the tournament, maybe get to the NBA, etc., do not care about that. And, while we all love Georgetown, a lot of other good basketball schools offer a lot to players who care about more than basketball too. The shame of it is that we actually do have a great NBA player history, but it's largely too distant to matter at all to kids (and increasingly, their parents).
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hoyajmw
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,031
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Post by hoyajmw on Nov 30, 2022 19:53:03 GMT -5
There is no recruiting pitch to give high school seniors right now. Same as it was: --Play in the Big East, lots of TV time --Hall Of Fame coach --Play at Capital One Arena --Education (though graduation is not what it was) What's not there right now? --Top 25 program --Compete for NCAA championship --Pipeline of NBA players from the program Should add to that play locally where your pals and folks can watch you play — at least that SHOULD be part of the pitch if we paid more attention to the WCAC and to a lesser extent tried to mine the local talent in the MAC and the IAC. I think (but don’t know for sure) that chance to be local was part of the motivation for Jay Heath (Woodrow Wilson, now Jackson-Reed HS) and Terrell Allen (Dematha) as a grad student to make GU their third stop. One of the many aggravations with the current situation is what appears to be too much chasing ungettable national players and not enough focus on getting the talented and very well coached local players. Just because Q hasn’t worked out as well as hoped so far and Terrence Williams broke off the engagement after saying “yes” doesn’t mean you stop trying. And the area may be one of the few left where being GEORGETOWN still means something hoopswise. Especially with Villanova down and under a new regime, now is the time to look local…
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Post by johnnysnowplow on Dec 1, 2022 4:17:15 GMT -5
I used to live in the recruiting forum. In fact my bookmark for HT was the recruiting forum, not the main site or the main forum. Never had anything to add but i used to love following recruits and reading insights from the many HS/AAU basketball experts here. I always wanted to feel like I knew these kids and their games before they even set foot on campus - so I would know what they were coming in and I could watch them grow into the players they became as they graduated. And even in the midst of a bad season or two, well hey at least we’ve got help coming in next years class. The recruiting forum always provided hope.
But now what’s the point? That hope is basically gone. The recruits that do come will inevitably transfer after a year or two (or just vanish in the night - seriously, this has happened not once but two times now under Ewing’s watch!) and any big time recruits worth getting excited about are never going to come here now.
I came here in fact to try to find this exact discussion because I just knew someone would already have started a “why on earth would anyone want to come play here right now” thread. I don’t know how any major college basketball recruit could possibly take us seriously. Which basically resigns us to building a team of mercenaries through the transfer portal every year. Sounds like a winning strategy.
This whole thing just sucks.
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hoyarooter
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 10,199
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Post by hoyarooter on Dec 1, 2022 18:56:46 GMT -5
That's very speculative. NIL stands for Name, Image, and Likeness--has anyone seen Murray's name, image, or likeness around town anywhere? It's not pay for play. Georgetown does not maintain a collective so that's not likely anyway. The recruiting pitch to Murray could have been as simple as 1) moving closer to home where he has a familiar coach, 2) become the lead offensive option (something he probably doesn't get at LSU), and 3) The staff won't mind if he leaves after a year. NIL may stand for name image likeness, but in reality NIL is pay for play. That is the reality in college sports now. I’m not saying I like it. It’s sad really. But as long as we aspire to compete in major basketball, we need to do as the Romans. Just to be clear, nobody is suggesting that we do something illegal. But obviously the major programs have figured out legal ways to maximize the impact of NIL dollars in recruiting, and just as obviously we have not yet caught on. If we are too squeamish to start a decent collective, we should get the hell out of Rome and cancel the program. Ladies and gentlemen, may I present the University of Southern California football team.
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 3, 2022 8:46:54 GMT -5
Patrick to Recruits:
Come play in a consequence free environment, bereft of expectations….
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Post by hsaxon on Dec 22, 2022 18:23:19 GMT -5
Patrick to Recruits: Come play in a consequence free environment, bereft of expectations…. In the face of the current coaching "situation," I assume our recruiting is "dead in the water."
Does anyone disagree or have contrary info.?
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Post by hsaxon on Dec 26, 2022 22:13:26 GMT -5
Patrick to Recruits: Come play in a consequence free environment, bereft of expectations…. In the face of the current coaching "situation," I assume our recruiting is "dead in the water."
Does anyone disagree or have contrary info.?
Radio silence = dead in the water.
What basketball program??
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 26, 2022 23:53:09 GMT -5
Two thoughts on recruiting:
1. Today's recruiting is much more about relationships with assistant coaches than it used to be. Dante Harris, for example, was not drawn to Virginia because of Tony Bennett but that Virginia assistant coach Curtis Staples coached him in high school. Georgetown likely took a step back in high school recruiting when it traded Robert Kirby (Southern recruiting) and Akbar Waheed (DC recruits) for Kevin Nickelberry and Pat Baldwin, inasmuch as any recruits Kirby or Waheed had coming through the pipeline were lost with the changes. Nickelberry brought Murray and Ezewiro but it remains to be seen whether that's all he can bring going forward.
2. Contract extensions are made to sell stability to recruits but the clouds over this program can't be assuring to recruits and, perhaps just as importantly, their high school/AAU coaches. We can agree to disagree how motivated Ewing is with recruiting, but the geographically disparate and largely unproductive freshmen classes of the last three years do not promote a message of strength locally.
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hoyaboya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
Posts: 12,261
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 27, 2022 10:31:27 GMT -5
Two thoughts on recruiting: 1. Today's recruiting is much more about relationships with assistant coaches than it used to be. Dante Harris, for example, was not drawn to Virginia because of Tony Bennett but that Virginia assistant coach Curtis Staples coached him in high school. Georgetown likely took a step back in high school recruiting when it traded Robert Kirby (Southern recruiting) and Akbar Waheed (DC recruits) for Kevin Nickelberry and Pat Baldwin, inasmuch as any recruits Kirby or Waheed had coming through the pipeline were lost with the changes. Nickelberry brought Murray and Ezewiro but it remains to be seen whether that's all he can bring going forward. 2. Contract extensions are made to sell stability to recruits but the clouds over this program can't be assuring to recruits and, perhaps just as importantly, their high school/AAU coaches. We can agree to disagree how motivated Ewing is with recruiting, but the geographically disparate and largely unproductive freshmen classes of the last three years do not promote a message of strength locally. To be fair, Nickelberry also brought Marvel Allen. I think he was also the point man for Jay Heath and should also probably get credit for Primo Spears, since Spears only came here to be with Murray.
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hoya9797
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by hoya9797 on Dec 27, 2022 10:38:43 GMT -5
Two thoughts on recruiting: 1. Today's recruiting is much more about relationships with assistant coaches than it used to be. Dante Harris, for example, was not drawn to Virginia because of Tony Bennett but that Virginia assistant coach Curtis Staples coached him in high school. Georgetown likely took a step back in high school recruiting when it traded Robert Kirby (Southern recruiting) and Akbar Waheed (DC recruits) for Kevin Nickelberry and Pat Baldwin, inasmuch as any recruits Kirby or Waheed had coming through the pipeline were lost with the changes. Nickelberry brought Murray and Ezewiro but it remains to be seen whether that's all he can bring going forward. 2. Contract extensions are made to sell stability to recruits but the clouds over this program can't be assuring to recruits and, perhaps just as importantly, their high school/AAU coaches. We can agree to disagree how motivated Ewing is with recruiting, but the geographically disparate and largely unproductive freshmen classes of the last three years do not promote a message of strength locally. To be fair, Nickelberry also brought Marvel Allen. I think he was also the point man for Jay Heath. So, he managed to get a bunch of one for one replacements for guys from an 0-20 team.
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hoyaboya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by hoyaboya on Dec 27, 2022 10:58:12 GMT -5
To be fair, Nickelberry also brought Marvel Allen. I think he was also the point man for Jay Heath. So, he managed to get a bunch of one for one replacements for guys from an 0-20 team. That is correct. Don't mistake my comment as me saying Nickelberry is any good - he's not. Just that he has brought in some guys, even though those guys are nothing special, despite the hype put out by the Thompson/Ewing-first fans.
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DFW HOYA
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by DFW HOYA on Dec 27, 2022 11:15:42 GMT -5
Revisiting an earlier issue, this article from ESPN discusses the power of local recruiting. Yes, it's football, but it's the major reason TCU (a school slightly larger than Georgetown undergraduate wise) is in Phoenix this week. "There are so many great football players in this area that are going to be really, really good college players and go on to be good NFL players, and we need to figure out how to become a destination for those guys," Dykes said. "Your hope is that as the profile of the program continues to get better and better, those kids that everybody wants from DFW get on our campus, get to know us, get around our players and really get a feel for TCU football and what we're all about and are going to want to come play here. We think you can build a national championship-caliber program by recruiting in our own backyard." The last player signed directly from a DCIAA school was Antwan Walker. The last player signed directly from the WCAC was Tre Campbell. One of the legacies from this era is that the basketball office took the easy way with the portal instead of building the relationships and signing high school players from the local area that build long term support. We're not going to see a Kaiden Rice or a Chudier Bile at a reunion in 20 years nor being recognized at a game at halftime, because they've come and gone. www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/35323685/how-texas-centric-tcu-crashed-college-football-playoff
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hoya73
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoya73 on Dec 27, 2022 17:24:12 GMT -5
We've seen Rodney Pryor this year, after he was a one year grad player.
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Post by practice on Dec 29, 2022 9:58:12 GMT -5
It's obvious that Ewing promised minutes to Murray, Primo, Heath and Wahab, right? Come to Georgetown and put up numbers and play 30-35 minutes! Not sure what he promised Anglin ...
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Dec 29, 2022 10:49:44 GMT -5
It's obvious that Ewing promised minutes to Murray, Primo, Heath and Wahab, right? Come to Georgetown and put up numbers and play 30-35 minutes! Not sure what he promised Anglin ... The pitch to freshmen right now has to be “ride the bench and transfer.” We live off the portal and don’t invest in or develop kids.
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hoyaguy
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoyaguy on Dec 29, 2022 11:31:25 GMT -5
At this point I think Ewing just recruits freshmen to hope that a 5 star can save him or to save face with JD to make it seem like he wants to graduate 4 year players
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saxagael
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Post by saxagael on Jan 4, 2023 21:18:19 GMT -5
Two thoughts on recruiting: 1. Today's recruiting is much more about relationships with assistant coaches than it used to be. Dante Harris, for example, was not drawn to Virginia because of Tony Bennett but that Virginia assistant coach Curtis Staples coached him in high school. Georgetown likely took a step back in high school recruiting when it traded Robert Kirby (Southern recruiting) and Akbar Waheed (DC recruits) for Kevin Nickelberry and Pat Baldwin, inasmuch as any recruits Kirby or Waheed had coming through the pipeline were lost with the changes. Nickelberry brought Murray and Ezewiro but it remains to be seen whether that's all he can bring going forward. 2. Contract extensions are made to sell stability to recruits but the clouds over this program can't be assuring to recruits and, perhaps just as importantly, their high school/AAU coaches. We can agree to disagree how motivated Ewing is with recruiting, but the geographically disparate and largely unproductive freshmen classes of the last three years do not promote a message of strength locally. Keep in mind recruiting is usually a 5 to 8 year process. Officially colleges can't contact the kid until after the player's end of their freshman year academic school year. But, college coaches can and do reach out to travel team coaches from 6th grade up (if not earlier) to ask about ability to be coached, kid putting in work, are they keeping out of trouble. Head coaches normally are heavily involved as well as assistants. They have spread sheets and books / binders on potential players that may be options for them. When a new coach arrives they often bring their book. Ewing not having any college coaching experience had a name but a book with zero pages. It can take three or more years to start getting players you really want coming in rather than scrapping for decommits and transfers. Often it the head coach and one or two recruiting assistants that build the relationships over years so they can get 3 or 4 solid players that fit their system and type of progression (play right away, limited play for new players, or most often redshirt (Jay Wright, Few at Gonzaga, and Bennet at St. Mary's usual model for guards). Players know the expectations and where they fit. I haven't seen that Hoyas set expectations well for players on any front.
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hoyaguy
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoyaguy on Jan 4, 2023 21:19:56 GMT -5
At this point the question should be: why would any parent of a recruit allow PE to text your kid? Block him immediately
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Bigs"R"Us
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Bigs"R"Us on Jan 4, 2023 23:30:10 GMT -5
If you go 0-20, no parent should allow their son to be coached by you. That’s a rare level of incompetence.
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Elvado
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Post by Elvado on Jan 5, 2023 12:45:50 GMT -5
“Help break the 2 year drought…”
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