Why is the media still biased against this team?

[HopefulHoya]

I usually am not one to post on message boards, but as a long time follower of the program, I’ve had some thoughts I wanted to get off my chest about this season so far and expectations for the rest of the year. Firstly, this constant talk about Georgetown on the bubble by almost every media outlet is completely uninformed and reveals a large bias against the team as a result of mistaken preseason predictions. If Georgetown continues to play the way it has the past two months, and there is no reason to think this won't happen, the only uncertainty is where we will be seeded. Is it possible the team loses the rest of its games? Anything is possible, but to declare teams like Pitt or Villanova as locks and Georgetown as needing to help itself off the bubble is just not reputable journalism. Its as if it seems there is some general expectation this team will fade, while other teams will continue to play the way they have all year. Moreover, Pitt's at large candidacy right now cannot be considered better than Georgetown's (I could digress further if anyone disagrees with this statement). I think people need to stop worrying about getting into the tournament, and enjoy a wonderful season that has a very good chance of getting better. We as fans should be talking about how 4-1 down the stretch is anything but unthinkable, and how the team should make some noise in the Big East tournament. While 2-3 down the stretch will get us into the tournament, I for one would be disappointed if we lost to both Villanova and ND. The team has played too good this year to end the conference season like that.

While I am more than somewhat pleasantly surprised by the way the season has progressed, I cannot say I am shocked. I saw Jeff Green play this summer and more than hold his own against NBA players. Why this kid was such a secret, even entering the season, is beyond me because any person who saw him play could see he was going to be an absolute beast. The other difference in this year’s team has been the play of Ashanti Cook. As a freshman, Cook showed glimpses of his talent, but was improperly used last year as a traditional point guard. The combination of his development as a player and better utilization has not surprisingly led to better results.

JTIII is without a doubt an excellent coach. But he is not the miracle worker that the media seems to be making him out to be. Players play the game. Without talent, there is no way this team could have done as well as it has. This team has genuine talent despite what supposed college basketball analysts may say. A future lottery pick, a borderline second round pick, and a solid college guard in Cook should lead a team to the tournament. I think what we are surprised by this year is that talent finally seems to be realized in the win column. What was frustrating about the Esherick era was that the team had the talent to be a tournament team every year Sweetney was there, but never seemed able to put it together his sophomore and junior years.

[HoyaSox04]

HopefulHoya said:

Moreover, Pitt's at large candidacy right now cannot be considered better than Georgetown's (I could digress further if anyone disagrees with this statement).

While I do believe in my heart that we are a better team than Pitt, when the committee starts its selection process, big points will be given to Pitt for their 2 HUGE comeback wins against 'Cuse and UConn. Just saying that those wins are as big as any of the Hoyas wins, so I'm not sure I agree that Pitt has a worse profile than we do.

[SFHoya99]

HoyaSox430 said:

While I do believe in my heart that we are a better team than Pitt, when the committee starts its selection process, big points will be given to Pitt for their 2 HUGE comeback wins against 'Cuse and UConn. Just saying that those wins are as big as any of the Hoyas wins, so I'm not sure I agree that Pitt has a worse profile than we do.

Worse RPI, worse SOS, and only the UConn win was on the road. The Cuse win at home doesn't mean nearly as much to the committe because of home court advantage -- and especially Pitt's extreme home court advantage.

We have wins at Pitt and at Villanova, a higher RPI and SOS. Our profile is better right now. Pitt has a harder schedule down the stretch, so they have a chance to make up ground, but right now, our profile is better.

People call Pitt a lock and us a bubble, because they think Pitt will win its games down the stretch and GU won't.

[MEGAFAN]

Welcome to the board and congrats on your first post! I imagine you have been a "lurker" for some time, but it's great to see that your first post on this board is so insightful, well informed and balanced. It's always good to have additional knowledgeable and enthusiastic fans.

About the media's apparent inability to give credit to the Hoyas - well, this is typical, and will surely disappear after a couple years of being back in the hunt for an at-large birth (and maybe a BET Championship or two.) I am equally frustrated by the media's inability to appreciate not only our program, but our players (Bowman and Green should both be POY and First-team candidates in the BE, despite being long-shots). Despite my general agreement that being consistenly top-25 is great for $$$, recruiting, brand-recognition, etc., I kinda love our under-the-radar status, and hope that we play the underdog for the rest of this season, even in the Big Dance, as next year we could very well be a pre-season top 10 team with a huge target on our chest.

Furthermore, while I love all the press that JT III is getting (and deserves), I do wish that the media and general public recognized that no matter how great a coach is, you cannot make an omelette without eggs (and I must strongly disagree with the statements made by JT stating that we have little talent - clearly an attempt to prevent undue criticism from falling on his son). Along the lines of what you referenced and what was perhaps slightly overstated by Gigafan, this team has more talent than most are willing to admit, and it is the combination of strong coaching, new talent and the maturing of Bowman and Cook that have come together to result in a surprisingly strong season.

Believe me, as many of you know, I am and have always been a HUGE JT III fan. But, as I mentioned before, the players play the game, and they deserve much of the credit. I have always believed that despite the importance of X's and O's, recruiting and such, a coaches most important job is as a motivator. JT clearly had it. His strength was as a communicator and a leader. JT III clearly has this intangible element, and may even prove to be a superior X's and O's guy than his father. (Caution: Remember that defense is also part of the scheme, and while we have played incrementally stronger D this season, when people claim that JT was not a great tactician, they often fail to forget that his Hoyas always played amazingly tough D.)

It was as a leader and motivator that I think Esh really struggled. While many were flabergasted by some of his in-game decisions and what not, I think it is unfair to attribute everything that went wrong with Georgetown to Esh, 'cause let's face it, it helps to have an amazing freshman in Jeff Green and a 7' 2" Roy Hibbert, as well as some key upperclassmen to lead the team. Granted, Esh had Sweets (arguably a better or equal talent to JG), and by no means am I excusing him for some of his bad decisions and ridiculous statements, but let's just focus on how great this TEAM is, including the Coach, but with a fair eye on all the factors that play a role in our success.

LET'S GO HOYAS!!! NIX NOTRE DAME!

[EasyEd]

Another element where JTIII has been doing wonders is in his substitution patterns that change depending on the game situation and the opposition. Many have commented how they hate to seen Reed or someone else in there playing, but look at the success he has had with his use of players. He's gotten good duty from Crawford, AKD, and others, seems to know exactly how long to play Hibbert, and seems to have a great knack of having the right people on the court. In addition to Xs and Os, that's a great part of coaching.

[Big Dog]

Mega, you're clueless. The maturation of Bowman and Cook you're talking about would never have happened if Mr. E was still running things. This exact roster, this season under Esherick would have finished 11th in the Big East. We'd be so far under .500 right now this board would have one-fifth the daily traffic it currently does.

Keep making excuses for the 7 year debacles that left Georgetown hoops in tatters.

[MEGAFAN]

You're right. And after thinking about the issue of how much of this year's success is coaching, I hope everyone understands that I think that JT III is doing an absolutely wonderful job. IMHO, he is the leading candidate for COY in the BE, and depending upon what we are able to accomplish going forward, should be considered for the National Coach of the Year Award. I just wanted to reiterate that, in case anyone out there was mis-interprets my main point from above. I would not go as far as Gigafan in my evaluation of Esh vs. JT III, but I would say that just as we are fortunate to have a VERY good coach in JT III, this doesn't necessitate Esh being the worst coach in the history of the sport, as many here have inferred. Rather, if we consider Esh as a sub-mar / medium coach, it makes JT III all that more impressive.

LET'S GO HOYAS!!! NIX NOTRE DAME!

[Big Dog]

If our only remaining disagreement is therefore over just how bad a coach Esherick really was, I'm comfortable letting that debate go. But, man, was he bad.

[TBird41]

I have to agree with Big Dog. I think this team would be in the bottom of the BE w/ Esherick at the helm. How many close games have we won this year that we wouldn't have last year? How bout EVERY SINGLE ONE.

JT3 brings poise, leadership, motivation and better X's and O's to this team. We actually have an offense, inbounds plays, and a defense. The difference is clear.

That being said, the players still deserve a lot of credit. They've improved vastly over the course of the season and are doing a superb job.

[MEGAFAN]

Big said:

Mega, you're clueless. The maturation of Bowman and Cook you're talking about would never have happened if Mr. E was still running things. This exact roster, this season under Esherick would have finished 11th in the Big East. We'd be so far under .500 right now this board would have one-fifth the daily traffic it currently does.

Keep making excuses for the 7 year debacles that left Georgetown hoops in tatters.

My post above stating "You're right" was actually in response to the post prior to yours, but funny enough, maybe it applies to your post as well, if you thought I was saying what I think you thought I was saying. But, as is sometimes the case, especially in virtual dialogue's, I don't think you realize that I'm not trying to make excuses for the last 7 years of Hoya Hoops. Well, maybe I was implicitly, but my main point was not to defend Esh, but to give more credit to the players, and to the effect that change for the sake of change itself can have. I certainly agree that further development of Cook clearly can be in large part attributed to JT III and his system, but my main point is that JT III has the one ingredient that Esh and many others are missing, the ability to be a true motivator and leader, the intangible quality that separates average coaches from great coaches.

I also think that JT III has brought an entirely renewed energy to Hoya Basketball, in almost every way imagineable, from the team itself, to recruiting, to marketing, to MCI Center turnout, enthusiasm, etc. But, I think this is because he realized that Georgetown Basketball needed a 180 degree turn from the direction it was going, and he was able to see this, coming from outside the program, etc.

Now, this is not to excuse Esh, but the entire Program was in denial of the types of systemic changes that needed to take place in order to be consistently competitive in today's college bball landscape. But let's not forget we went to the Sweet 16 in 2001, and that there were a lot of unlucky breaks that occurred over the past few years. Now, as the saying goes, "the more I practice, the luckier I get" could perhaps be applied to underscore that our continuous bad breaks with players leaving, losing close games, etc. were perhaps not purely attributable to chance, BUT, there is a snowball effect that can take place, and whereby losing breeds losing breeds losing mentality. Luckily we were able to break away from this before it was too late. Some thought it was, and others think that there was no reason to fall so far, but let's just be happy we are here now.

Thoughts???

LET'S GO HOYAS!!! NIX NOTRE DAME!

[SirSaxa]

If i can summarize, I think we all agree the biggest change from last year to this is the addition of T3. But we also need to give the players a lot of credit. Giving them credit does not mean that anyone believes they would have done as well with the old coach. It is simply giving them credit and they deserve it. There is plenty of credit to share and I am sure T3 would be delighted to see his kids getting plenty!

so Mega, Giga and Big Dog -- I think you guys can chill a bit and realize there's plenty of credit to go around. Not one of you claimed this team would be as good with the old coach.

one FACT that cannot be denied, other than Wallace, the entire team is here because of Esh. He deserves credit for that. Would they have performed as well this year if he were the coach? That is a subjective question that cannot be definitively answered/proven, but I -- like you guys -- don't believe for one instant that our season would remotely resemble what has happened.

Green has been a FABULOUS addition.

But IMHO, the biggest change since last year has been T3. And that's great, because sooner or later Jeff will depart, but T3 can stay here for a VERY long time!

[MEGAFAN]

Well done! And I agree that JT III is the single most important factor to our success, especially if your looking at this change from a long-term perspective.

But boy oh boy, JG is da man!

LET'S GO HOYAS!!! NIX NOTRE DAME!

[HopefulHoya]

Does anyone really believe though that JTIII could have made last year's squad a .500 BE team? Esherick may not have been a great game coach, but the lack of any size on that team last year put the team at a huge disadvantage. To go from Courtland Freeman as your center to Jeff Green would make any new coach look like a genius

[Nevada Hoya]

I think the media, given our record last year and no acclaim at all in the pre-season, are thinking that we are doing this all with mirrors. Maybe they would be more impressed with blowouts, but they seem hard to come by in the BE this year. We have to continue to prove them wrong, as we play out the string. And, of course, the WP is always going to favor the Twerps, if all things are pretty equal. It has always been that way, except maybe when the Hoyas won it all. But it was true 40 years ago.

[Fan Of The Game]

HopefulHoya said:

Does anyone really believe though that JTIII could have made last year's squad a .500 BE team? Esherick may not have been a great game coach, but the lack of any size on that team last year put the team at a huge disadvantage. To go from Courtland Freeman as your center to Jeff Green would make any new coach look like a genius

I'll bite.

We went 4-12 in the Big East last year. Let's assume we would have won the games we won.

I think it's very possible that we also could have held our second half lead against Boston College (instead of losing 72-64), won at home against Syracuse (instead of losing 57-54), and at home against Virginia Tech (instead of losing 60-55). I also think he wouldn't have let us lose to such terrible teams as St. John's and at Virginia Tech.

Win four of those five and we're .500 in the Big East.

I think we would have been better prepared, beaten the teams we "should have" beaten, and won the close ones that we lost.

[Big Dog]

I absolutely agree. Last year would have turned out far different.

[Cambridge]

Just let JTIII milk the underdog card a little longer. I'm sure that disrespect helps to fuel players like Bobo, cook, green and hibbs. Worked for the pats.

[tgo]

with the talent we have on this team everyone, myself included, figured we would be hoping for a home NIT game at seasons end. People who predicted a 500 big east finish were laughed off the board in September. Even in Megafanland we were not anywhere near the tourney this year.

Coaching has been the difference plain and simple.

FOTG is right on that JTIII would have won most of those games he mentioned from last year and winning begets winning so we could play woulda coulda all day but those few games could have led to more wins due to better preparation and confindence.
There is more talent this year than everyone thought because of the coach and the system. The talent at the begining of the year was thought to be low but building with a freshman heavy team and bowman and ashanti who hadnt reached potential.
let me say again coaching has been the difference in that we now think of this as a talented team on the rise not a rebuilding year that will hopefully bear fruit in the future. if you say you thought this team was talented in September you are lying.

[Deleted]

I honestly thought we'd go 6-10 in the BE this year, and was hoping we'd go to the NIT, and see some improvement throughout the year.

I am STUNNED at where we stand right now. Coach is the Man.