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Post by Rome is Burning on Nov 10, 2004 19:42:36 GMT -5
DO YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE TRUTH? FUNNY HOW ANY THREADS THAT STATE FACTS THAT UNFAVORABLY PORTRAY COACHES AND ATHLETIC DEPARTMENT ARE EDITED, REMOVED OR LOCKED.
It's ok though you just keep sticking your head in the sand and Benson will just keep driving the program further into the ground. This pathetic record will serve as a self fulfilling prophesy - no one will come to play here with the records we are putting up and the way the staff handles the players. I equate you and your ilk to the band on the Titanic- just keep playing fellas cuz your ship is sinking and you are going down with it.
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Post by Admin on Nov 10, 2004 19:44:35 GMT -5
Read the rules. No personal attacks on players or coaches, period.
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Post by Rome is Burning on Nov 10, 2004 20:09:09 GMT -5
Defining a personal attack to include legitimate criticism of a coaches decision renders all criticism out of bounds. This situation is censonship on a very slippery slope.
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Post by ByStander on Nov 11, 2004 12:01:00 GMT -5
I observe the postings off and on due to my interest in Georgetown Sports. I have noted that postings which are critical of coaches do not seem to be tolerated by the Administration. I would remind all that the Board states that it was established to provide a "forum for intelligent discourse" as well as for "critical thinking and debate". The censorship of legitimate critizism seriously damages the credibility of every entry on the Board. We students at Georgetown are told that we are the "best and brightest" and the future leaders. Debate and dissent are "institutionalized" here. It is sad day when censorship replaces our long standing traditions. With that said, in so far as the coaching staff of the football program is concerned, they have not demonstrated that they should remain and therefore be our "representatives". The burden of persuasion is not that of showing that they should be removed--but more importantly should be placed on these individuals to clearly demonstrate why they should be permitted to remain. Why should we hold the football program to a lower standard than that of the basketball time.? Any comments would be appreciated.
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LBPop
Bulldog (over 250 posts)
Still proud...always proud
Posts: 276
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Post by LBPop on Nov 11, 2004 13:32:47 GMT -5
Personally, I'm glad that someone is paying attention to what is posted on this board, but I'm glad I'm not the one who has to do it. I don't know which specific posts have been deleted, but I guess the line gets drawn something like this:
"The coach made a bad call"--Not personal and OK "The coach made a stupid call"--Borderline, but probably OK "The coach is stupid"--Personal, unnecessary and better saved for face to face conversation.
I've already publicly have stated my high regard for Coach Benson. I don't think this year's performance is his fault--but it certainly is his responsibility. I sincerely believe we will see some significant changes in the off season.
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Post by bystander on Nov 11, 2004 15:24:31 GMT -5
Thanks for the reply. The 'problem' is that pointing out the team record (3 wins, 29 losses in the PL) also appears to be now an 'inappropriate' critizism. Coach Benson made many promises over the last 5 years. However, after each season of failure there has been a different explanation of "why". Most often there has been a sacrificial lamb (aka scape goat) which accompanies each post-season explanation. I understand that this year's goat is to be the special teams. The man's credibility is gone. The only support that remains is either the very "long gone" players (Maac league) or those that are new and have not really had the Georgetown football "experience". Georgetown recruited the same players as were being solicited by the Ivy League schools. Georgetown got "its share" of these people. No one at Georgetown is used to losing. The football program has become used to losing. I would again ask you to explain why we should continue to hold our football program to a level of performance which is signifigantly less that the level that we hold our basketball program or much less our own personal level of academic performance. Many players quit out of frustration. A comparison of season rosters shows that Georgetown has the lowest retention rate of "senior level" (and thereby the most experienced and 'adult') players in the league. The interaction between the coaches and the players (its' public folks; all you have to do is show up and watch) is quite revealing. Again, it is not up to either the students nor the alumni to establish that the coaching staff needs to 'move on' BUT the burden is upon this staff to show why they should stay. Having a personal high regard for Mr. Benson can not translate into he is "up to the job at hand". Assuming that you have your own business--could you survive on a 10% success rate? I think not. Thank you for your time.
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Post by HoyaAlum on Nov 12, 2004 12:18:55 GMT -5
Ok, I have held back responding as I read the posts but can't help it after many inaccurate posts by people that obvioulsy don't have the facts straight. First of all to compare football to basketball is a joke! Basketball if fully funded football is not. The coaches are the lowest paid of the Patriot and IVY league -wonder why there have been four OCs in four years? They have no facilities - no locker room, no stadium, little support - compared to the PL teams and IVY they play and recruit against it is a joke- that is in terms of facilities, financial aid pacakages, coaching salaries, overall support etc.... Of course it is easy to be upset and frustrated with how the team is doing. But to start comparing it to a fully funded program is a joke. They don't have the players that they need and won't get them untill they get the support that they need to run a football program. Yes they have some great players - a tribute to the coaches and their recruiting abilities but they don't have enough of the great players to compete agains these teams that have a full line of great players. Why don't you give them the support and fully fund football like the other teams they play and then see how they do. If they can't find success then maybe it is time for a change.
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Post by upstarts fan on Nov 12, 2004 12:46:58 GMT -5
rumor has it that our 'coach' makes $250K/yr. Don't blame the players. One of the few games that they won (Bucknell) happened because they made up their own play rather than follow the call by Benson. Who does not have the facts now?
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Post by TrueHoyaBlue on Nov 12, 2004 14:25:27 GMT -5
I'd find that hard to believe, since the entire head coaching budget for men's sports is under $1M for about 16 people, (11 full-time equivalents). It's safe to say that men's hoops takes a big chunk of that, and I would be shocked if Benson's pay was over 100K. $250K in total coaching salaries for football? Maybe, but there's a slim chance in hell that that's the HC salary.
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Post by OhioHoya 3 on Nov 12, 2004 14:59:34 GMT -5
Its true. His current contract is for $1.2 mil over 5 years.
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Post by HoyaAlum on Nov 12, 2004 16:40:51 GMT -5
I know for a FACT that is not true - you all are full of BS... why don't you do some research before you make comments like that - they are the most underpaid coaching staff in the patriot and Ivy league - what a joke you all are
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Post by OhioHoya 3 on Nov 12, 2004 16:43:59 GMT -5
Then give me some numbers... Whatcha got pal?
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Post by HoyaAlum on Nov 12, 2004 17:36:14 GMT -5
Benson is the lowest paid coach in the Patriot and IVY league. No patriot league or Ivy head coach even makes $250!! The full time coaches at Georgetown get paid what the part time coaches at the other schools at least $150. Benson is below $100.
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Post by Rome is Burning on Nov 13, 2004 14:53:45 GMT -5
Before this new contract of Benson's his previous one was 1M over 5 years, I will never forget reading that and being completely dumbfounded. It was in the Washington Post, I think 250K a year is right on target and unless you (HoyaAlum) are his wife or the person cutting him checks how can you be so smug and sure?
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Post by Rome is Burning on Nov 13, 2004 15:01:46 GMT -5
Beyond that what does his salary have to do with NOT WINNING IN THE PATRIOT LEAGUE! Don't even think about feeding me that "best coach we can afford" nonsense either because that arguement will fall on deaf ears
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Post by HoyaAlum on Nov 13, 2004 21:16:03 GMT -5
Why don't you address the facts - Winning in the patriot league does not happen overnight especially when you don't get the support. yes it has been a few years but what do you expect. Support them and maybe they will be able to compete. They are not fully funded- I am not even talking about coaching salaries although that is an issue. They don't have nearly the same amount of financial aid packages as the other patirot league schools for starters. And there is no need to be so obnoxious - I finally decided to write on this because I was sick of randomly going on and reading posts from people like you who have nothing better to do than talk bad about georgetown football.
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DanMcQ
Moderator
Posts: 30,518
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Post by DanMcQ on Nov 14, 2004 9:29:29 GMT -5
Arguing about what the coach's salary is or isn't is pretty much groundless because there are no objective facts to base the argument on. The only objective data publicly available is on the guhoyas.com site. This makes it pretty clear that, with both the men's basketball and football head coaches included in the total numbers, there is no way the football coach could be making anywhere near 250K annually without the other sport's head coaches making peanuts (20K at most). That is pretty unlikely.
On another point, support for and criticism against the current coaching staff can be made WITHOUT all the personal invective aimed at the staff and other posters. Anything over the line will be edited and threads locked if they don't respect the simple rules of the forum.
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