New York Hoyas

[Hilltopper]

It has certainly seemed a given that the Knicks would trade 2 of the 3 Hoyas on the squad (Othella & Dikembe), but the latest on ESPN NBA rumors has Sweetney going to the Bulls in the Jamal Crawford deal (with Jerome going to the Knicks). I think Isiah is trying to rebuild his hometown team, not the team that is paying him.

[nychoya3]

Isaiah has said that he loves Sweetney as a player and would be content to have him start at the 4 this year. I'd be surprised if they actually deal him. He's really the only good, young player on the team, and he has already become very popular with the fans.

[YB]

I agree, seems like Sweets could be a Knick for a while.

I think having Crawford and Marbury on the same team would be self-induced ball-hogging suicide. But that's me.

[Hank Scorpio]

i don't know what Zeke is thinking with these trades/contracts that are being bandied about. Erick Dampier at 9 mill per? Jamal Crawford at 10 mill per? A lot of knicks fans, myself included, were hoping they'd ride it out and be an 8 seed for a couple of more years until Allan Houston's contract came off the books [and Penny, Shandon, etc]. Why i deluded myself into thinking this was possible, i'll never know. i do know that i'd be hard pressed to follow the knicks [especially to pay their outrageous ticket prices] if they trade the only player on the roster i really like.

[the_way]

I agree YB. Nobody wants to be a point guard anymore, everybody wants to be a 2. There are all types of PGs. Jamal at the 2 will hurt the Knicks. I'm still skeptical on Marybury's leadership skills. He really hasn't had team success since being linked with KG at Minnesota.

Isiah was a great ballplayer but he has ruined everything else he has been a part or hasn't had much success. The CBA went defunct with him at the helm, he was a subpar TV analyst, Toronto didn't start winning until after he left as a GM, the Pacers underachieved with him as coach, and the Knicks will do the same with him as the GM.

[MCIGuy]

God, I hope Sweetney is traded. He has blown up in the Southern California Summer Pro League topping his great play with a 24 point/16 rebound effort in a payback win against the LA Clippers. He carried the Knicks to 4 straight wins with absolutely no help from the center position or the three position and with the penciled in starting point guard being too injured to play any of the six games. It would have been five wins straight if the Knicks hadn't blown their lead in their second contest against the Lakers.

Sweets was dominating like Zach Randolph did a couple of years back and NBA experts had begun to take notice. Even the vast majority of the Knick fans, based on what I read on message boards, are elated about him and consider him and Marbury to be the two untouchables. Ha! Too late, Knick fans. Those whiners were on his case when NY drafted him and brushing him off as a bust halfway through his rookie season. A lot of them this summer have been praying to get Rasheed Wallace (which is understandable) and Antoine Walker and Stromille Swift (which is not).

Isiah, be the idiot that I know you are and trade Sweets away in your quest to go after every NBA star that you have no chance of getting. Sweets in Chicago is fine with me. Anywhere but New York!

[YB]

I don't think Chicago is a good destination for Sweets. I think there are better- including Miami (with Shaq), Atlanta (anyone wanna score.... anyone?), Charlotte (he'd be the bomb there) or DC (Hometown boy makes good).

[MCIGuy]

YB said:

I don't think Chicago is a good destination for Sweets. I think there are better- including Miami (with Shaq), Atlanta (anyone wanna score.... anyone?), Charlotte (he'd be the bomb there) or DC (Hometown boy makes good).

Any place is better than playing for the NY franchise.

[YB]

On that we agree absolutely.

Though you have to admit, for all the confusing moves Zeke seems to be trying to make, the team looks a lot better now than it did at the beginning of last year.

I think Charlotte should build with Hoya bigs, bringing Jahidi, Othella, Mike, and Jerome to Carolina. Of course it won't happen, but it would be a great frontline with soem bulk to handle the undersized East.

[1803]

Marbury is the only untouchable on that team. There are certain circumstances that are unique to playing in New York, and they need to be recognized when evaluating the job that anyone is doing running one of their franchises.

The first is that names matter. The fans here want the name players, and the owners use those names to justify the ticket prices.

The second is that the Knicks are never going to be under the cap. The cap is in the low 40 million dollar range, and their payroll for this year alone is $97,135,650.

To put that number into perspective, if you took two horrible contracts off the books, Tim Thomas at 12.9 million, and Penny at 14.6 million, they would still be 25 plus million over the cap. So we can go further, let's say Houston came off the books, that would be another 17.5 leaving them 7.5 million over.

Let's forget the convenient fact that NBA contracts are fully guaranteed, and pretend for a moment that the Knicks could somehow make all of these deals disappear, you would be looking at a starting lineup of Marbury, Kurt Thomas, Shandon Anderson, Sweets and Mutombo, with little to nothing coming off the bench.

This is a twenty win team, and we know that people aren't going to shell out for that. The rule that lets teams go over the cap for their own guys has made the cap irrelevant. Even if you do get under, the incumbent team can always offer more money if they deem him valuable.

Thomas came into a tough spot, and he got a good player in Marbury. That roster was full of bad deals when he got there, does the name Howard Eisley ring a bell? How about Clarence Weatherspoon? Houston should have never gotten the money he did, but they are stuck with him the next three seasons unless someone wants to swap.

I am not saying that he is a great GM, coach or anything else, but that team was in shambles when he got there, and the showed some improvement last season.

[SFHoya99]

If the Knicks were to acquire no new contracts, they would be well under the cap after 2006-2007.

In 2007-2008 (the fourth season from now), they would have Marbury at $20M, and that's basically it. Kurt Thomas was extended, but with only one year left at that time, he's easily tradeable as future cap space.

Otherwise they have NO contracts.

Are you telling me the Knicks can somehow get a substantially better team than they will have over the next three years by acquiring a Dampier or giving anyone a six year deal?

They can have a low-level playoff team with Sweets, Marbury, Allan Houston and Tim Thomas over the next three years. Then they will have the freedom to sign good players.

I have no idea why they wold lock anyone up past three years from now, unless it is someone who can make them a great team.

That's not Jamal Crawford or Erick Dampier.

Isiah will make a bunch more silly mistakes, adding players to ridiculous six year deals, and will still have a mediocre team.

And in three years, he still won't have cap space.

[hoopsmccan]

SFHoya - as a lifelong Knicks fan, amen brother. Unfortunately I know you are right and Thomas will go for a win now approach. Reality is this team can't possible win now - they are not even close to being one or two players away. Even the talent they have is mismatched. Houston, even when healthy, can't create. Marbury doesn't make anybody better. There is no real lowpost threat (no offense to the fifty Hoyas they have on the team). There best front court player, Kurt Thomas is best away from the basket taking short base line jumpers. Sweetney is actually in a good spot because they really need someone who has some size, skill and wants to bang bodies.

Enough with the knicks, they aren't worth my time.

[MCIGuy]

Here's a link to a writeup on how Sweetney and Knicks did in the summer league last week.

www.nba.com/knicks/news/summerheat_SL040719.html



TRADE SWEETNEY