Is it "Mourning" time yet

[justsaying]

With time to fill before we see the team in action again, i just want to mention as we went through a fair amount of the early to mid season with the inconsistencies of intensity especially on defense and to have what appears to be a basketball wise player with intensity and hustle to receive minimum minutes on the playing floor when many a teammate with high minute usage could have used some additional bench instruction themselves is a little puzzling. i'll be one of the first to admit when Mourning was matched against some centers at this time there were some strength issues, but i also surmise that mourning is not a center but a power forward/stretch forward and given that i believe at that position he possibly could have seen a fair amount of advancement going into the next season. Yes we have quite a few forwards on the roster but that goes more to the imbalance of our current roster needing balance. i'm not talking necessarily starter's minutes but i'm talking more consistence minutes. i think mourning and white possess high basketball IQs and next year it would be nice to see those IQs at use for our team along with mourning intensity to help set how to play example. Award some minutes to those characteristics that you want your team to be recognized with.

I'm not into talking lineups but given we are not in the post season what the heck we need sometime to kill the time.

current imbalanced roster (with lack of points - whole different topic); here goes: LJ (1), White(1/2) cope(3) derrickson(4), govan(5) with mourning(4) when derrickson goes to bench or derrickson subs govan.

[Filo]

Is Nostradamus back posting? Anyone get that reference?

[FrazierFanatic]

Mar 16, 2016 7:01:28 GMT -5 Filo said:

Is Nostradamus back posting? Anyone get that reference?

It wasn't him. There was no reference to the vespers half of games.

[beenaround]

I absolutely felt Mourning did not get enough PT this year. Agree he plays smart and with intensity...not sure how many of the "more talented" guys on the team played with more smarts or more intensity. He should play more, period.

[njhoya78]

Mar 16, 2016 14:43:04 GMT -5 beenaround said:

I absolutely felt Mourning did not get enough PT this year. Agree he plays smart and with intensity...not sure how many of the "more talented" guys on the team played with more smarts or more intensity. He should play more, period.

Not trying to be a troll, but whose minutes should be reduced to accommodate more playing time for Mourning?

[hoyasaxa2003]

I actually disagree. It might not be popular to say this, but Mourning was not particularly good this season; certainly not enough to warrant more playing time.

He did have limited playing time, but he wasn't particularly efficient (93.8). His two point shooting was quite good (11-17, .647), though not on threes (1-6), in very limited action. His turnover rate was also pretty high (27.8% of all possessions).

Most importantly, he fouled at a rate of 9.9 fouls per 40 minutes of game time. That means that even if you did give him more time, he likely would have been on the bench a lot anyway because of foul trouble. His rebounding numbers were okay, but not exceptional.

I do think Mourning has a place on team, but until he improves, I think he's largely a backup. I also think that while JT3 used him as a backup center (largely out of necessity), he's really not a center and likely should be a PF more than a center.

All that being said, I really don't think Mourning playing more this season would have made an appreciable difference.

I would add that as poor a season as Copeland had, he still had better numbers overall: more efficient, a better rebounder, far fewer fouls, and substantially fewer turnovers. Derrickson similarly was more efficient, a better rebounder, fouled less (though still a lot), and turned it over slightly less. Any scenario where you play Mourning less would likely involve less time for these two, and I just don't see that helping.

[FrazierFanatic]

This was the first time Trey had any real minutes. He certainly improved over last season. All we can ask is that he keeps working hard, earns more minutes and pushes his teammates to improve.

[bamahoya11]

I like Mourning. He plays with intensity and really was trying out there. On offense he seemed to be competent, but he always looked like a major liability on defense, even on a bad defensive team.

Now, I do think he was one of the only Sophs (besides LJ) to actually improve his game in the off season. He was definitely better this year and more ready for the college game. Another good off season and he can hopefully give us some minutes. I hope he can play the 5 and not just the stretch 4--think we are a bit shallower at the 5 spot than some think, with most of our bigs naturally playing the 4 except for Jessie.

[eagle54]

He absolutely should have played more this year, and when he had to on some occasions due to injuries, he played well. We stuck with a senior lineup that couldn't get it done for no reason when we should have given this year up early when we knew it wasn't working. Let's see how we end up next year but I thought Mourning looked good when called upon but was not given a chance at a great body of work this year. If we had sat DSR earlier we could have let the athletes take over and played a different game and maybe had a different outcome and a brighter future for that matter.

The regulars won't want to hear it but was exactly what was needed.

Waiting for the geniuses to respond to tell me why what we are doing is right on course. It has to be getting tiresome for them but I'm sure they can figure something out.

How's everyone enjoying the excitement of March Madness?

[MCIGuy]

All of this "major liability" talk again from HT Nation. Absolutely ridiculous. Mourning should have taken 5 minutes from Copeland's average this past season. No way was Copeland playing well enough or efficient enough to average 32 minutes a game. And you can believe that with Mourning on the floor he wouldn't be settling for three-pointers for too many of his shots.

[eagle54]

Mar 16, 2016 23:15:33 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

All of this "major liability" talk again from HT Nation. Absolutely ridiculous. Mourning should have taken 5 minutes from Copeland's average this past season. No way was Copeland playing well enough or efficient enough to average 32 minutes a game. And you can believe that with Mourning on the floor he wouldn't be settling for three-pointers for too many of his shots.

MCI, you couldn't be more right.  He looked good when he played which wasn't nearly enough.  Our brilliant staff did nothing to adjust that and our devoted board majority backed that by saying he's not that good.  

Circular logic by them but I appreciate someone who can see it for what it is.  

[hoyasaxa2003]

Mar 16, 2016 23:15:33 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

All of this "major liability" talk again from HT Nation. Absolutely ridiculous. Mourning should have taken 5 minutes from Copeland's average this past season. No way was Copeland playing well enough or efficient enough to average 32 minutes a game. And you can believe that with Mourning on the floor he wouldn't be settling for three-pointers for too many of his shots.

I would not necessarily have had a problem with Mourning playing a bit more. But, keep in mind, one of the reasons why Copeland played so much is because he was basically the only front court player who actually could manage to get through a game without fouling too much (even if he didn't defend well).

These are our players by how many fouls they committed per every 40 minutes:

Copeland: 2.6
Campbell: 2.7
DSR: 2.7
Cameron: 3.3
Peak: 5.7
Derrickson: 5.7
Hayes: 6.0
Govan: 7.0
Johnson: 7.0
Mourning: 9.9
Williams: 15.7

As you'll see Mourning fouled a huge amount, which is a liability on defense, since each of those fouls potentially led to 2 free throws for the opponent. It's not simply about offense, as much as some want to focus on that above all else.

[eagle54]

Mar 17, 2016 0:28:21 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

Mar 16, 2016 23:15:33 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

All of this "major liability" talk again from HT Nation. Absolutely ridiculous. Mourning should have taken 5 minutes from Copeland's average this past season. No way was Copeland playing well enough or efficient enough to average 32 minutes a game. And you can believe that with Mourning on the floor he wouldn't be settling for three-pointers for too many of his shots.

I would not necessarily have had a problem with Mourning playing a bit more. But, keep in mind, one of the reasons why Copeland played so much is because he was basically the only front court player who actually could manage to get through a game without fouling too much (even if he didn't defend well).

These are our players by how many fouls they committed per every 40 minutes:

Copeland: 2.6
Campbell: 2.7
DSR: 2.7
Cameron: 3.3
Peak: 5.7
Derrickson: 5.7
Hayes: 6.0
Govan: 7.0
Johnson: 7.0
Mourning: 9.9
Williams: 15.7

As you'll see Mourning fouled a huge amount, which is a liability on defense, since each of those fouls potentially led to 2 free throws for the opponent. It's not simply about offense, as much as some want to focus on that above all else.

That's way overly simplistic.  Not all fouls equal 2 free throws and many are good fouls. I suppose in this board's overly simplistic world of black and white this matters but again that's this board.  

[GIGAFAN99]

If Hopkins was allowed to "develop" for four years, Mourning should certainly have that chance as well. He's shown nothing but improvement between years and during this season.

[Filo]

Mar 17, 2016 0:34:16 GMT -5 eagle54 said:

Mar 17, 2016 0:28:21 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

I would not necessarily have had a problem with Mourning playing a bit more. But, keep in mind, one of the reasons why Copeland played so much is because he was basically the only front court player who actually could manage to get through a game without fouling too much (even if he didn't defend well).

These are our players by how many fouls they committed per every 40 minutes:

Copeland: 2.6
Campbell: 2.7
DSR: 2.7
Cameron: 3.3
Peak: 5.7
Derrickson: 5.7
Hayes: 6.0
Govan: 7.0
Johnson: 7.0
Mourning: 9.9
Williams: 15.7

As you'll see Mourning fouled a huge amount, which is a liability on defense, since each of those fouls potentially led to 2 free throws for the opponent. It's not simply about offense, as much as some want to focus on that above all else.

That's way overly simplistic.  Not all fouls equal 2 free throws and many are good fouls. I suppose in this board's overly simplistic world of black and white this matters but again that's this board.  

Post deleted. When you stop interjecting vulgar name calling of other posters we'll let your posts stand. This is not your first warning.

[hoyasaxa2003]

Mar 17, 2016 0:34:16 GMT -5 eagle54 said:

Mar 17, 2016 0:28:21 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

I would not necessarily have had a problem with Mourning playing a bit more. But, keep in mind, one of the reasons why Copeland played so much is because he was basically the only front court player who actually could manage to get through a game without fouling too much (even if he didn't defend well).

These are our players by how many fouls they committed per every 40 minutes:

Copeland: 2.6
Campbell: 2.7
DSR: 2.7
Cameron: 3.3
Peak: 5.7
Derrickson: 5.7
Hayes: 6.0
Govan: 7.0
Johnson: 7.0
Mourning: 9.9
Williams: 15.7

As you'll see Mourning fouled a huge amount, which is a liability on defense, since each of those fouls potentially led to 2 free throws for the opponent. It's not simply about offense, as much as some want to focus on that above all else.

That's way overly simplistic.  Not all fouls equal 2 free throws and many are good fouls. I suppose in this board's overly simplistic world of black and white this matters but again that's this board.  

Given how much we foul as a team, generally when Mourning was in the game, we were in the bonus or double bonus. Thus, Mourning's fouls did often lead to free throws. Obviously, offensive fouls (he was called for a number of moving picks) don't yield free throws but they are a turnover so it's still a net negative.

I want Mourning to succeed and I think he's shown some flashes of promise at times. I'm just pointing out that in the limited time he played he did have some problems. Obviously, I would love it it he develops more over the summer and becomes a regular contributor next year.

[SaxaCD]

Mar 17, 2016 0:28:21 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

Mar 16, 2016 23:15:33 GMT -5 MCIGuy said:

All of this "major liability" talk again from HT Nation. Absolutely ridiculous. Mourning should have taken 5 minutes from Copeland's average this past season. No way was Copeland playing well enough or efficient enough to average 32 minutes a game. And you can believe that with Mourning on the floor he wouldn't be settling for three-pointers for too many of his shots.

I would not necessarily have had a problem with Mourning playing a bit more. But, keep in mind, one of the reasons why Copeland played so much is because he was basically the only front court player who actually could manage to get through a game without fouling too much (even if he didn't defend well).

These are our players by how many fouls they committed per every 40 minutes:

Copeland: 2.6
Campbell: 2.7
DSR: 2.7
Cameron: 3.3
Peak: 5.7
Derrickson: 5.7
Hayes: 6.0
Govan: 7.0
Johnson: 7.0
Mourning: 9.9
Williams: 15.7

As you'll see Mourning fouled a huge amount, which is a liability on defense, since each of those fouls potentially led to 2 free throws for the opponent. It's not simply about offense, as much as some want to focus on that above all else.

Holy crap, that's a lot of fouls. More than half the roster averaging fouling out if they played a full game! Sheesh!

[hoyasaxa2003]

Mar 17, 2016 8:49:23 GMT -5 SaxaCD said:

Holy crap, that's a lot of fouls. More than half the roster averaging fouling out if they played a full game! Sheesh!

Yes! It's a huge problem that absolutely must be addressed by the coaching staff in the off season.

[aleutianhoya]

Mar 17, 2016 8:49:23 GMT -5 SaxaCD said:

Mar 17, 2016 0:28:21 GMT -5 hoyasaxa2003 said:

I would not necessarily have had a problem with Mourning playing a bit more. But, keep in mind, one of the reasons why Copeland played so much is because he was basically the only front court player who actually could manage to get through a game without fouling too much (even if he didn't defend well).

These are our players by how many fouls they committed per every 40 minutes:

Copeland: 2.6
Campbell: 2.7
DSR: 2.7
Cameron: 3.3
Peak: 5.7
Derrickson: 5.7
Hayes: 6.0
Govan: 7.0
Johnson: 7.0
Mourning: 9.9
Williams: 15.7

As you'll see Mourning fouled a huge amount, which is a liability on defense, since each of those fouls potentially led to 2 free throws for the opponent. It's not simply about offense, as much as some want to focus on that above all else.

Holy crap, that's a lot of fouls. More than half the roster averaging fouling out if they played a full game! Sheesh!

It really is striking when portrayed like that. We basically had three guys split every available minute at the five (Hayes, Govan, and Mourning), right? Probably just a handful of minutes the entire year that didn't go to one of those three guys. And look at their fouling rates.

[sleepy]

I've been in Mourning for about 6 weeks. Seeing that it's March 17th I guess it's time to foresake the black for Green.