Why is it the coach's fault for players mistakes.

[michaeldm9]

Mosley went 0 for life from 3. Copeland right before half committed a stupid fouls which led to 2 points. As I stated on the Game Discussion Thread, Mulmore did not block out and allowed his man from the top of the key to rebound the ball(Check it out if you recoreded the game). Peak pass and the end of the game was horrible. I can go on and on but all of these mistakes are plays that each player should know better from grade school basketball. I will be the first to say there is a lack of accountability the JTIII not holding these players, But incompetent, cant coach, that is a little harsh. These player Need to take responsibility.

[royski]

He picks the players. He coaches the players in practice. He coaches the players during games. A college basketball coach is in complete control of his program, he is effectively the coach/gm rolled into one. If this were one result, or the result with one group of players, maybe blame the players. When we see results like this constantly, with different players all the time, it's time to blame the coach. And when you lose to a team as awful as Arkansas State, it's fair to blame absolutely everyone; everything must be done terribly to lose with such a massive talent advantage.

[michaeldm9]

Nov 17, 2016 21:44:23 GMT -5 royski said:

He picks the players. He coaches the players in practice. He coaches the players during games. A college basketball coach is in complete control of his program, he is effectively the coach/gm rolled into one. If this were one result, or the result with one group of players, maybe blame the players. When we see results like this constantly, with different players all the time, it's time to blame the coach. And when you lose to a team as awful as Arkansas State, it's fair to blame absolutely everyone; everything must be done terribly to lose with such a massive talent advantage.

Ok So if you was a coach, How do you make Mulmore block-out and LJ make a clean inbound pass. I am sure they work on it in practice.

You get the stop on defense, As a coach how do control what player do in the game. I am sure he reminded everyone to block-out.

[eagle54]

Nov 17, 2016 21:51:54 GMT -5 michaeldm9 said:

Nov 17, 2016 21:44:23 GMT -5 royski said:

He picks the players. He coaches the players in practice. He coaches the players during games. A college basketball coach is in complete control of his program, he is effectively the coach/gm rolled into one. If this were one result, or the result with one group of players, maybe blame the players. When we see results like this constantly, with different players all the time, it's time to blame the coach. And when you lose to a team as awful as Arkansas State, it's fair to blame absolutely everyone; everything must be done terribly to lose with such a massive talent advantage.

Ok So if you was a coach, How do you make Mulmore block-out and LJ make a clean inbound pass. I am sure they work on it in practice.

You get the stop on defense, As a coach how do control what player do in the game. I am sure he reminded everyone to block-out.

Life isn't fair and coaches lose their jobs every day for far less. Guess what, when you get paid $3m per year to run all aspects of a program and you don't win and get embarrassed repeatedly that rests with one person.  Just the way it is.  Life isn't fair sometimes but in this case I think it is.  

[This Just In]

Nov 17, 2016 21:40:49 GMT -5 michaeldm9 said:

Mosley went 0 for life from 3. Copeland right before half committed a stupid fouls which led to 2 points. As I stated on the Game Discussion Thread, Mulmore did not block out and allowed his man from the top of the key to rebound the ball(Check it out if you recoreded the game). Peak pass and the end of the game was horrible. I can go on and on but all of these mistakes are plays that each player should know better from grade school basketball. I will be the first to say there is a lack of accountability the JTIII not holding these players, But incompetent, cant coach, that is a little harsh. These player Need to take responsibility.

Here is the thing if the player hits a shot, makes a block or makes an assist the coach gets credit for drawing up plays or coaching up the player.
Yes players make mistakes, but you can't congratulate a coach when players do well and then exclude the coach when the players make mistakes.
If that was the case then there would never be coaching changes...heck Craig Esherick should still be here then, Esherick was not on the court missing shots,
blowing assignments and turning the ball over.

[95hoya]

It's his fault for not recruiting talented enough players. If you have followed recruiting, this is no surprise.

[michaeldm9]

Nov 17, 2016 23:36:37 GMT -5 This Just In said:

Nov 17, 2016 21:40:49 GMT -5 michaeldm9 said:

Mosley went 0 for life from 3. Copeland right before half committed a stupid fouls which led to 2 points. As I stated on the Game Discussion Thread, Mulmore did not block out and allowed his man from the top of the key to rebound the ball(Check it out if you recoreded the game). Peak pass and the end of the game was horrible. I can go on and on but all of these mistakes are plays that each player should know better from grade school basketball. I will be the first to say there is a lack of accountability the JTIII not holding these players, But incompetent, cant coach, that is a little harsh. These player Need to take responsibility.

Here is the thing if the player hits a shot, makes a block or makes an assist the coach gets credit for drawing up plays or coaching up the player.
Yes players make mistakes, but you can't congratulate a coach when players do well and then exclude the coach when the players make mistakes.
If that was the case then there would never be coaching changes...heck Craig Esherick should still be here then, Esherick was not on the court missing shots,
blowing assignments and turning the ball over.

Esherick Never went to a final 4 or won the Big East

[michaeldm9]

So I guess All I am going to get is Rhetoric. No one is going to answer the question what do you do. Ok Lets try this question Who do you Hire as a coach. Who is out there.

[eagle54]

Nov 18, 2016 0:34:29 GMT -5 michaeldm9 said:

So I guess All I am going to get is Rhetoric. No one is going to answer the question what do you do. Ok Lets try this question Who do you Hire as a coach. Who is out there.

Maybe that Ark St coach needs a better job.  Need to start somewhere.  We get outcoached or out recruited with the players we have.  Wouldn't be hard to do a search for better than we have.  

[hoya2x2010]

I do think some blame rests on coach for even allowing Mosley to shoot 6 3's. Also a last second drive / blocked shot under his belt after 3 games. I think jagan can become a decent rotation player for us, but he's a ~150 ranked recruit playing a major role for us off the bat...don't get it at all.

[hoyaboya]

Nov 18, 2016 0:40:32 GMT -5 hoya2x2010 said:

I do think some blame rests on coach for even allowing Mosley to shoot 6 3's. Also a last second drive / blocked shot under his belt after 3 games. I think jagan can become a decent rotation player for us, but he's a ~150 ranked recruit playing a major role for us off the bat...don't get it at all.

He's better than Campbell and Mulmore. That's why he's playing. Unfortunately he can't shoot.

[hoya2x2010]

Nov 18, 2016 0:42:42 GMT -5 hoyaboya said:

Nov 18, 2016 0:40:32 GMT -5 hoya2x2010 said:

I do think some blame rests on coach for even allowing Mosley to shoot 6 3's. Also a last second drive / blocked shot under his belt after 3 games. I think jagan can become a decent rotation player for us, but he's a ~150 ranked recruit playing a major role for us off the bat...don't get it at all.

He's better than Campbell and Mulmore. That's why he's playing. Unfortunately he can't shoot.

Maybe. I'd still like to see more out of mulmore. But my point wasn't that he shouldn't be on the court. It's that it shouldn't be so obvious that he's on the court. I think we can all agree we have better offensive options.

[EtomicB]

Nov 18, 2016 0:40:32 GMT -5 hoya2x2010 said:

I do think some blame rests on coach for even allowing Mosley to shoot 6 3's. Also a last second drive / blocked shot under his belt after 3 games. I think jagan can become a decent rotation player for us, but he's a ~150 ranked recruit playing a major role for us off the bat...don't get it at all.

Haven't seen the game yet but I agree Jagan shouldn't be taking 6 threes in a game..

However I do see why he's playing, it's due to the fact that he's the best passer on the team.. He had another 5 assist game tonight..

[hoyaboya]

Nov 18, 2016 0:48:31 GMT -5 EtomicB said:

Nov 18, 2016 0:40:32 GMT -5 hoya2x2010 said:

I do think some blame rests on coach for even allowing Mosley to shoot 6 3's. Also a last second drive / blocked shot under his belt after 3 games. I think jagan can become a decent rotation player for us, but he's a ~150 ranked recruit playing a major role for us off the bat...don't get it at all.

Haven't seen the game yet but I agree Jagan shouldn't be taking 6 threes in a game..

However I do see why he's playing, it's due to the fact that he's the best passer on the team.. He had another 5 assist game tonight..

He's by far the best defensive guard and appears to be the only player on the team who knows how to pass to the post. It sucks that he can't shoot. But he's far and away a better player than Campbell and Mulmore. I don't think it's particularly close.

[hoya2x2010]

Nov 18, 2016 0:50:36 GMT -5 hoyaboya said:

Nov 18, 2016 0:48:31 GMT -5 EtomicB said:

Haven't seen the game yet but I agree Jagan shouldn't be taking 6 threes in a game..

However I do see why he's playing, it's due to the fact that he's the best passer on the team.. He had another 5 assist game tonight..

He's by far the best defensive guard and appears to be the only player on the team who knows how to pass to the post. It sucks that he can't shoot. But he's far and away a better player than Campbell and Mulmore. I don't think it's particularly close.

I don't disagree. I'm objecting to his usage, not his minutes. He can fill a role, but scorer isn't that role yet.

[hoyaboya]

Nov 18, 2016 0:53:56 GMT -5 hoya2x2010 said:

Nov 18, 2016 0:50:36 GMT -5 hoyaboya said:

He's by far the best defensive guard and appears to be the only player on the team who knows how to pass to the post. It sucks that he can't shoot. But he's far and away a better player than Campbell and Mulmore. I don't think it's particularly close.

I don't disagree. I'm objecting to his usage, not his minutes. He can fill a role, but scorer isn't that role yet.

Makes sense. I also think sometimes when you're wide open, which he was, you have to shoot or you're hurting your team. But he probably should have stopped trying after 3 or 4 misses. I personally don't think Campbell or Mulmore playing more would have made a difference. But understand where you're coming from, particularly after the 0 for 6.

Regardless, Mosley's got a very bright future IMO. Nice find by the staff...

[tashoya]

Isaac shoots threes and also can't shoot and he's a junior. He also can't play defense or, more specifically, doesn't seem to want to. Feel free to rip the upperclassmen and the coaches but give the new guys a track record to reference.

[MCIGuy]

Nov 18, 2016 0:05:43 GMT -5 95hoya said:

It's his fault for not recruiting talented enough players. If you have followed recruiting, this is no surprise.

I don't buy that. I don't buy that the Hoyas' luck is so bad that their more highly regarded recruits and transfers just turn out to be worse than the lower regarded ones going to Creighton or Butler. So I'm putting the blame on all aspects of coaching in terms of setting a confident, assured and aggressive mentality. The talent is there. It comes down to how that talent is used and sharpened IMO.


I didn't bother to read any post game comments. Is III still saying "WE" got to get better or did he for the first time state that he has to do a better job as coach? LOL> Who am I kidding?

[This Just In]

Nov 18, 2016 0:33:16 GMT -5 michaeldm9 said:

Nov 17, 2016 23:36:37 GMT -5 This Just In said:

Here is the thing if the player hits a shot, makes a block or makes an assist the coach gets credit for drawing up plays or coaching up the player.
Yes players make mistakes, but you can't congratulate a coach when players do well and then exclude the coach when the players make mistakes.
If that was the case then there would never be coaching changes...heck Craig Esherick should still be here then, Esherick was not on the court missing shots,
blowing assignments and turning the ball over.

Esherick Never went to a final 4 or won the Big East

Okay then so winning the Big East and going to a Final Four makes a coach immune to criticism in your eyes?

[blueandgray]

Nov 18, 2016 0:34:29 GMT -5 michaeldm9 said:

So I guess All I am going to get is Rhetoric. No one is going to answer the question what do you do. Ok Lets try this question Who do you Hire as a coach. Who is out there.

I am not sure its fair to have this discussion or to name names in this forum....just my perspective. I also think this discussion is premature ....just my opinion again. In full disclosure, I do have some ties to the program....so there is that. That said, a program can always go with an interim coach (and see how that plays out) until they handpick a successor.