calhoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
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Post by calhoya on May 16, 2018 18:07:41 GMT -5
I do agree that many players would benefit from a redshirt, but that assumes that the player wants to be at Georgetown more than he wants playing time. I think that many players, if told upfront that they would be redshirting would not come to the school as they could almost certainly find playing time at another school on their list.
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Post by blazers44 on May 16, 2018 18:23:45 GMT -5
Anybody know who he played aau with? And how did he do on the circuit???
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Post by hoyas4lyfe on May 16, 2018 18:34:15 GMT -5
Anybody know who he played aau with? And how did he do on the circuit??? Played for South Jersey Select
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Post by hoyas4lyfe on May 16, 2018 18:47:49 GMT -5
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2018 19:15:15 GMT -5
I get it in terms of letting kids develop and not waisting a year since they're most likely not going to play, but question for anyone. What Hoya player do you think a redshirt year would have benefitted? Personally I can't think of many. Maaaaaybe Sims, or Trawick, but I don't think either guy would have wanted to do that. Hayes should have been redshirted from the jump along with Domingo as neither looked like they were going to get time before the 2012-2013 season. Hayes ended up getting his redshirt year minus a hand full of games. Maybe Domingo doesn't loose his confidence. Trey Mourning should have been redshirted from the jump his freshman year as playing time was sparse. Looks like he may end up getting his redshirt year if some reports are true. I could also make a valid argument that Kaleb Johnson should have been redshirted as he barely played at all his freshman year particularly once conference play started, but that would have been a tougher call. I'm just against waisting a year of eligibility when you know the athlete isn't going to play much if at all. They could use that year to develop and get stronger and be impact the following season while making recruiting for the next class easier. Sims as a 5th year player alongside Otto Porter's coming out party could have been special... I think the thing that makes Nova's use of the redshirt special is their getting kids that would/could play as Freshman to do it. I just don't think an extra year for most of those kids you listed makes much of a difference. None are really impact guys and that likely doesn't change with an extra year. Sims is different, but since we're dealing in hypotheticals he could redshirt not really play for 2 years and transfer also. Kids want to play too. Nova's kids usually redshirt an then play descent minutes as RS Freshman.
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Post by ewingitrust on May 16, 2018 19:34:16 GMT -5
The more big bodies, the better. Hope he commits to us. The staff will get him in the proper shape...guess we'll see on monday!
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skunk
Century (over 100 posts)
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Post by skunk on May 16, 2018 21:09:35 GMT -5
Pretty sure spellman redshirted due to academics
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Post by blazers44 on May 16, 2018 21:14:52 GMT -5
Yea he did because of academics. NCAA ruled him a partial qualifier.
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bostonfan
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Post by bostonfan on May 17, 2018 7:16:09 GMT -5
Hayes should have been redshirted from the jump along with Domingo as neither looked like they were going to get time before the 2012-2013 season. Hayes ended up getting his redshirt year minus a hand full of games. Maybe Domingo doesn't loose his confidence. Trey Mourning should have been redshirted from the jump his freshman year as playing time was sparse. Looks like he may end up getting his redshirt year if some reports are true. I could also make a valid argument that Kaleb Johnson should have been redshirted as he barely played at all his freshman year particularly once conference play started, but that would have been a tougher call. I'm just against waisting a year of eligibility when you know the athlete isn't going to play much if at all. They could use that year to develop and get stronger and be impact the following season while making recruiting for the next class easier. Sims as a 5th year player alongside Otto Porter's coming out party could have been special... I think the thing that makes Nova's use of the redshirt special is their getting kids that would/could play as Freshman to do it. I just don't think an extra year for most of those kids you listed makes much of a difference. None are really impact guys and that likely doesn't change with an extra year. Sims is different, but since we're dealing in hypotheticals he could redshirt not really play for 2 years and transfer also. Kids want to play too. Nova's kids usually redshirt an then play descent minutes as RS Freshman. I think that is the key as to why the redshirt situation has worked for Nova. They have a proven track record of kids taking a redshirt year, working on their game and getting stronger,and then getting significant playing time the following year and having success. They can point to kids who have done it and had great success which makes it something that some recruits are willing to consider. I agree that it is not a path that most recruits are interested in these days. Kids who are getting HM D1 scholarships have been stars on their teams for the last few years in most cases and don't typically think they need a year to "develop" in order to get playing time. I would expect the redshirt option, while I think it would be beneficial to some players, only works for a very few kids.
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71hoya
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Post by 71hoya on May 17, 2018 7:23:22 GMT -5
What Villanova red shirt sat out a year that was not due to injury or academics.?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2018 7:36:30 GMT -5
What Villanova red shirt sat out a year that was not due to injury or academics.? The one that's a lotto pick this year? They got lucky with injuries also, but some of the injuries weren't year ending, they just got convinced it was for the best... Painter and Mikael were the only ones that were planned before they got to campus.
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Post by goyahoya69 on May 17, 2018 8:25:54 GMT -5
could be wrong, but if ewing takes on this "project," it would seem as though that could potentially take the spot of malcolm wilson's "project" spot, assuming we are truly gunning for one of isaiah stewart, kofi cockburn, chol marial.
Edit: which brings me to the question - are we okay with that? there seems to be limited info and serious questions about both osunniyi and malcolm wilson. thoughts as to who, hypothetically, you would rather want.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2018 8:49:48 GMT -5
could be wrong, but if ewing takes on this "project," it would seem as though that could potentially take the spot of malcolm wilson's "project" spot, assuming we are truly gunning for one of isaiah stewart, kofi cockburn, chol marial. Edit: which brings me to the question - are we okay with that? there seems to be limited info and serious questions about both osunniyi and malcolm wilson. thoughts as to who, hypothetically, you would rather want. That is probably true. I don't see a real need of having 2 project bigs if we hope to be getting a top (read: rotation ready) big man or two from the '19 class. You can argue the skills of OO and Wilson individually*... but if you don't see either as head-and-shoulders above the other, then perhaps Osunniyi is the better option given our current roster shortage for the coming year. But as others have mentioned - if Jessie is back or Yurt is eligible right away, those needs aren't as pressing. * - My own opinion is that Osun looks more game-ready at this stage, but is a little more mechanical and perhaps ultimately has a lower ceiling than Wilson. Wilson is a big ball of athletic potential right now, and -- with a little physical and mental maturity -- could be a tremendous defensive/athletic complement to a skilled 1-4 offensive lineup.
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TC
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Post by TC on May 17, 2018 8:56:27 GMT -5
Hayes should have been redshirted from the jump along with Domingo as neither looked like they were going to get time before the 2012-2013 season. Hayes ended up getting his redshirt year minus a hand full of games. Maybe Domingo doesn't loose his confidence. If anything you've just proven how easy it is retroactively to get a redshirt year if a player doesn't end up seeing a lot of time. There's no reason to bring a player in as a red shirt "from the jump" because you can always make up a justification for it later if you end up not needing them. Bradley Hayes got to play his freshman year, even played late into the season, had no injury of note, and still got a redshirt year. The benefit is that JT3 got to have him on the bench and could have used him in an emergency. You redshirt a kid "from the jump", you take that off the table. Stephen Domingo's "redshirt year" should have been finishing high school. Your hypothetical example of a Henry Sims fifth year is why redshirts are useless - anyone who is good enough to play a meaningful role is not going to stay for a fifth year because of the professional opportunities available. Henry Sims played in the NBA the year after graduating college - why would he have stayed? Marcus Derrickson is not as good a NBA prospect as Henry Sims was and we can't even get him to stay four years.
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wnyhoya
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Post by wnyhoya on May 17, 2018 9:55:46 GMT -5
could be wrong, but if ewing takes on this "project," it would seem as though that could potentially take the spot of malcolm wilson's "project" spot, assuming we are truly gunning for one of isaiah stewart, kofi cockburn, chol marial. Edit: which brings me to the question - are we okay with that? there seems to be limited info and serious questions about both osunniyi and malcolm wilson. thoughts as to who, hypothetically, you would rather want. That is probably true. I don't see a real need of having 2 project bigs if we hope to be getting a top (read: rotation ready) big man or two from the '19 class. You can argue the skills of OO and Wilson individually*... but if you don't see either as head-and-shoulders above the other, then perhaps Osunniyi is the better option given our current roster shortage for the coming year. But as others have mentioned - if Jessie is back or Yurt is eligible right away, those needs aren't as pressing. * - My own opinion is that Osun looks more game-ready at this stage, but is a little more mechanical and perhaps ultimately has a lower ceiling than Wilson. Wilson is a big ball of athletic potential right now, and -- with a little physical and mental maturity -- could be a tremendous defensive/athletic complement to a skilled 1-4 offensive lineup. I would take Osunniyi if this were the case bc theoretically he would be more ready to contribute in 2019 after having a year in the program
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HometownHoya
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Post by HometownHoya on May 17, 2018 10:36:13 GMT -5
Hayes should have been redshirted from the jump along with Domingo as neither looked like they were going to get time before the 2012-2013 season. Hayes ended up getting his redshirt year minus a hand full of games. Maybe Domingo doesn't loose his confidence. If anything you've just proven how easy it is retroactively to get a redshirt year if a player doesn't end up seeing a lot of time. There's no reason to bring a player in as a red shirt "from the jump" because you can always make up a justification for it later if you end up not needing them. Bradley Hayes got to play his freshman year, even played late into the season, had no injury of note, and still got a redshirt year. The benefit is that JT3 got to have him on the bench and could have used him in an emergency. You redshirt a kid "from the jump", you take that off the table. Stephen Domingo's "redshirt year" should have been finishing high school. Your hypothetical example of a Henry Sims fifth year is why redshirts are useless - anyone who is good enough to play a meaningful role is not going to stay for a fifth year because of the professional opportunities available. Henry Sims played in the NBA the year after graduating college - why would he have stayed? Marcus Derrickson is not as good a NBA prospect as Henry Sims was and we can't even get him to stay four years. You can have a guy with a RS year that gets taken off* RS in the case of injury/emergency. You don't need to hope that the NCAA stays consistent and grants a retroactive redshirt. Your last point is the best one I've seen for against redshirts but I'd rather have a guy ready in years 2-4 and risk losing them year 5 then having a guy not ready but forced on the court for "development" in year 1. That really just goes back to a coach's discipline for PT at that point.
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hoyainla
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Post by hoyainla on May 17, 2018 11:37:33 GMT -5
What Villanova red shirt sat out a year that was not due to injury or academics.? Everyone loves to bring up the Nova RS but have any that RS played their RS senior year and made an impact? The whole point is to get the extra year but their guys are gone by then so it really doesn't matter.
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on May 17, 2018 12:46:17 GMT -5
What Villanova red shirt sat out a year that was not due to injury or academics.? Everyone loves to bring up the Nova RS but have any that RS played their RS senior year and made an impact? The whole point is to get the extra year but their guys are gone by then so it really doesn't matter. But what did Nova lose in the process? Devon Hall had a very good year for UVA in his RS SR year.. Look at Sacar Amin from Marquette, he'd be a Sr this coming season if he didn't RS his soph year.. To me the program and the player lose nothing from using a RS year on players who aren't go to be used anyway..
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Post by bornhoya on May 17, 2018 13:25:14 GMT -5
Hunter from UVA is a redshirt player and he was a top 100 player
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EtomicB
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Post by EtomicB on May 17, 2018 13:53:08 GMT -5
Hunter from UVA is a redshirt player and he was a top 100 player Exactly right and he'll probably leave after next season but it was still a good move for UVA to RS him.. Diatke & Huff are RS kids too for UVA.. Salt also.. It's a win/win for both parties in my view..
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