derhoya
Silver Hoya (over 500 posts)
Posts: 584
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Post by derhoya on Dec 8, 2009 13:43:45 GMT -5
More or less a repeat of others, but:
Suh should win. I've never seen a defensive player dominate at any level the way he did against UT. I fear whatever team he'll be playing for on sundays. instant all pro i think. If he stays healthy, he'll be one of the best DTs ever.
Opie (Mccoy) played himself out of the trophy Saturday night while Ingram played his way into it.
voting will go: Ingram, Mccoy, Suh (real close to Mccoy).
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FewFAC
Golden Hoya (over 1000 posts)
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Post by FewFAC on Dec 8, 2009 20:20:39 GMT -5
Aside from the left coast bias against Gerhart -- which is totally illegitamate in my opinion -- I think it's important to think of the opposition. Stanford played the likes of Washington, Washington State, USC, the Oregon Schools and Notre Dame. None of those are imposing defenses and most downright stink. Ingram put up his numbers against the likes of LSU, Tennessee and Florida. I think that is significant. And lastly, yes, even though it's an individual award in a team sport, I do think that winning a conference championship and being undefeated matters. This logic is the main reason I think so poorly of the SEC. Just because the numbers were lower doesn't mean the competition was "better." By that logic I could rightfully say that because it is Stanford, with its academic requirements, their team couldn't recruit players as talented, making the offense/defense separation between the SEC and PAC10 "equal." Of course intellectually easier to just conclude that the Florida defense was not imposing and downright stunk.
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hifigator on Dec 9, 2009 11:18:22 GMT -5
Aside from the left coast bias against Gerhart -- which is totally illegitamate in my opinion -- I think it's important to think of the opposition. Stanford played the likes of Washington, Washington State, USC, the Oregon Schools and Notre Dame. None of those are imposing defenses and most downright stink. Ingram put up his numbers against the likes of LSU, Tennessee and Florida. I think that is significant. And lastly, yes, even though it's an individual award in a team sport, I do think that winning a conference championship and being undefeated matters. This logic is the main reason I think so poorly of the SEC. Just because the numbers were lower doesn't mean the competition was "better." By that logic I could rightfully say that because it is Stanford, with its academic requirements, their team couldn't recruit players as talented, making the offense/defense separation between the SEC and PAC10 "equal." Of course intellectually easier to just conclude that the Florida defense was not imposing and downright stunk. In reverse order ... I'm not going to hijack the thread by responding to an obvious flame. As for academics, certainly someone could use Gerhart's classwork to bolster claims of his resume'. I'm not sure how significant that would be on what is clearly a non-scholastic achievement award. But as a simple matter of respect, it would certainly make sense to acknowledge the true student-athlete in Toby's case. Secondly, at no point did I say or suggest that Ingram's numbers were down because the SEC defenses were so good. I said that his success is all the more to be praised because he played SEC defenses week in and week out. And what cannot be argued is the fact that Gerhart put up his numbers against a schedule that included both Washington schools, both Oregon Schools, USC and Notre Dame. That is 6 pretty crappy defenses -- not because of what he did to them, but because of what everyone did to them. I know you are just trying to start trouble, but at least put up a better effort. For the record, I think Toby is a great back. I also think he deserves the credit he gets. But I must admit that he doesn't have numbers that are superior enough to overlook the level of his opposition.
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Elvado
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 9, 2009 11:27:09 GMT -5
The bigger question is whether little Timmy will wear biblically-themed eye-black appliques to the ceremony. Why was he wearing them indoors at the Georgia Dome? Are they actually absorbent tear-catchers?
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Boz
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123 Fireballs!
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Post by Boz on Dec 9, 2009 11:38:05 GMT -5
I am not going to single out Tebow, I have no problem with his religion (and I'm not really sure why so many people seem to), but this goes for all players.
I'm really surprised the NCAA has not legislated against players writing stuff in silver or white on their eyeblack patches.
There is no functional purpose to wearing eyeblack if you cover it with a light or reflective color. In fact, the silver/white marker on black may be (probably is) worse than wearing nothing at all under your eyes. With no functional value, it essentially becomes a mini-billboard, the equivalent of writing "Born To Kill" on your helmet or something.
I am not one to deny individual expression, but I don't think the NCAA allows other things like this, do they? On players gloves, or wrist/arm guards, etc? (Individually, I mean; obviously, teams are allowed to do stupid things like decorate helmets with stickers of ugly brown chestnuts).
If they do and I'm wrong, I'll stand corrected.
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hifigator on Dec 9, 2009 11:47:21 GMT -5
The bigger question is whether little Timmy will wear biblically-themed eye-black appliques to the ceremony. Why was he wearing them indoors at the Georgia Dome? Are they actually absorbent tear-catchers? Once again, I know that comment is just an attempt to gawk in my direction, but ignoring that part, I don't think anyone really thinks that the eye black is very functional. It is probably marginally behind the breath-rite strips in effectiveness. You and I both know that Tebow presents a personal message with his recognition of a Bible verse indicated on the eye black. So what? I just don't see the hate in this. I'm a Christian, but I'm as sensitive as the next guy when someone tries to "preach to me." If I want to hear a sermon, I will go to church or watch Joel Osteen. But I don't see Tebow's proud recognition of something that he holds so dear to his heart as any kind of affront. In fact, I strongly wonder why others do. I understand the almost tiresome attitude towards what those who don't like the Gators would view as the Tebow lovefest. I get that part. What I don't get is the animosity towards him as a person. Believe me, he is the type of representative that any of us would be 100% proud to have for our Institution of choice -- regardless of whether we are Gators, Hoyas, Sooners or even Noles or Orange. Of course, it's highly unlikely someone of such character would go to FSU or Cuse. Lastly, even if you were trying to be serious, what is the connection between eye black -- claimed to help eliminate glare -- being worn outdoors, where the field is illuminated by artificial lights and indoors, where the field is, "instead," illuminated by artificial lights? Methinks you are just trying to cause trouble.
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Elvado
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 9, 2009 11:50:25 GMT -5
You fail to answer question 3 as to their tear-catching capabilities. I'm all for him loving God. I am in no way in favor of his wearing his religion on his sleeve (and/or face).
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 9, 2009 11:51:07 GMT -5
Probably because, for some people, Tebow's exposition of his piety screams PR campaign and not necessarily something sincere.
Personally, I don't care. I dislike Tebow for the same reason I dislike Jeter -- the media hype is ridiculous and completely overstates how good they are. I suppose if I knew them I would think differently.
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hifigator on Dec 9, 2009 11:55:28 GMT -5
I am not going to single out Tebow, I have no problem with his religion (and I'm not really sure why so many people seem to), but this goes for all players. I'm really surprised the NCAA has not legislated against players writing stuff in silver or white on their eyeblack patches. There is no functional purpose to wearing eyeblack if you cover it with a light or reflective color. In fact, the silver/white marker on black may be (probably is) worse than wearing nothing at all under your eyes. With no functional value, it essentially becomes a mini-billboard, the equivalent of writing "Born To Kill" on your helmet or something. I am not one to deny individual expression, but I don't think the NCAA allows other things like this, do they? On players gloves, or wrist/arm guards, etc? (Individually, I mean; obviously, teams are allowed to do stupid things like decorate helmets with stickers of ugly brown chestnuts). If they do and I'm wrong, I'll stand corrected. I think you bring up an interesting point. In general, I am "against" any of the things that draw attention to the individual, whether it is some decorative adornment or some choreographed routine. But I do think that a non-obtrusive, passive message can't be over the line. I know a lot of players will put their home area code on their eye black. I think that started with the "305" gang, which was historically Miami's area code. In that case, some thought that it was an offense as it was seemingly tied to gang which had done so much harm. I don't know if that was the case, or if the athletes were just identifying with their home area and giving a sort of "shout out" to their family and friends back home. I see nothing wrong with it. Again, I've got to be careful on this, because I really don't think much of the entire "look at me" attitude in a team sport. But like I said, at least in this case, a simple, non-inturusive, passive message in eye black can't, or at least shouldn't be legislated away.
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Elvado
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 9, 2009 11:59:19 GMT -5
I noticed that none of the Alabama players had any self-serving messages stenciled onto their faces. Maybe that's why they won. I seem to remember an old biblical passage about not doing one's praying, fastin, etc in public lest ye lose out on the heavenly rewards. Maybe Tearful Timmy should try that on his eyeblack next time.
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Post by AustinHoya03 on Dec 9, 2009 12:04:46 GMT -5
Probably because, for some people, Tebow's exposition of his piety screams PR campaign and not necessarily something sincere. Personally, I don't care. I dislike Tebow for the same reason I dislike Jeter -- the media hype is ridiculous and completely overstates how good they are. I suppose if I knew them I would think differently. You don't even have to know the guy. If you're fortunate enough to spend 5 or 20 minutes around Tim Tebow, you're better for it. [/Brennaman]
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hifigator on Dec 9, 2009 12:11:03 GMT -5
Probably because, for some people, Tebow's exposition of his piety screams PR campaign and not necessarily something sincere. Personally, I don't care. I dislike Tebow for the same reason I dislike Jeter -- the media hype is ridiculous and completely overstates how good they are. I suppose if I knew them I would think differently. I guess I can see that. But trust me, it's sincere in his case. Again, I think it's yet another of the "winning" ideology. Wait, let me finish. It's not what you think. My point is that no one has much of a problem with Vanderbilt ... because they never win anything. Similarly, "heated rivalries" with the likes of Purdue or Iowa St. are extremely rare -- because they never really win anything. So if Tebow had his Biblical eyeblack every week on a Vandy team that goes 5-7 ... no one would really care. The only reason I mention this, is that that tells me that it really isn't the message itself. Do you agree?
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SFHoya99
Blue & Gray (over 10,000 posts)
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Post by SFHoya99 on Dec 9, 2009 12:13:42 GMT -5
Love that stuff, Austin.
The amazing thing is that every time one of these stars-who-are-great-people screw up, like Kobe or Puckett or whomever, the press acts shocked, then writes the we-shouldn't-be-shocked-they-are-people-I'm-never-worshipping-again article.
They never actually learn.
The best part is comments like this about Tebow are occurring while the whole Tiger thing is going down. Tebow may or may not be a good guy, but a) he's a star athlete, so the odds are against him and b) you can't tell from an interview.
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Elvado
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 9, 2009 12:14:14 GMT -5
Probably because, for some people, Tebow's exposition of his piety screams PR campaign and not necessarily something sincere. Personally, I don't care. I dislike Tebow for the same reason I dislike Jeter -- the media hype is ridiculous and completely overstates how good they are. I suppose if I knew them I would think differently. I guess I can see that. But trust me, it's sincere in his case. Again, I think it's yet another of the "winning" ideology. Wait, let me finish. It's not what you think. My point is that no one has much of a problem with Vanderbilt ... because they never win anything. Similarly, "heated rivalries" with the likes of Purdue or Iowa St. are extremely rare -- because they never really win anything. So if Tebow had his Biblical eyeblack every week on a Vandy team that goes 5-7 ... no one would really care. The only reason I mention this, is that that tells me that it really isn't the message itself. Do you agree? The problem is not the message itself. Who could quibble with a kid feeling a devotion to scripture? It is the medium. I don't want to read the Bible on Tim's face, just as I don't want to hear boxers thank God for helping them win.
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hifigator on Dec 9, 2009 12:18:44 GMT -5
I noticed that none of the Alabama players had any self-serving messages stenciled onto their faces. Maybe that's why they won. I seem to remember an old biblical passage about not doing one's praying, fastin, etc in public lest ye lose out on the heavenly rewards. Maybe Tearful Timmy should try that on his eyeblack next time. While your extra attention is unwarranted and unwelcome in Tim's case, you do accidentally make a profound point. The game was "lost" leading up to it. I'm not in a position to go into too many details due to confidence, but Dunlap was not alone at that birthday party. In fact, there were at least 6 others starters/prominent players there enjoying the event. I don't know exactly who drank exactly how much, but it doesn't really matter. A Monday night ... then becoming a Tuesday morning just 5 days before the biggest game of the year is NOT the time to be enjoying yourself. Added to this, is the fact that the Tuesday practice is the toughest of the bunch. In ANY week, that wasn't the time to be partying. I'm not a hypocrite and I understand that 20 year old kids will and should enjoy themselves within reason. But that wasn't the time or the place and it showed on the field on Saturday. As for your memory of the parable, I think you are using quite a bit of interpretive freedom. The point was that you don't worship for the point of illustrating your own "religiosity." But again, I think you know this and are just trying to cause trouble.
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Elvado
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by Elvado on Dec 9, 2009 12:22:43 GMT -5
So it's a reach to say don't print devotionals on your face? Please. He could love God just as much without his eye makeup.
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Post by williambraskyiii on Dec 9, 2009 12:34:26 GMT -5
I noticed that none of the Alabama players had any self-serving messages stenciled onto their faces. Maybe that's why they won. I seem to remember an old biblical passage about not doing one's praying, fastin, etc in public lest ye lose out on the heavenly rewards. Maybe Tearful Timmy should try that on his eyeblack next time. While your extra attention is unwarranted and unwelcome in Tim's case, you do accidentally make a profound point. The game was "lost" leading up to it. I'm not in a position to go into too many details due to confidence, but Dunlap was not alone at that birthday party. In fact, there were at least 6 others starters/prominent players there enjoying the event. I don't know exactly who drank exactly how much, but it doesn't really matter. A Monday night ... then becoming a Tuesday morning just 5 days before the biggest game of the year is NOT the time to be enjoying yourself. Added to this, is the fact that the Tuesday practice is the toughest of the bunch. In ANY week, that wasn't the time to be partying. I'm not a hypocrite and I understand that 20 year old kids will and should enjoy themselves within reason. But that wasn't the time or the place and it showed on the field on Saturday. As for your memory of the parable, I think you are using quite a bit of interpretive freedom. The point was that you don't worship for the point of illustrating your own "religiosity." But again, I think you know this and are just trying to cause trouble. What is this Varsity Blues? You are a fkn joke Hifi....you are making excuses for the Gators getting drilled due to a little revelry FIVE DAYS prior to a football game? That is beyond rich...keep rippin those bingers hifi -- the hurt won't last forever..."gator nation" will survive.
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tlphoya
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
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Post by tlphoya on Dec 9, 2009 13:51:31 GMT -5
Mr. SUH.
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TBird41
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
"Roy! I Love All 7'2" of you Roy!"
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Post by TBird41 on Dec 9, 2009 14:08:49 GMT -5
I have to say that I'm disappointed in everyone who has indicated that they would vote for Ndamukong Suh. Not b/c I disagree with your choice, but for your failure to mention the fact that his first name means "House of Spears". Come on people. I have no problem with "A Boy Named Suh" jokes, but it's just unacceptable that no one has worked in a House of Spears reference. I mean, his name is so bad ass that if Suh played Florida, Tebow would start crying BEFORE the game. Heck, his name is so intimidating that Tebow is crying because he has to be in the same room with him for the Heisman ceremony.
We're* better than that.
*This pronoun refers to the group of people on this board that are associated with Georgetown in some way and are not people that came to the board to talk about a team playing Georgetown in 2006 and have not left.
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hifigator
Platinum Hoya (over 5000 posts)
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Post by hifigator on Dec 9, 2009 14:15:38 GMT -5
Brasky added to his resume' with these words of idiocy:
What is this Varsity Blues? You are a fkn joke Hifi....you are making excuses for the Gators getting drilled due to a little revelry FIVE DAYS prior to a football game?
You're clueless. At no point was I making any kind of excuse. My point was that for whatever reason, the team didn't get ready to play as they should have. And it showed on Saturday, plain and simple. For you to even suggest that I was making excuses shows either your total lack of intellectual ability or you insistent dedication to simply trying to give me sh!t. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on this one.
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