Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2013 15:13:20 GMT -5
3’s offenses have been amongst the most efficient in the nation since he got here. This year is the EXCEPTION not the rule. We have 2 upperclasmen on the whole roster. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out why we struggle at times. It is also the ultimate revisionist history to talk about our offense being the problem when defense has let us down consistently for 4 out of the the last 5 and a half years. Is this conversation based on facts or feelings? Has the offensive efficiency carried us deep into the tournament? And if the defense has been a problem for 4 of the past 5 years (as you state) whose fault/responsibility is it? Is it the coach, the staff or the players that are being recruited or a combination of all? You give credit for the offense but who gets blame for the weak defense and what can/should be fixed? How did Mizzou’s high powered offense work for them in last seasons tourney? A basketball team is the total sum of it’s parts.. If you are deficient in one area that is called a weakness. Weaknesses when exploited can lead to loses. As far as who gets the blame? In my eyes the dumbest thing you can do is take 7 months of season and give a pass fail grade on a program based on 1 game in March.. The last 5 years we’ve had one of the top offenses on occasion and one of the top defenses on occasion. All that says to me is 3 can coach both sides of the ball..
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AltoSaxa
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 1,125
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Post by AltoSaxa on Jan 23, 2013 15:50:26 GMT -5
Has the offensive efficiency carried us deep into the tournament? And if the defense has been a problem for 4 of the past 5 years (as you state) whose fault/responsibility is it? Is it the coach, the staff or the players that are being recruited or a combination of all? You give credit for the offense but who gets blame for the weak defense and what can/should be fixed? How did Mizzou’s high powered offense work for them in last seasons tourney? A basketball team is the total sum of it’s parts.. If you are deficient in one area that is called a weakness. Weaknesses when exploited can lead to loses. As far as who gets the blame? In my eyes the dumbest thing you can do is take 7 months of season and give a pass fail grade on a program based on 1 game in March.. The last 5 years we’ve had one of the top offenses on occasion and one of the top defenses on occasion. All that says to me is 3 can coach both sides of the ball.. Forgive me, I thought you said that our defense let us down 4 out of the past 5 years.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2013 16:03:34 GMT -5
Has the offensive efficiency carried us deep into the tournament? And if the defense has been a problem for 4 of the past 5 years (as you state) whose fault/responsibility is it? Is it the coach, the staff or the players that are being recruited or a combination of all? You give credit for the offense but who gets blame for the weak defense and what can/should be fixed? How did Mizzou’s high powered offense work for them in last seasons tourney? A basketball team is the total sum of it’s parts.. If you are deficient in one area that is called a weakness. Weaknesses when exploited can lead to loses. As far as who gets the blame? In my eyes the dumbest thing you can do is take 7 months of season and give a pass fail grade on a program based on 1 game in March.. The last 5 years we’ve had one of the top offenses on occasion and one of the top defenses on occasion. All that says to me is 3 can coach both sides of the ball.. Forgive me, I thought you said that our defense let us down 4 out of the past 5 years. I did, and it did. What is your point?
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 23, 2013 16:08:26 GMT -5
People don't seem to understand that a single NCAA game in a season doesn't define the entire season. The fact is the offense has generally been very good under John Thompson III. The fact that our defense was putrid against Ohio, or that we lost to Davidson doesn't change that fact.
To some degree, the NCAA tournament is a lot about luck and circumstance, and clearly it hasn't worked out well for us. In 2010, Ohio shot ridiculously against us. In 2011, VCU went wild from three point range, something they did in other tournament games on the way to the Final Four. In 2012, we destroyed a decent Belmont team, and then lost a close game to an NC State team that was probably under-seeded (and we were probably over-seeded).
With the way this team is playing now, I think making the tournament and winning one game is about all that we can expect, unless our play gets more consistent and improves.
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Post by HometownHoya on Jan 23, 2013 17:27:59 GMT -5
With the way this team is playing now, I think making the tournament and winning one game is about all that we can expect, unless our play gets more consistent and improves. Agreed. If this team does get it together and has an excellent run of offensive games during both the BE and NCAA tournament, will everyone be rushing back singing praises of our offense all year? Sure seems like thats what people on this board like to do. This team is young and I have faith that the offense will come around. I am more excited about the excellent defense the past two years because defense wins championships. JTIII is an O coach and if the players are dedicated to strong defense, I believe he will make them perform on O as the season rolls on. I know that we have had some trouble recently as the season gets on but early in JTIII's tenure here we all knew his team would develop and grow as we got closer to March. No reason to think that he lost that ability.
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b52legend
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Posts: 453
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Post by b52legend on Jan 23, 2013 17:40:05 GMT -5
With the way this team is playing now, I think making the tournament and winning one game is about all that we can expect, unless our play gets more consistent and improves. Agreed. If this team does get it together and has an excellent run of offensive games during both the BE and NCAA tournament, will everyone be rushing back singing praises of our offense all year? Sure seems like thats what people on this board like to do. This team is young and I have faith that the offense will come around. I am more excited about the excellent defense the past two years because defense wins championships. JTIII is an O coach and if the players are dedicated to strong defense, I believe he will make them perform on O as the season rolls on. I know that we have had some trouble recently as the season gets on but early in JTIII's tenure here we all knew his team would develop and grow as we got closer to March. No reason to think that he lost that ability. I think our experience over the last few years has tempered expectations for tourney time, but it should also highlight how a team can gel at the right time and go deep. We have seen this first-hand with Davidson and VCU (not to mention Butler's second run to the Final Four). Will that be us -- who knows? But, I am just as ready to say it could be as I am ready to say all we can expect is making the tournament. I have had high expectations dashed over the last few tournaments -- no reason that this year lower expectations can't be exceeded. In 2006, we entered the tournament as a 7 seed, and I still feel we were the second best team in the country at the end of the season.
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,440
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Post by lichoya68 on Jan 23, 2013 21:46:26 GMT -5
We beat nd AND Duke just got walloped by the canes. ALL IS GOOD go hoyas . Lets all be friends and support one hell of a coach and some great young men.
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skyhoya
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
Posts: 2,496
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Post by skyhoya on Jan 24, 2013 11:27:12 GMT -5
one win at a time, L VILLe is next
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NCHoya
Diamond Hoya (over 2500 posts)
Posts: 2,927
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Post by NCHoya on Jan 24, 2013 12:14:36 GMT -5
People don't seem to understand that a single NCAA game in a season doesn't define the entire season. The fact is the offense has generally been very good under John Thompson III. The fact that our defense was putrid against Ohio, or that we lost to Davidson doesn't change that fact. To some degree, the NCAA tournament is a lot about luck and circumstance, and clearly it hasn't worked out well for us. In 2010, Ohio shot ridiculously against us. In 2011, VCU went wild from three point range, something they did in other tournament games on the way to the Final Four. In 2012, we destroyed a decent Belmont team, and then lost a close game to an NC State team that was probably under-seeded (and we were probably over-seeded). With the way this team is playing now, I think making the tournament and winning one game is about all that we can expect, unless our play gets more consistent and improves. It is so true. So many people just look at wins and losses in the NCAAs and judge the program. A one game series has so much volatility it helps to determine nothing. The ironic thing is, with the right match-ups, this team which no sane person would ever say is better than the 2008 or 2010 NCAA teams, could advance further as a double digit seed then either one of those two. And in some people's minds, I think that means this 2013 team is better? That is nonsense.
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Boz
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
123 Fireballs!
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Post by Boz on Jan 24, 2013 12:27:46 GMT -5
I think we should use a modified Caddyshack metric:
"We don't play basketball against other teams for consistent success in the NCAA tournament."
"Well then, how do you judge yourself against other programs?"
"...By length."
;D
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Post by hoyasaxa2003 on Jan 24, 2013 12:46:07 GMT -5
The ironic thing is, with the right match-ups, this team which no sane person would ever say is better than the 2008 or 2010 NCAA teams, could advance further as a double digit seed then either one of those two. And in some people's minds, I think that means this 2013 team is better? That is nonsense. I completely agree. Our 2008 team easily had the talent to make the Final Four, and our 2010 team was very good too (they played great in the Big East Tournament) and easily had the talent to go farther than they did. To be fair, you can criticize those teams (for example, one could say the 2010 team's defense was lacking), but part of it is luck of the draw, too. I have always said that the goal should be to put together the strongest team possible every year, and eventually the NCAA tournament will work itself out in our favor. The NCAA tournament involves a lot luck (seeding, whether you or your opponent get on hot streaks, etc.) and variation that we cannot control. What we can control is the teams we put together and get into the tournament, and John Thompson III has generally done a pretty good job at that.
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idhoya
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by idhoya on Jan 24, 2013 13:06:40 GMT -5
Its part of the reason you schedule a variety of tough teams early in the season, which III does.
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Post by professorhoya on Jan 24, 2013 20:04:21 GMT -5
My feeling is that the offense is working better for a few reasons: (4) DSR's increased role in the offense has also been huge. Again, I think that this has been partially the result of Whittington's absence, but DSR needs to continue to have a larger role in the offense, even when Whittington comes back. DSR is possibly the second best offensive player we have, and he's definitely better on offense than Whittington (not saying on defense or overall, but he has clearly played better on offense). Whittington isn't a threat on offense this year. His outside shot is inconsistent and he is soft driving to the basket. DSR can hit the open 3 and create and attacks the basket. Trawick while not having an outside shot can also attack the basket and is an above the rim player. I think when you have DSR or Trawick in the game this give Porter more room to get open and work with.
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lichoya68
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
OK YOUNGINS ARE HERE AND ARE VERY VERY GOOD cant wait GO HOYAS
Posts: 17,440
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Post by lichoya68 on Jan 24, 2013 22:33:24 GMT -5
true sorta prof but will miss whit on the boards AND his long arms on the front of our press. yup but go TEAM must win.
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