CTHoya08
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Bring back Izzo!
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Ukraine
Jan 22, 2022 8:00:26 GMT -5
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Post by CTHoya08 on Jan 22, 2022 8:00:26 GMT -5
I don’t know if discussion of the Ukraine situation is ongoing in one of the threads here—I haven’t kept up with all of them. Do any of the SFS types on here have any thoughts, insights, or speculation?
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 22, 2022 9:34:29 GMT -5
My shoot from the hip opinion. Sanctions or threat thereof are weak sauce but there is no stomach for boots on the ground by US or NATO forces. Assuming Putin is a rational actor (uncertain) diplomatic initiatives need to give him an off ramp to save face. Xi and PRC are watching and if the US and NATO response is weak, it may encourage more Chicom aggressiveness toward Taiwan.
The US can't make the mistake that Obama did in drawing a line in the sand in Syria then ignoring any transgression.
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hoya73
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,222
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Ukraine
Jan 22, 2022 11:02:46 GMT -5
Post by hoya73 on Jan 22, 2022 11:02:46 GMT -5
Agree about drawing a Syria like line, which is probably what Biden had in mind when he made what's been criticized as a gaffe for distinguishing between a minor incursion and an invasion. That distinction makes sense, but would best be left unspoken, I guess. The main obstacle to US and Europe acting in concert is that Nord Stream gas pipeline. Killing it would make sanctions stronger as a response, but...would cost the Germans a degree of self-sacrifice that the US wouldn't actually face itself. Full disclosure: I was College of Arts and Sciences, not SFS.
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Post by badgerhoya on Jan 22, 2022 12:52:31 GMT -5
My shoot from the hip opinion. Sanctions or threat thereof are weak sauce but there is no stomach for boots on the ground by US or NATO forces. Assuming Putin is a rational actor (uncertain) diplomatic initiatives need to give him an off ramp to save face. Xi and PRC are watching and if the US and NATO response is weak, it may encourage more Chicom aggressiveness toward Taiwan. The US can't make the mistake that Obama did in drawing a line in the sand in Syria then ignoring any transgression. The only thing I’d add is that whatever sanctions have been put in place have never really gone after Putin’s inner circle - particularly in the UK. At the end of the day, Russia’s government is effectively a kleptocracy, and the only way to deal w a mob boss is to go after his and his associates $.
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Ukraine
Jan 24, 2022 5:33:05 GMT -5
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 24, 2022 5:33:05 GMT -5
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Ukraine
Jan 30, 2022 7:03:08 GMT -5
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Post by SSHoya on Jan 30, 2022 7:03:08 GMT -5
Sipher's unstated assumption may be that Putin is not necessarily a rational actor regarding Ukraine. But while it may look like Putin is in charge now, his actions threaten to imperil the very things he claims to care about. His belligerence and risk-taking could easily lead to exactly what Russia is trying to head off: an increased U.S. presence in Europe, a strengthened and re-energized NATO, and a forever Western-oriented Ukraine. An invasion might even jeopardize what matters most to Putin: political power and control at home. www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2022/01/28/putin-ukraine-russia-backfire/?itid=hp_opinions
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hoya73
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,222
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Ukraine
Jan 31, 2022 10:32:10 GMT -5
Post by hoya73 on Jan 31, 2022 10:32:10 GMT -5
Hoping Ukraine can be a wedge issue between Trump and some of his so far supportive, even of pardoning insurrectionists, fellow Republicans. On Ukraine, Trump has been Putin's lapdog since before day one, and remains so. (Parenthetically, how can Putin stand having Trump as a lapdog?; he's one of those dogs that constantly blows dog snot all over your hands). Pugs, right? The usual band of suspects in the GOP: Boebert, Greene, Gosar, Massie, J.D.Vance, Don Jr, join Trump in saying let Putin have Ukraine. With Tucker Carlson leading that chorus. But there is a faction in the GOP that is old school Cold Warrior. They'll want to criticize Biden for softness, but when it comes to sanctions, be bipartisan with the Biden admin in imposing them. Or will they cave, to avoid a GOP rift? I guess my eyes are on Lindsey Graham and Haley. They seem to eventually come around to Trump sycophancy on most issues, but will instinct prevail and a rift develop? As I say, hoping so.
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 2, 2022 17:35:41 GMT -5
My shoot from the hip opinion. Sanctions or threat thereof are weak sauce but there is no stomach for boots on the ground by US or NATO forces. Assuming Putin is a rational actor (uncertain) diplomatic initiatives need to give him an off ramp to save face. Xi and PRC are watching and if the US and NATO response is weak, it may encourage more Chicom aggressiveness toward Taiwan. The US can't make the mistake that Obama did in drawing a line in the sand in Syria then ignoring any transgression. The only thing I’d add is that whatever sanctions have been put in place have never really gone after Putin’s inner circle - particularly in the UK. At the end of the day, Russia’s government is effectively a kleptocracy, and the only way to deal w a mob boss is to go after his and his associates $. The White House on Monday signaled what could be a more likely — and damaging — play than going directly after Putin: Targeting figures “in or near the inner circle of the Kremlin.” That could include barring children of certain Russian elites from attending prestigious universities in the United States and Europe, the New York Times reported. The targeted Russians could be closer to Putin than those slapped with U.S. sanctions in the past, and reportedly could include Alina Kabaeva, a former Olympic gymnast alleged to have been romantically involved with the Russian leader. www.washingtonpost.com/world/2022/02/02/putin-individual-sanctions-difficulty/
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 21, 2022 21:45:28 GMT -5
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SSHoya
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 22, 2022 6:35:52 GMT -5
Germany has halted the approval of the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline in response to Russia's actions in Ukraine. Chancellor Olaf Scholz said the country has ordered the withdrawal of a key document needed for certification of the pipeline from Russia.
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Ukraine
Feb 22, 2022 14:40:55 GMT -5
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 22, 2022 14:40:55 GMT -5
My shoot from the hip opinion. Sanctions or threat thereof are weak sauce but there is no stomach for boots on the ground by US or NATO forces. Assuming Putin is a rational actor (uncertain) diplomatic initiatives need to give him an off ramp to save face. Xi and PRC are watching and if the US and NATO response is weak, it may encourage more Chicom aggressiveness toward Taiwan. The US can't make the mistake that Obama did in drawing a line in the sand in Syria then ignoring any transgression. The only thing I’d add is that whatever sanctions have been put in place have never really gone after Putin’s inner circle - particularly in the UK. At the end of the day, Russia’s government is effectively a kleptocracy, and the only way to deal w a mob boss is to go after his and his associates $. Good call given today's further sanctions. Let's see if it makes any difference to Putin's aggression. I remain skeptical.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Ukraine
Feb 22, 2022 16:26:39 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2022 16:26:39 GMT -5
Jesus... Putin’s investment in conservative politicians and media is definitely paying off.
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Ukraine
Feb 22, 2022 23:28:38 GMT -5
Post by bicentennial on Feb 22, 2022 23:28:38 GMT -5
While I am no fan of Joe McCarthy talk about a party swinging from anti-red to full tilt red love? Someone knew their primary colors when they started painting the election maps!
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SSHoya
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
"Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown."
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Ukraine
Feb 23, 2022 6:31:45 GMT -5
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Post by SSHoya on Feb 23, 2022 6:31:45 GMT -5
Jesus... Putin’s investment in conservative politicians and media is definitely paying off. But wait. I could have sworn that the Putin's puppet sucked but "Biden is no better." Didn't I read that somewhere?
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Ukraine
Feb 23, 2022 6:47:05 GMT -5
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Post by Elvado on Feb 23, 2022 6:47:05 GMT -5
So Putin waited until his puppet was out of office and replaced by the Uber competent Biden to launch his incursion?
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HoyaNyr320
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,233
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Ukraine
Feb 23, 2022 8:15:28 GMT -5
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Post by HoyaNyr320 on Feb 23, 2022 8:15:28 GMT -5
So Putin waited until his puppet was out of office and replaced by the Uber competent Biden to launch his incursion? You’re right- if only we had incompetent, warmongering Republican leadership in the White House, we would have stopped Putin. Or, if you listen to Tucker Carlson, perhaps would have given him an invitation to invade? 🤔
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Ukraine
Feb 23, 2022 8:24:28 GMT -5
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Post by Elvado on Feb 23, 2022 8:24:28 GMT -5
So Putin waited until his puppet was out of office and replaced by the Uber competent Biden to launch his incursion? You’re right- if only we had incompetent, warmongering Republican leadership in the White House, we would have stopped Putin. Or, if you listen to Tucker Carlson, perhaps would have given him an invitation to invade? 🤔 Just curious why he did not act for four years with his puppet in place and waited for a bona fide tonight guy like Biden… Maybe he is crazy…
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Massholya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Ukraine
Feb 23, 2022 8:40:43 GMT -5
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Post by Massholya on Feb 23, 2022 8:40:43 GMT -5
So Putin waited until his puppet was out of office and replaced by the Uber competent Biden to launch his incursion? Wasn’t Trump sabotaging NATO for him?
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hoyajinx
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by hoyajinx on Feb 23, 2022 8:58:43 GMT -5
You’re right- if only we had incompetent, warmongering Republican leadership in the White House, we would have stopped Putin. Or, if you listen to Tucker Carlson, perhaps would have given him an invitation to invade? 🤔 Just curious why he did not act for four years with his puppet in place and waited for a bona fide tonight guy like Biden… Maybe he is crazy… It should be obvious, but I’ll spell it out for you: Trump was destabilizing the west, alienating allies, defanging NATO, and undermining American democracy. You know, doing all of Putin’s work for him. It would have been reckless for him to invade under Trump’s watch. Also, forward looking, putting Biden in a bad position helps Trump in 2024. It’s not all that difficult to grasp. Hope that helped.
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Elvado
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Ukraine
Feb 23, 2022 9:43:25 GMT -5
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Post by Elvado on Feb 23, 2022 9:43:25 GMT -5
Just curious why he did not act for four years with his puppet in place and waited for a bona fide tonight guy like Biden… Maybe he is crazy… It should be obvious, but I’ll spell it out for you: Trump was destabilizing the west, alienating allies, defanging NATO, and undermining American democracy. You know, doing all of Putin’s work for him. It would have been reckless for him to invade under Trump’s watch. Also, forward looking, putting Biden in a bad position helps Trump in 2024. It’s not all that difficult to grasp. Hope that helped. Or, he knows Biden will screw the pooch on this as he has for 40 years.
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